donk52
Member
That's my 669 slide. It's ok.
S&W Model 52-2, failure to fire quite often.
- Thread starter mikemyers
- Start date
That's my 669 slide. It's ok.
Sorry to jump in here. I've been watching this thread since it's beginning since I also have a 52 and am trying to learn. I know mikemyers is trying to get his 52 working properly but this last photo of his slide caused me to remove my slide and photo the same area. Mine looks like his and works great. I'm probably missing something? Again I apologize for the interruption.
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Don, I have lots of magazines. I have a simpler solution.
I can slowly start removing material from the magazine where it is hitting the "Ejector and Magazine Depresser". Or I can modify that part. Or I can send the gun to Dave Salyer, who can probably fix it correctly, somehow. I think it's way over my head.
I'll try it tomorrow - who knows, maybe it will now work. If not, I can box it up, or just use it for a training gun.
Yikes. Bummer......... I thought there would be a fix......
I can slowly start removing material from the magazine where it is hitting the "Ejector and Magazine Depresser". Or I can modify that part. Or I can send the gun to Dave Salyer, who can probably fix it correctly, somehow. I think it's way over my head.
I'll try it tomorrow - who knows, maybe it will now work. If not, I can box it up, or just use it for a training gun.
Yikes. Bummer......... I thought there would be a fix......
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donk52
Member
I wouldn't modify a magazine. If you have someone to look at it I would. Maybe the plunger is twisting in the hole. Try shooting and see.
Hi, please jump in here as much as you would like! The more people, the better. Not often that we find someone like Don to help understand these old guns. Your photo is better than mine - much more clear.
Don, I don't think that's a hairline crack, maybe a hair? Here's a new photo, throwing some light on it....
.....and lots more hairs. I need to brush the parts off better.
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Dan, it would be interesting if you were to press on the back of your firing pin, and see how smoothly it moves in and out, both without a magazine, and with.
Works well with & w/o the mag. Good resistance with just a hint of drag as I push in or release.
donk52
Member
I wondering if that's normal, I've been going by my 9mm slides that don't have that hole cut through. The ejector lever might be twisting the plunger, seems like that could be something. In your post #183 pic, does the ejector lever rest on the outside of the magazine lip when you press down on it?
I know this question is intended for mike but I'm showing mine as a point of reference. I have 5 mags and they all hit the same place - the top of the mag lip as seen in the pics.
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How about with the mag? Still totally free "with just a hint of drag"?
I hope to try the gun out tomorrow, and see if it has improved from all this work. Hopefully "good resistance with just a hint of drag" will allow it to fire normally, one shot after another.
(I still need to find out what the guy said he had to file on the safety.......)
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Yep, works the same with or w/o the mag.
Hope yours works tomorrow.
Hope yours works tomorrow.
Jim Watson
Member
To quote a usually reliable source (Me!) the ejector is the magazine disconnect, so if you take much off either the magazine or the ejector, the hammer will cease to fall.
Right.
Well, I'm running out of time, as I have a trip coming up. I'll take it to the range today, and see if it's working better. If not, there is a new firing pin and a new safety in the mail, and since the previous guy working on it started filing something off on the safety, I don't know what he did, or why. Maybe they are involved in this puzzle, although I don't see how they could be.
There's no urgency, as I have my own Model 52 which works fine. This new gun is quite useful just as it was, as tells me clearly if I'm disturbing the sights when I fire - just like a ball and dummy drill, never knowing if it will fire. If it goes 'click', and I see the sights were disturbed, I did something wrong. This "movement" never happens when I know the gun is empty.
What I think I've learned from Don and the rest of the participants here, is that the firing pin needs to be perfectly free to move back and forth. Without a magazine in place, it is perfect. With a magazine, something is interfering with the pin and spring. It's no longer smooth, it's "rough".
The top of my list of questions is why the firing pin should behave any differently with or without a magazine in place. I'll try it today with a brand new Model 52 Magazine, eliminating one more variable.
Maybe later today, I will write up on a piece of paper what exactly happens when a magazine is inserted. Which parts move, and in what order. Maybe I can get a clue as to which part is interfering with the firing pin and spring.
There's no urgency, as I have my own Model 52 which works fine. This new gun is quite useful just as it was, as tells me clearly if I'm disturbing the sights when I fire - just like a ball and dummy drill, never knowing if it will fire. If it goes 'click', and I see the sights were disturbed, I did something wrong. This "movement" never happens when I know the gun is empty.
What I think I've learned from Don and the rest of the participants here, is that the firing pin needs to be perfectly free to move back and forth. Without a magazine in place, it is perfect. With a magazine, something is interfering with the pin and spring. It's no longer smooth, it's "rough".
The top of my list of questions is why the firing pin should behave any differently with or without a magazine in place. I'll try it today with a brand new Model 52 Magazine, eliminating one more variable.
Maybe later today, I will write up on a piece of paper what exactly happens when a magazine is inserted. Which parts move, and in what order. Maybe I can get a clue as to which part is interfering with the firing pin and spring.
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donk52
Member
When the magazine is inserted, it moves the ejector lever up, and at the same time it pushes the ejector lever plunger and spring farther into the slide. This plunger rides up along the firing pin hole. This might be a problem if the plunger turns inside the hole. The plunger has a flat on one side facing the firing pin and spring. There is also a ridge running the length of the plunger that rides in a slot to keep it from turning while moving up and down. When the magazine is released the plunger pushes the ejector lever down and in turn pushes the disconnector down to move the drawbar down below the contact point of the sear making the gun unable to fire.
Don, I'll try it later today, using a new magazine. I don't see any reason as to why it should work any differently.
Are the parts you're referring to available, so I can replace them? I'm having a hard time visualizing them, but if in fact, the plunger is turning in the slot, can this even be repaired? Are new parts available? Do I need a new slide?
Are the parts you're referring to available, so I can replace them? I'm having a hard time visualizing them, but if in fact, the plunger is turning in the slot, can this even be repaired? Are new parts available? Do I need a new slide?
donk52
Member
Hard to answer not knowing what the previous guy did, you mentioned he filed something on the safety. The slide should be ok. The thing is almost every part interacts with another and some of these are hand fit at the factory, but I don't ever remember "filing" a safety.
donk52
Member
Another thing, I don't think the magazine is a big problem with your failure to fire. It's basically just the feeding mechanism. Once the round is in the chamber and in battery position, the next progression is to
"drop the hammer, hit the firing pin with enough force to ignite the primer"
this is where your problem lies. With the new main spring the problem sound like something hindering the firing pin.
"drop the hammer, hit the firing pin with enough force to ignite the primer"
this is where your problem lies. With the new main spring the problem sound like something hindering the firing pin.
Don, I went to the range this morning, loaded 5 rounds into the brand new magazine, and they all fired, one after another. I loaded five more, and the gun was back to the previous problem, light strikes on the primer, and only one or two more bullets fired, after at least two attempts.
If I understand you correctly, when I push the magazine into the gun, the combination ejector and magazine interlock pushes up into the slide, pushing a small plunger and spring up. Again, if I understand you correctly, those are the parts that may be damaged or defective. I think you wrote me that I could remove the rear sight (being careful not to lose a small ball and spring), and then remove the parts that are acting up.
Do you feel comfortable talking me through this?
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Plan B is a little different. When I got my new spring kit for the recoil, they sent me three identical firing pin "extended strength" springs. Suppose I remove my current spring, and store it for later. Then I take one of these 1 3/8" long new springs and cut off 1/4". That will reduce the force the gun needs to allow the firing pin to reach the primer. Is it safe to try this?
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donk52
Member
Most of the time you do not have to remove the sight completely. Loosen allen screw on sight, depending how tight the sight is in the dovetail, will determine how hard you'll need to hit it. Tap,using brass drift or something to minimize marring, on the safety lever side, directly at the dovetail. As the sight moves go slowly until you see the plunger hole being exposed. There's a spring in there. the sight only needs to go as far as the plunger hole enough to remove it. The new plunger should be free of burrs and slightly break any sharp edges with a file.reverse to re assemble. Tap ONLY at dovetail to avoid damaging the sight.
