Sadly - Another .40 Shield Kaboom
- Thread starter jdw1951
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Maddmax
US Veteran
Before I bought my first M&P handgun I did allot of research on them. One determining factor of going with the 9's over the 40's was when I found out the 9 was designed from/off the 40's frame (call it a "heavy duty" 9 ?). The other was I didn't like the "snappy" recoil of the 40. I own the 9's from the Shield, 9c, FS, FS Long and FS PRO and have had zero problems with any. I skipped the 40's and went with the heavier built M&P 45's. FS, Mid size and 45c for more "knock down" power, also with zero problems. All are well used and carried as CCW for different occasions. Never used any ammo other than factory and with-in the manuals specs. No +P or "super defensive" factory loads.
Just happy to hear no one was hurt too bad or worse.
Just happy to hear no one was hurt too bad or worse.
How is a proof load determined: 130% of standard load?
What is pressure of proof load?
I have seen a max pressure for 35000 for 40 sw in manuals
Hirtenberger Ammo determined (1995) for Glock that bullet setback of 2.5 mm or 1/10" could double pressure: That said do we need a heavier crimp?? Be Safe,
What is pressure of proof load?
I have seen a max pressure for 35000 for 40 sw in manuals
Hirtenberger Ammo determined (1995) for Glock that bullet setback of 2.5 mm or 1/10" could double pressure: That said do we need a heavier crimp?? Be Safe,
What I learned from this post is if your weapon goes boom you send the damaged gun to a gunsmith to verify the cause and call an attorney.
Seriously, no firearm manufacturer is going to admit fault and most folks are not going to hire an attorney for a $400 loss.
What a joke expecting Smith and Wesson or sny other gun manufacturer to come to any other conclusion is like asking a doctor to perform an autopsy on a deceased patient and expect an outcome of negligence.
I think the original poster needs to rethink his emotional condition following such a tramatic event. My guess is you are suffering from pist tramatic syndrome.
My advise seek medical attention and call an attorney.
Russ
Seriously, no firearm manufacturer is going to admit fault and most folks are not going to hire an attorney for a $400 loss.
What a joke expecting Smith and Wesson or sny other gun manufacturer to come to any other conclusion is like asking a doctor to perform an autopsy on a deceased patient and expect an outcome of negligence.
I think the original poster needs to rethink his emotional condition following such a tramatic event. My guess is you are suffering from pist tramatic syndrome.
My advise seek medical attention and call an attorney.
Russ
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I firmly believe that would be even more insulting than S&W offering to sell him another Shield for $334
I thought S&W treated their customers right!
The right thing for them to do is one of 3 things:
1) Offer to buy back any Shield 40 from the customer (exploded or not exploded)
2) Trade customer's Shield 40 for a new Shield 9mm
3) Send customer a new Shield 40 replacing the destroyed one without charge.
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modraker
Member
jdw1951, thank you once again for your report. I am glad that you did not suffer any serious injury. I feel that your intentions and credibility are beyond reproach.
As for myself, I have seen enough in this forum to want to convert my 40 Shield into a 9mm. The 9mm magazines are easier to come by but I cannot find a 40 to 9 conversion barrel for the Shield. I prefer a barrel designed as a conversion as opposed to using a 9mm replacement barrel.
If anyone knows where I can obtain a conversion barrel, I would appreciate your help.
As for myself, I have seen enough in this forum to want to convert my 40 Shield into a 9mm. The 9mm magazines are easier to come by but I cannot find a 40 to 9 conversion barrel for the Shield. I prefer a barrel designed as a conversion as opposed to using a 9mm replacement barrel.
If anyone knows where I can obtain a conversion barrel, I would appreciate your help.
Roger
Here is the delima for S&W
If they offer any type of compensation it could be construed as guilt.
I can assure everyone on this forum the damaged weapon spent more time on an S&W attorney's desk than the S&W gunsmith desk and the weapon is not going back to the rightful owner unless S&W is subpoenae which is not going to happen because we sll know people don't hire attorneys over a $400 loss.
S&W is banking on the owner will walk.
The smart thing would be for a smart attorney to file a class action lawsuit on behalf of every Shield owner who has experienced a boom.
A class action lawsuit is the only way an attorney would take the case. $400 is nothing but if the number is multiplied by 100 you will peak an attorneys interest and one letter to S&W by that attorney will mean a quick settlement and free guns for everyone.
Russ
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A member mentioned the Consumer Product Safety Commission in post #40
Will they be the ones doing that?
feelinlucky
Member
I'm thinking that the last place you want to send your blown up gun for inspection is to the manufacturer.
However, there are independent ballistics labs out there who will inspect a blown up gun, and render an analysis of what caused it to blow up... for a fee. Yep, it would cost some bucks, but an analysis from one of these firms would be more objective than the manufacturer's would.
Same goes for the ammunition.
However, there are independent ballistics labs out there who will inspect a blown up gun, and render an analysis of what caused it to blow up... for a fee. Yep, it would cost some bucks, but an analysis from one of these firms would be more objective than the manufacturer's would.
Same goes for the ammunition.
SMR
Member
I would think that S&W wouldn't have a choice. It is not their gun. If they wanted to send out a new gun, fine I might think about letting you keep it. But there is no way they can keep that gun and not return it I would think.
ditto1958
Member
I don't have a horse in this race, but I find these accounts pretty disturbing. I don't recall reading about any other multiple accounts of the same make and model blowing up while using factory ammo.
Heck, YouTube is filled with videos of Glock torture tests where people fire 1000 rounds with no cleaning and have nothing going wrong except a plastic guide rod breaking.
Firearms, even polymer framed models, should be over-engineered to the point that firing a high pressure round every now and then should not be a problem.
Heck, YouTube is filled with videos of Glock torture tests where people fire 1000 rounds with no cleaning and have nothing going wrong except a plastic guide rod breaking.
Firearms, even polymer framed models, should be over-engineered to the point that firing a high pressure round every now and then should not be a problem.
Jboutfishn
Member
I am not familiar with Underwood ammo but after reading this post I inspected the Hornady Critical Defense I use in my 40C and note that it has a canalure that hopefully would limit any setback. The box indicates that muzzle velocity with a 165 grain bullet to be 1165 fps. That is a pretty stiff load.
Just thinkin.......
Obviously you have never been present during an autopsy!
Well it may have been an exercise in futility to ask S&W for an objective evaluation of the cause of the kaboom; but given my prior faith and long history with S&W I thought they might see a pattern with multiple .40 Shields blowing up. I believe no major manufacturer wants a person to be injured using their product. However, I realize there is legal precedent for corporations intentionally failing to execute a recall once they determine there may be a problem. As someone stated, it is difficult to justify paying the high cost of having an independent forensic analysis performed on a $400 firearm. Hopefully, the multiple threads will at least serve as a public service to present all the information and enable each person to make an informed decision on their choice of firearm for protection and sport.
Thankfully, my friend is working now on resizing more detailed photos that I will upload soon. Now I need to obtain my own software.
Thankfully, my friend is working now on resizing more detailed photos that I will upload soon. Now I need to obtain my own software.
Concerning the discussion of bullet setback, I too have seen data supporting a minor set driving an exponential increase in pressure. Both my brother-in-law and I are very careful handling ammunition and always keep it in segregated trays/boxes. I did measure every remaining round to ensure the OL was within spec: they were.
I don't know about all you other Shield 40 owners out there, but after spending the $$ for a Crimson Trace trigger guard laser and a trigger job I had settled on my Shield 40 as my new favorite EDC. It's the most comfortable, easy carrying and smooth shooting pistol I've ever experienced. And after using mostly 9mm in the past I was happy to have the extra impact of the 40.
Now, with that said, I would really appreciate it if we could get some reliable information from an experienced gunsmith about one of these failures to get a better handle on what's going on here.I really hope the original poster gets his Shield back from S&W and does something to get this sorted out. Right now we just have a few isolated incidents without the full compliment of facts and failure analysis, and it's creating a very uneasy climate.
I would also challenge the boys at S&W to get more proactive about this and do some more testing on their own and publish their recommendations ASAP about ammo. Has anyone even seen any S&W guidelines about +P or any other loads?
Now, with that said, I would really appreciate it if we could get some reliable information from an experienced gunsmith about one of these failures to get a better handle on what's going on here.I really hope the original poster gets his Shield back from S&W and does something to get this sorted out. Right now we just have a few isolated incidents without the full compliment of facts and failure analysis, and it's creating a very uneasy climate.
I would also challenge the boys at S&W to get more proactive about this and do some more testing on their own and publish their recommendations ASAP about ammo. Has anyone even seen any S&W guidelines about +P or any other loads?
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