SD9, the Glock killer

[BlackTalonJHP]

S&W SD9 VE vs the Glock 19 Gen 3


Let's take a look at just how closely they match up

Dimension SD9 VE 19 Gen 3

Length OAL 7.18 6.98
Width OAL 1.01 1.14
Height OAL 5.34 4.86
Height w/sights 5.57 5.03
Width of slide 1.00 1.00
Height of slide 0.86 0.85
Barrel length 4.00 4.00
Rifling legth 2.78 2.78
Sight radius 6.27 6.04
Trigger reach 2.65 3.05

Max grip width (front to back) 2.13 2.32
Max grip thickness (side to side) 1.30 1.18


As you can see, both slides are made from 1" stock and the barrels are nearly identical. In fact, slides will fit on the opposite brands frame rails, but stop shy of the rear rails due to the trigger bar and ejector differences. The Glock barrel will fit in the SD9 frame, but the S&W barrel is slightly too large in diameter at the muzzle to work in the Glock.

The major difference between the two is the height. The Glock measurement is quite representative, but the grip on the SD9 makes it appear much taller on paper. This is because of the bottom of the grip, which is slanted forward at about a 35 degree angle, due to the magazine having a baseplate that is exactly perpendicular to the magazine body. The two positives about the SD9 height are that I can get a full grip on the weapon, unlike the Glock 19 which has finger grooves sized for very small fingers, and the one extra round that the SD9 carries (16) over the Glock (15).

Where the SD9 wins:
Ergonomics, price, sights

Where the Glock wins:
Aftermarket parts, holster options, magazine cost/options

If I had to choose one, it would have to be the SD9. It just feels right in my hand and it's inexpensive enough to own several, even if you are on a budget.

........SD9VE 19 Gen 3
MSRP $379 $600
Paid (NIB) $300 $500
Mags $35 $25

 

[BlackTalonJHP]

More pictures

 

[MP1970]

Will I be able to shoot an SD9 with a Glock barrel ? If Yes I gonna buy a glock barrel for my SD9.

 

[BlackTalonJHP]

I have not tried shooting the SD9 with Glock barrel, but maybe someone will post that has tried it. I am not sure how reliable it would be, but since the Glock barrel does not have the same diameter at the muzzle end, accuracy would most likely suffer. Also, as you might be able to tell from the pics, the barrels are slightly different at the cam slot (SD9 is bigger) and the guide rod ledge.

 

[Arik]

Glock killer? I doubt! if you wanna compare measurements....ok...maybe but even that is subjective. I would first like to see years and years of SD9 high round counts and torture tests before I give a rats $&#&! about the miniscule difference in dimensions


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[S&W45Colt]

Glock killer? I doubt! if you wanna compare measurements....ok...maybe but even that is subjective. I would first like to see years and years of SD9 high round counts and torture tests before I give a rats $&#&! about the miniscule difference in dimensions


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I'm siding with Arik on this too, the SD might have been the Sigma Killer, but it's not even in the same league as the G19.

 

[truckinjames]

I have and love both guns. If I had to put my life on the line and in a combat environment, I would go with the Glock. It has proven it's reliability world wide in just about every type of situation.

 

[Nakanokalronin]

For what the SD9VE costs, it will be more than enough for HD, security or other tasks where super high round counts will most likely never be achieved. Anyone know who has the highest round count in a SDVE model and what that round count is?

As a side note, my SD9VE fits in many holsters I still had for my G19.

 

[james45]

Glocks have a better trigger but if S&W can turn these guns out for 300 dollars then why can't glock?I think that S&W's price point is the main attraction here,a lot of folks would probably opt for the S&W just because they dont want to spend the extra 200.It would be nice to see more sigma/sd torture tests on youtube,I've seen plenty of glock and hi-point torture test,never seen a sigma torture test.My sw9ve has never ever had a hiccup and I'm sure the sd line is just as reliable,I'll take a M&P over both though.

 

[BlackTalonJHP]

Glock killer? I doubt! if you wanna compare measurements....ok...maybe but even that is subjective. I would first like to see years and years of SD9 high round counts and torture tests before I give a rats $&#&! about the miniscule difference in dimensions


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Measurements being subjective? How is that possible?
I too would like to see more torture tests, reviews and shooting videos in general for the SD9. I think that S&W doesn't want to take away from M&P sales, which is why you don't see much advertising/promotion for the SD9. My post was to point out how underrated this handgun is and how similar it is in size/function/role to the highly popular Glock 19.

 

[BlackTalonJHP]

I have and love both guns. If I had to put my life on the line and in a combat environment, I would go with the Glock. It has proven it's reliability world wide in just about every type of situation.

Are we talking Gen 3 or Gen 4 Glocks?

 

[BlackTalonJHP]

I'm siding with Arik on this too, the SD might have been the Sigma Killer, but it's not even in the same league as the G19.

Why are the two 'not even in the same league'?
Is it because the SD9 VE is $200 less?

I think that a lot of people dismiss the SD9VE because they
look at the price and say '300 dollars, it can't be any good'.
S&W would probably sell more if they raised the price a little. (Don't tell them I said that, by the way)

 

[jppezz23]

The Sd9 is a very good gun if you want to spend 200 dollars more go buy the Glock I have shot both and the SD9 is fine for me.

 

[copterdrvr]

I'm fortunate enough to be in the situation that I can buy any pistol made buy any manufacturer.

I've fired my share of Glocks in both 9mm and 40 SW. I don't own any Glocks because I feel like I'm holding onto something that just does NOT fit MY hand.

I know it's an exaggeration but I feel like I'm hanging on to a two by four which is NOT the feeling I get with the SD9, numerous Kahr's, CZ/TZ 75's, Browning Hi-Powers and the 1911 A1's I own. You'll note that all of the pistols mentioned are known to have "slim" grips.

In fact, I bought the SD9 because the grip is just alittle bit smaller than the M&P and trust me-I wish that WASN'T the case because there are LOTS of parts available for the M&P and pitifully few for the SD series.

I've said it before-if the striker goes bad on my SD9 and they say I have to send it back to the factory, I'll smash it with a sledge hammer and throw it in the river that is my "back yard" and be done with S.W..

P.S. people are reporting 20,000 plus rounds through the SD series with no failures of any kind. I'm happy with that.

 

[Will Carry]

I carry a Glock 19. The grip is too fat, the grip angle is off a little, the trigger isn't great and it's ugly as a Barvarian Brick. I don't carry it to comfort my special hands or finely tuned trigger finger. I carry it because it works and it spits out 9mm rounds accurately every time.
I have never fired the SD9 VE but I understand it is a good weapon. I bought a Sigma when they first came out, I gave it to a friend who traded it for a Beretta.

 

[copterdrvr]

I've never even handled a Sigma and I know there are people that like them but I'm glad I didn't because I doubt that I would have even taken the time to pick up the SD9.

I shoot regularly and I'm going to quit trying to keep up with the round count but it's over 1000 now with no failures. I've shot just about every kind of ammo you can think of from steel-case Russian junk to exotic "special purpose" ammo and they all went bang. For those of you still having problems loading the pistol without "jams" - remember that to load it properly from a locked open slide-you insert the magazine, grab the slide and briskly pull it to the rear and immediately RELEASE it when it reaches its rearward most movement. Don't just activate the slide release to load the pistol as that's not reliable enough a method and DON'T ride the slide forward with your hand on it-you have to release it and let it fly forward on it's own momentum.

I installed the Apex spring kit before my first rounds down the tube and I'm still checking primer strikes-for now. I'll probably quit next time out because the primerstrikes are still exactly as deep and solid as they were from the first outing. I kept a few cases from the first outing and use them as a reference and I can't see a difference.

The SD series pistols are (I'm sure) cheap to manufacture because of the design features and modern materials that are used. It shows S.W.'s creativity and design innovation. Are they put together like my custom 1911? Nope, but I ain't carrying a single action pistol stuffed in my pants-condition one. I do however, feel totally comfortable carrying my SD9 in my Ready Holster at the 8 o'clock position (I'm left-handed) with no problem whatsoever...

 

[Ape Hanger]

S&W would probably sell more if they raised the price a little. (Don't tell them I said that, by the way)

No, they wouldn't. They already tried to sell them for more money. When the original SD with the front night sight and black melonite finish on the slide first came out, they sold for around $449. If they had sold at that price, we would have never seen the VE versions.

 

[BlackTalonJHP]

No, they wouldn't. They already tried to sell them for more money. When the original SD with the front night sight and black melonite finish on the slide first came out, they sold for around $449. If they had sold at that price, we would have never seen the VE versions.

These were too close to the M&P and even used the M&P steel sights. M&P's sell for around $450 as well. I never said they should price them the same as the M&P.

 

[MP1970]

I have not tried shooting the SD9 with Glock barrel, but maybe someone will post that has tried it. I am not sure how reliable it would be, but since the Glock barrel does not have the same diameter at the muzzle end, accuracy would most likely suffer. Also, as you might be able to tell from the pics, the barrels are slightly different at the cam slot (SD9 is bigger) and the guide rod ledge.

I wonder how is the feeding/ ejecting would be before I ever try to shoot it... Does Glock's recoil assembly fit SD9 slide? These are all theoretical questions, please Do Not try to shoot it.

 

[Short Bus Driver]

Glocks have a better trigger but if S&W can turn these guns out for 300 dollars then why can't glock?I think that S&W's price point is the main attraction here,a lot of folks would probably opt for the S&W just because they dont want to spend the extra 200.It would be nice to see more sigma/sd torture tests on youtube,I've seen plenty of glock and hi-point torture test,never seen a sigma torture test.My sw9ve has never ever had a hiccup and I'm sure the sd line is just as reliable,I'll take a M&P over both though.

That can be fixed. It will cost you about $25, a little time installing springs and polishing parts and your warranty (+ S&W will NOT sell you parts and will rape you on smithing fees )

 

[copterdrvr]

And in case anyone is the littlest bit confused, of course no one here is saying that putting the parts together from these two guns would have a chance in heck of functioning and more than likely would be an EXTREMELY DANGEROUS AND POSSIBLY LIFE THREATENING experience. I can see a slide/barrel assembly leaving the pistol and heading straight for someone's face/eyes.

I know of numerous times when barrels made by the manufacturer of the pistol in question FOR THAT GUN wouldn't work without being fitted first.

 

[loc n load]

Glock

I was issued a first gen Glock when they first came into the country.....I still have that pistol and it has over 150,000 documented rounds thru it..(the only thing ever fixed on it was the trigger pin which I discovered was in two pieces once when I detailed the gun)....it still worked just fine.....no finish to speak of as it has been in and out of a holster a zillion times....I instructed Glocks for years and been thru their armorer's school..when I was there, they had a G-17 that had been by used by a European ammo mfgr to test fire their ammo...this G-17 had over 300,000 rds thru it...that is amazing....people either love em or hate em......but they work.....forever......I am not real crazy abt their barrels as I have to go to after market bl's to shoot my cast bullets.....but I have Glocks in all sizes and calibers.....and have carried them into harm's way several times......and would not hesitate to "saddle up" with any of mine..... my G 20 & G 30's are my EDC's when I carry a pistol.

 

[S&W45Colt]

Why are the two 'not even in the same league'?
Is it because the SD9 VE is $200 less?

I think that a lot of people dismiss the SD9VE because they
look at the price and say '300 dollars, it can't be any good'.
S&W would probably sell more if they raised the price a little. (Don't tell them I said that, by the way)

I will not disagree with you, that the SD VE is a good gun for the money. However, it's not a Glock in quality. The M&P is the comparable Smith to compare to the Glock. I own both and like both.

The SDVE has a heavier,gritty trigger, it's almost Sigma like in my opinion and I don't think there is a debate in the fact the Sigma had the worse trigger S&W ever put in a gun. I despise a long Semi-Auto trigger and the SDVE certainly has one. A striker fired pistol with a long trigger takes away one of the major advantages of this style of pistol.

The SDVE has not even begun to establish the reputation for reliability Glock has. Before someone says something about Gen 4's, it's 2013, they redesigned the spring and no one's mutter a word about issues since, case closed.

Finally, the major advantage Glock has over S&W is the availability of after market parts, particularly trigger kits that don't require selling a body part to get one. This is not just an SD issue, but still worth mentioning.

If you want to say the SDVE is an improvement over the Sigma, I'll agree. If you want to say it's a nice gun for the money, again I'll agree. But to call it a Glock or M&P comparable gun, much less a killer of either, not in my eyes. From most of the reviews I've read online, not in the eyes of the reviewers either.

But hey, if you like it as much, then you're right, you are getting a super value for your buck. After all for you, your opinion is the one who counts for you.

 

[copterdrvr]

Short BD, I didn't get into my sear assembly for polishing, I did the barrel, striker face and the portion of the slide face that the firing pin protrudes from and that's about it. I dry-fired the heck out of it before the Apex springs showed up and I can't imagine it (or needing it to be) any better than it is right now.

I think SW would do "warranty" work on it (after I put the old springs back in) but that's not the point. I'm not gonna send a gun through the mail, AFTER doing a dance to put it back the way it's "supposed" to be, to change some penny anti part.

I've worked on many different brands of firearms and this has got to be one of the simplest and least complicated ones out there. Just sell me the parts and let me do it myself. If I screw up and "break" something, that's my problem, not S.W.s.

Brownells sells the entire sear assembly for an M.P. for 29 bucks and a striker assembly for 30 bucks. S.W. needs to wake up and offer the parts for the SD as well.

 

[Kanewpadle]

The SD and Sigma guns were built to compete against Glock. They are price point guns. Not meant to be better. Just an alternative for those that are willing to pay less for a gun without Glock's reputation and proven track record.

 

[james45]

That can be fixed. It will cost you about $25, a little time installing springs and polishing parts and your warranty (+ S&W will NOT sell you parts and will rape you on smithing fees )

True and I almost did give up on S&W over the polishing and warranty thing but lesson learned....Ill never buy a used S&W again and when I get a new one then I'm not touching it.

 

[Jswiney9]

All I can say bad about a Glock is that I hate the grip angle and its ugly. Besides that what is there not to like besides its not made in America? Anyone that wouldnt own a Glock just because they see how cool it is to hate them on an internet forum is..... well, ridiculous.

The SD9 has an absolutely horrible trigger and just doesnt have the reputation yet that glock does. They are good for what they were designed for without a doubt..... a cheap self defense weapon. But if we are going to go that route we have to throw HI-point into the contest, they go bang every time and wont die (look up some of the torture tests on those poor things on youtube, WOW) and only cost 150 bucks brand new.

 

[Short Bus Driver]

Short BD, I didn't get into my sear assembly for polishing, I did the barrel, striker face and the portion of the slide face that the firing pin protrudes from and that's about it. I dry-fired the heck out of it before the Apex springs showed up and I can't imagine it (or needing it to be) any better than it is right now.

I think SW would do "warranty" work on it (after I put the old springs back in) but that's not the point. I'm not gonna send a gun through the mail, AFTER doing a dance to put it back the way it's "supposed" to be, to change some penny anti part.

I've worked on many different brands of firearms and this has got to be one of the simplest and least complicated ones out there. Just sell me the parts and let me do it myself. If I screw up and "break" something, that's my problem, not S.W.s.

Brownells sells the entire sear assembly for an M.P. for 29 bucks and a striker assembly for 30 bucks. S.W. needs to wake up and offer the parts for the SD as well.

I didn't get into my sear assembly either, I just polished the contact points that I could get to. I also polished the trigger bar and striker block.

 

[BlackTalonJHP]

Here's a picture of the guide rod assemblies, just as a data point. No, I do not plan on using Glock parts in the SD9 or vice versa. No, I do not suggest or recommend it, I'm simply comparing the two.

Also, I have the opposite experience with my SD9 trigger. Yes, it is a bit longer/heavier pull but it is very smooth compared to my M&P's which were very, very gritty from the factory. The downside on the M&P is that the rear sight must be removed to get to the striker safety, whereas the SD9's is in the same location as the Glock. I find it pretty easy to do a trigger job on the SD series, compared to the M&P

The similarities between the M&P and Glock are the sear and trigger disconnect, which causes the trigger bar to move to the side, rather than slide underneath like the SD9.

As for the Glock Gen 4 problems (recoil springs, extractors), why should we not bring those up? Because they are in the past?

 

[S&W45Colt]

Here's a picture of the guide rod assemblies, just as a data point. No, I do not plan on using Glock parts in the SD9 or vice versa. No, I do not suggest or recommend it, I'm simply comparing the two.

Also, I have the opposite experience with my SD9 trigger. Yes, it is a bit longer/heavier pull but it is very smooth compared to my M&P's which were very, very gritty from the factory. The downside on the M&P is that the rear sight must be removed to get to the striker safety, whereas the SD9's is in the same location as the Glock. I find it pretty easy to do a trigger job on the SD series, compared to the M&P

The similarities between the M&P and Glock are the sear and trigger disconnect, which causes the trigger bar to move to the side, rather than slide underneath like the SD9.

As for the Glock Gen 4 problems (recoil springs, extractors), why should we not bring those up? Because they are in the past?

It was a brief problem, long since solved and not relevant to a Sept 2013 discussion. Looking at Glock's complete track record, it's a blimp in a remarkably dependable gun brand.