Sheet rock interior walls and overpenetration...

[rwsmith]

I just watched a few vids of different types of walls and one with Paul Harrell doing mostly sheet rock.

My interior walls are all sheet rock. 9mm JHP has been my mainstay for defense of any kind. But I just found out that 9mm (and a LOT of other calibers) go through sheet rock almost like it's not there and have almost as much energy on the other side. Buckshot was extremely destructive on over penetration. Somebody said that 5.56 bullets go through the wall and are found sitting on the floor on the other side. THAT is obviously a real load of ****.

Anyway, I'm beginning to change my thinking. Birdshot/small game shot is said not to penetrate enough, but at a range of 5 yards max wouldn't it hit almost like a slug and be stopped by walls?

I think i'll take a couple pieces of sheet rock to the range and test out some shot loads. What's your opinion on this? I haven't exactly changed my mind yet. I love my Golden Sabers and HSTs. But if my thinking turns out to be flat wrong, I could change my strategy. At least have a shotgun backup IF I were to have time to make a choice.

 

[Gamecock]

Ballistic personal defense weapons work by penetration. Attempts to limit penetration suggest you should be using something else.

Keep your 9. Go to 147 gr bullets.

 

[Kanewpadle]

Read this first.
The Box O' Truth #12 - Insulated Walls - The Box O' Truth

 

[Pisgah]

Light-bullet 5.56 loads have been tested many times against all common pistol rounds and buckshot and, believe it or not, the 5.56 is by far the safest to use if wall penetration is a concern. I use 45 gr. hollowpoints in my house AR. Yes, that is strictly counterintuitive -- but intuition can lead you astray in this case.

 

[ContinentalOp]

My opinion, worth what you paid for it (), is that any self defense round that will penetrate enough in a human attacker to stop them will likely penetrate through building materials.

If you're concerned about overpenetration through building materials, as we all should be, your best bet is to try and minimize the risk by establishing potential lines of fire and placing backstops where possible. For example, a bookcase filled with books can be placed strategically to act as a backstop.

Additionally, layering security around your home can help slow an attacker's progress and give you time to get into a better position with better lines of fire, as well as call 911. And you don't have to spend a lot of money to improve your home security.

Finally, work out a response plan and practice it periodically.

Just my opinion.

 

[Peak53]

At five yards, any effective round is going to penetrate sheetrock, including birdshot. For that matter, even a .22 rimfire is going to penetrate sheetrock and be dangerous on the other side. Guns are dangerous! Treat with respect. Your range experiment will be interesting, so please report.

 

[snowman]

Mr. Smith,

I'm sure you've heard of angry men putting their entire fist through sheetrock/drywall -a fairly common occurrence. When one compares such a large, blunt object having a relatively modest amount of energy behind it with a very small object driven by a considerably greater amount of energy, it's difficult for me to imagine finding any kind of modern, effective ammunition that wouldn't easily penetrate walls. I'm afraid we have to live with the risk and seek to mitigate it by other means, as suggested by other members here.

I've just realized that what I've written isn't much help -but it might well be something to consider when making decisions like the one with which you're faced.

Regards,
Andy

 

[THEmodelof1989]

Bullets go through drywall like a hot knife through butter I've seen them go through the entire interior of a house without a stud or two to cut some velocity.

You know, not enough people talk about the self defense chainsaw. Imagine breaking into a house and hearing a chainsaw revving up...

 

[Jon651]

Bullets go through drywall like a hot knife through butter I've seen them go through the entire interior of a house without a stud or two to cut some velocity.

You know, not enough people talk about the self defense chainsaw. Imagine breaking into a house and hearing a chainsaw revving up...

NEVER bring a chainsaw to a flamethrower fight!

 

[Rpg]

The problem here is missing what you shoot at.

Most discussions about over penetration are really about missing the target.

A load of birdshot (#7 1/2 or 8) will certainly penetrate a sheet or two of drywall at in house distances.

It will also inflict a truly grievous wound without penetrating a man’s torso, certainly not with enough remaining energy to do much damage to a sheet of drywall let alone anything beyond the drywall.

As in most sd situations, hitting what you’re shooting at is important.

 

[Borderboss]

My perspective is that I find the best self defense ammo that I can, because that's the first priority. After that, figure out how you're going to approach self defense in your dwelling so you know what's on the other side should you have to shoot.

I live in a two-story house in a Chicago subdivision, which means the houses next to me are within 50-75 feet of my house, and the house across the street is about 75 yards away from my front door. My self defense plan for nighttime intruders while we're in bed has always been to let the bad guys have the first floor. They can take what they want while the cops are on the way.

However, the staircase is the red line. If they take one step on the stairs, their *** is mine. Whether it's a load of #1 Buck or a few .223 Gold Dots, they're getting ventilated without a call, without a warning. If I miss, the round is either going into the floor, or will exit the house and explode on the cement front porch. No neighbor is in danger.

If they get upstairs before I know they're their, then the houses next door may be in play if I miss. I can't really think about that I'm afraid. Priority #1 is to survive.

 

[ispcapt]

Anyway, I'm beginning to change my thinking. Birdshot/small game shot is said not to penetrate enough, but at a range of 5 yards max wouldn't it hit almost like a slug and be stopped by walls?

The first shooting I went to was a guy who caught a 20 ga #6 low brass round center chest just below the xypoid at 15 ft. It cut a hole about the size of a golf ball with some jagged edges. We found the shot cup next to his spine. Yes, he was dead.
If you want to see what a birdshot pattern looks like at close range use some sheet rock as a target and measure the rooms at your house. The shoot the sheet rock with birdshot at the same distance as your house rooms. For the distances in most houses and bedrooms that birdshot is going to look like a bit slug hole. The distance is too close for the shot column to start opening.
I use sheet rock as target backers. Even shooting .22 pistol at 100 yds and every other caliber I haven't seen sheet rock stop any rounds yet, even at 100 yards.
A lot of people don't have any idea just how much penetration almost every round has. On Oct 2, 1996 we attempted to arrested an armed fugitive holed up in a hotel room. When we hit the door he opened up on us with a TEC-9 in one hand and a Colt Mustang .380 in the other. The door swung open and closed in just a second but in that time he fired 11 rds at us. Obviously we couldn't make entry. As soon as the door closed he shot himself with the Colt .380 FMJ. The bullet entered his head just in front of and above his right ear. It exited just behind and about center of his left ear. The bullet then traveled thru the arm of an overstuffed chair. Then it went thru at an angle of about 2" of sheet rock where it then struck a wooden 2X4 stud. It logged about 1" into the wood.
Do not under estimate the penetration of any round.

 

[bigwheelzip]

I recently posted about a murder that took place in an apartment in my granddaughters apartment building. She got the opportunity to visit the apartment next to the one where the shooting took place. A large number of rounds were expended, and many traveled through several walls after entering the adjoining apartment.
Frangible ammo by companys like Blazer, is marketed to lessen penetration.

Sent from my Moto G (5) Plus using Tapatalk

 

[Erocksmash]

from first hand experience and a sorry to say ND I had a 124gr speer GD Underwood +p go threw 7 sheets of sheet rock, before coming to rest agents a block wall, it would have goon further if not for concrete....

 

[Echo40]

Here's a copy/paste of a post I recently made in another thread in regards to a similar subject...

All this talk about #4 Birdshot brings me back to the day that I picked up my Shockwave from the gunshop...

When I asked the man behind the counter for some 00 Buckshot to go with it, he advised me not to use it for Home Defense because it could pierce right through walls and handed me a box of Federal #4 Turkey Shot instead. I insisted that I still wanted a box of 00 Buckshot all the same and he said; "Okay, but save it for the range."

I appreciated the gesture, but I live in a valley surrounded by wooded hills and all entraces into my house as well as my bedroom aren't facing any neighboring houses, nor are the doorways into my room facing adjacent rooms, so there's no real risk of collateral damage, and I'd rather patch up some holes in my house than risk using less than adequate ammunition for Self-Defense. Besides, I've seen enough tests online to know that pretty much everything will penetrate interior walls, so there's really no avoiding it without selecting less than lethal ammo like rubber buckshot.

Don't get me wrong, I'm sure that at the very least #4 Turkey Shot would leave behind one heck of a nasty wound that would most likely result in death without immediate medical attention, but I'd rather just stick with 00 Buckshot. The way I see it is, anybody who continues their advance after hearing the sound of shotgun chambering a round, much less peering into the gaping maw that is a 12 Gauge muzzle probably won't stop for anything short of total incapacitation.

/End Quote

If you gotta do something to mitigate the risk of overpenetration, then I suggest strengthening your interior walls with something like tile. It may sound like a costly or even impractical endevor, but it's better than shooting an attacker with something that will quite literally just make him angry because anything more would penetrate drywall.

 

[Rastoff]

Anyway, I'm beginning to change my thinking. Birdshot/small game shot is said not to penetrate enough, but at a range of 5 yards max wouldn't it hit almost like a slug and be stopped by walls?

You've answered your own question. You don't get it both ways. If it won't penetrate the dry wall, it won't penetrate the bad guy either. So, your idea of "hitting like a slug" is a non starter. If you want it to hit like a slug, it will go through sheet rock.


Here's my $.02 on over-penetration in relation to self-defense:
Which is more important, stopping the bad guy or not over penetrating? If it's the latter, don't use a gun for self-defense. You're not ready to do what's necessary i.e. put the bad guy down with the first shot. If it's the former, practice hard to hit the right spot. If you hit the right spot, the bad guy will slow down the rounds enough that going through multiple layers of dry wall will slow it down enough to be non lethal to anyone in its path at that point.

9mm penetrates more than .223Rem. This has been demonstrated many times.

9mm hollow points expand to about the size of a .45ACP, maybe a touch larger with modern rounds. JHP rounds don't reliably expand in dry wall so, using a JHP because you think it will expand and not penetrate dry wall is not a reliable solution.

I don't live in BFE, but my neighbors are far enough that any round from any gun (except a .50BMG or other monster round) will not have enough energy after going through at least two layers of dry wall and a layer of insulation and a layer of wood siding, to reach another house let alone damage anyone.

If I'm using a pistol, it will be 9mm or .45ACP. Most likely .45ACP.
If I'm using a shotgun, it will be 00Buck.
If I'm using a rifle it will be .223Rem/5.56x45NATO.

If they got through the other layers of defense (fences, locked doors, dog, wife), then their being in the house was not a mistake. They have serious nefarious intent and they will deserve being shot because my life or the life of my family is in serious danger.

 

[robertrwalsh]

Unfortunately statistically you are more likely to miss than hit with any defense round fired inside your house. You might try Glaser or similar ammo if your weapon will work reliably with it. Also, as noted elsewhere above, laying out some lines of fire in advance with appreciation for bullet stoppers positioned in your house can be helpful. Bookcases are really great for this, at least if they are full of books.

 

[7shooter]

One of our carry permit instructors built two small walls with sheet rock insulation and sheet rock. He placed the walls 21 feet apart and fired all the common pistol caliber rounds through them. All calibers passed through both walls.

 

[texmex]

Use a 10-22 with a 25 round magazine or two, red dot optic and laser plus weapon mounted light. Take head shots. Shouldn't take more than one or two. I like the bookshelf for room armour. That might work for drive bys coming from outside the house. Home appliances can be good armour also.
o

 

[MurphyPr]

Read this first.
The Box O' Truth #12 - Insulated Walls - The Box O' Truth

Then, read this.

The Box O' Truth #7 - The Sands O' Truth - The Box O' Truth

To summarize, dry wall does a great job of stopping bullets if the wall space is filled sand instead of insulation.