Shield 40 Mishap

2001gmc,
You have now learned a very valuable lesson!
1 Never give the manufacturer the firearm, you gave the manufacturer the only item that would have proved one way or the other that either the gun or the ammo was the culprit.
2 you sent all the ammo you had left to the ammo manufacturer, and now they can cover up their part of the failure!
3 now S&W wants you to buy a new gun and your pissed off, which is the way most guys would be.
We as firearms owners expect these large corporations to stand behind their product, and sometimes they do, however they are large publicly traded corporations that are only interested in the bottom line because they have share holders that they have to answer too.
In this case its easier for each of these corporations to blame each other and that way there can be no documented failure of the gun or the ammo.
Had you done as I suggested earlier the outcome would definately turned out in your favor, because the large corporations don't like it when an attorney is involved in a product defect litigation, because if the failure is indeed the firearm they stand to loose millions of dollars and if it hits the news they loose part of their market share.
In the end its all about money, and they win and you lose, certainly not the way it should be, you would think someone at S&W would have a conscience and do the right thing! At this poiint I would hand write a letter to the CEO and using facts not emotion explain your circumstance and see what happens, as a closing I would state that you are demanding that your firearm be returned, you might get it back , and if you do get it to an attorney with the pictures you took, and see if you have standing for a law suit.
 
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1fly2ty said:
1 Never give the manufacturer the firearm,...
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So, what was he, or anyone else, supposed to do? He called S&W and they said to return the firearm for inspection. If he hadn't, they simply would have said no.

I'm not arguing, I'm just curious as to how anyone would get restitution if they don't send the firearm to the company? Every company is going to ask for that. Do lawyers takes cases like this pro bono? If not, it would be far more expensive to fight it than the gun is worth. And, considering it's an isolated case, there is no class action suit here.

So, what do we do if we don't send the firearm back?
 
You can get a product liability attorney on a contingency basis which will cost you nothing out of pocket. However, seeking resolution in the court system is a very lengthy and often disappointing affair.

My personal opinion is that Smith and Wesson has not even attempted to address this issue or resolve it. Their product could very well have caused serious damage to the shooter and they seem unconcerned.
 
Rastoff,
If a gun fails as this one did, the reason you need to get an attorney involved is to ensure that both companies are held accountable. The attorney will send the firearm to an independent lab where they will test the metals, plastics and determine if during the manufacture of the firearm something was done incorrectly, they will also test the spent brass, and they have photos to document other failures that gmc's firearm will be compared against. Once the attorney contacts S&W & Federal via a letter indicating the firearm and spent casing was tested by an independent lab, they want to squash any possibility that it was their fault, at that point they will want the pistol for their own testing lab to look at.
Had this gent lost a finger or damaged his hand he would have immediately contacted an attorney, its no different when only the pistol is involved.
I recommend this with any firearm that has this kind of failure, I will say that if I were in this gents shoes and I were shooting my handloads and this happened I would not bother with an attorney because you are opening yourself up to a very high level of scrutiny, and in the end you would probably not prevail. I think that S&w has sadly mishanled this whole situation, and in this instance they could have given the customer the benefit of the doubt, and sent him a new firearm, but they choose to point their finger at the other possible source and cast blame in their direction. I have 5 M&Ps and a several other handguns if any of them ever failed and I knew that I had done nothing to cause it I would be going straight from the range to my attorneys office and if there were any witnesse' I would collect their names addresse's and phone number's. I worked for 5 large corporations after I retired from the Navy and I wil tell you the minute someone that bought our product, started talking attorneys or if we got a call from an attorney, we took care of the problem! One of those companys was sued and everytime we received a customer complaint, we had to put it on a clock, and if it wasn't resolved in 72 hours we were subject to federal fines, we were on probation for 2 years!
 
1fly2ty,
Yes, I'm aware of the value of an attorney. I just wasn't aware of this:
Jakpro said:
You can get a product liability attorney on a contingency basis which will cost you nothing out of pocket.


And I think this:
Jakpro said:
However, seeking resolution in the court system is a very lengthy and often disappointing affair.
Click to expand...
...is the main reason most don't go looking for an attorney. And, will an attorney represent you for a $450 gun?

You say that S&W has done nothing. I'll bet that they would disagree. According to what has been posted, they tested the gun and found it to be within specs. Then they offered the owner a new gun at a discounted price. I'm sure S&W feels that they have gone over and above on this.

However, I'm with the rest here and think they've done as little as they think they can get away with. It's sad really.

So, 2001gmc, the question now is, what are you going to do? The ball seems to be in your court.
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Winning a law suit is not the issue here. Sure he might get a new gun and the value of the ammo, but to win enough to pay a lawyer requires damages beyond just the value of the gun. A lawyer would be crazy to take one case like this since there is no upside for him to receive since the OP wasn't hurt and had no medical bills. The case could take years which reduces the incentive for the lawyer even more. At best the OP might get a new replacement gun, to expect a significant cash award is unrealistic.

The best approach is from the top down, senior management doesn't want to waste its time on a $500 matter. I believe that they will quietly determine that the OP should have a new gun and without admitting any fault or liability on their part, S&W and maybe Federal will work out a deal between themselves for the value of the gun. The OP would be required to sign a wavier, and a non-disclosure agreement and that will be the end. That is except for the bad feelings
 
Rastoff said:
1fly2ty,
Yes, I'm aware of the value of an attorney. I just wasn't aware of this:
Jakpro said:
You can get a product liability attorney on a contingency basis which will cost you nothing out of pocket.


And I think this:...is the main reason most don't go looking for an attorney. And, will an attorney represent you for a $450 gun?

You say that S&W has done nothing. I'll bet that they would disagree. According to what has been posted, they tested the gun and found it to be within specs. Then they offered the owner a new gun at a discounted price. I'm sure S&W feels that they have gone over and above on this.

However, I'm with the rest here and think they've done as little as they think they can get away with. It's sad really.

So, 2001gmc, the question now is, what are you going to do? The ball seems to be in your court.
Click to expand...

Well Federal is aware of whats going on. I have to get the letter to them that Smith is sending me with the findings on the test. Federal wants the blowed casing from the misfire. I have wrote a letter to Robert the vice president of Smith a nice long letter and forwarded email thats been going on between me and smith from the get go. Sent the pics to him also and ask that he see the blowed casing gets to federal. Just that so far.
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2001gmc,
I think you're on the right path. If you can find one to talk to you, a lawyer is a good idea. Many have a free consultation. It can't hurt to ask the question. I believe that no one will take it, but at least it's something to try.
 
Just my opinion but.. These companies have a lot more expensive lawyers than the average person can afford. Now I bet in court S&W will provide lab results of the gun matching manufacture specs as well as Federal doing the same. They will probably prove that a 3rd influence of some sort such as other ammo was at fault in some way.

Being you would have to no way to prove that you only fired Federal ammo exclusively through the weapon, they would not be held liable. Same goes for Smith and Wesson. They will probably use the argument that since themselves and Federal proved that they were not the cause, it must have been that 3rd party aka you.

Realistically, all you might win if someone took your case would be a large legal bill.
 
As an attorney, I would tell you that without an injury, I wouldn't even take your case on a contingency fee. There is too much work involved in starting a lawsuit to make it worthwhile for most attorney's if there wasn't an injury involved. As someone already pointed out, independent tests need to be done and paid for. Who pays for that? If the OP lost a finger, hand, eye, etc...now we're talking thousands of dollars in damages, including lost income, hurt feelings, etc... What was originally a $600 problem has now hit over 100 grand. Thank god the OP wasn't injured in this accident.

Attorney route: The OP would have had to shell out at least $500 for a lawyer, plus pay another few hundred dollars for the lab tests. In the end, he'd be out at least $1000 just to get a $600 gun replaced.

At this point, writing to the VP might help. As noted before, consider sending this entire thread to them as well so that they understand that the word will spread. Have you posted to other forums? If so, gather all of them and send it to S&W. The small single-stack market is filled with plenty of competitors so any bad publicity will obviously scare other buyers to other guns. Even with the recall for the Springfield XD-S, there are plenty of people buying it because they know that Springfield will stand by their product. A friend got his XD-S 9mm back from Springfield in a month. You have to make it clear to S&W the damage that negative publicity will have on their main product for the small single-stack market.

Disclaimer: This is not legal advice and should not be construed as such.
 
2001gmc said:
Folks i'm not gonna get a lawer. I'm just gonna harass the hell out of them. I'f i'd got hurt it would have been a different story.
Click to expand...

Exactly what I'm doing with the 2 companies I'm dealing with. At first I was pleasant, but after being insulted, degraded and harassed by them. I'm no longer playing nice. When they leave me a email or voicemail. I'm being quite blunt, and very arrogant towards them. Its working :-). I went from a sales rep, to a supervisor, to a manager, to a district manager and I'm working my way up the chain until I get to someone who is so horrified by the actions of the company that they snap their fingers and fix it :-D. So far so good, every mid level management weenie I talk to is getting more and more reasonable than the last. haha
 
jhc37013 said:
This is exactly why from a business stand point alone S&W should just replace the gun, word gets around and more than a few generations worth of customers could be lost from this one incident. They are treating this as though 1000 other Shield owners are waiting to step forward with a blown up gun and say "hey you replaced his now replace mine", where is the moral ground they seem to be standing on I don't get it the OP was shooting factory ammo and Federal said the rest of the ammo was good.
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^^^ This.

Think how many views this thread has (12,000 and counting), and the reaction if OP was able to post this:

"S&W Rep called me with a Fedex number, they are shipping me a new build Shield 40 at no charge, with a certificate for $500 for anything in their catalog, as a gesture of goodwill."

But I kinda doubt it will happen.

OP, best of luck, I read this thread from top to bottom and am amazed at the lack of Customer focus. Thank God you are ok though.
 
\ I have one question.... can anyone here... without a shadow of doubt say the mishap is the fault of Smith &Wesson...

I am really disappointed to see this mob mentality with absolutely no evidence of who is at fault. In fact, if anything, overcharged is most likely... but I'm no expert nor do I have enough info to even make an educated call ... but it's just sad to see so much negativity directed at S&W...
 
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turbo38gn said:
\ I have one question.... can anyone here... without a shadow of doubt say the mishap is the fault of Smith &Wesson...
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No more than anyone can say the contractor I insured was the cause of someone's home burning down several years ago. But regardless here we are 3+ years later and their insurance carrier is still on the hook for $3 million and counting right now until someone can specifically say they're NOT the cause. It works both ways unfortunately.

I think the path of least resistance (and best goodwill) is for S & W to just give the poor guy something new to replace it. The insurer I represent is fighting for my contractor cause there's $3mm+ at stake - while S & W has a measly $350 gun to deal with - seems insane to not just suck it up and give him a new gun.
 
I hope they rethink their position... I can't say I'm not rethinking mine- I only own one S&W. Hate to think this is how I'll be treated should anything happen down the road :(

Andy Dufresne wrote a letter a week before he got any satisfaction (albeit for 6 years) ... just sayin.

Good luck!

MB
 
I don't disagree with you Bill..... nor do I think S&W shouldn't do anything.. but it's like anything else, no one wants to take responsibility if it isn't their fault.... it opens doors both good and bad..
 
I'm very surprise that S&W didn't replace the gun. The cost to them is insignificant and the good will it would create would be huge. They could have simply sent a letter stating that, "although we believe that the ammunition was to blame for the gun blowing up, we value you as a customer and will replace the gun at no cost to you".
I'm sure if that would have happened the OP would have let us know and there would be a page or two of comments about how great that is. Instead there are five pages of negative comments.
I don't get it.
 
I gotta a question. Call me dumb if you want but how does all the metalergic testing or whatever they call it determine if the gun malfunctioned? Of course all the metal tested to strength or the gun would have completely blew up I'd say.
 
SpringGunTunes said:
You can almost buy a new one for that. Tell them you want your old gun back and you'll send it to your lawyer.
Rob
Click to expand...

I agree. That worked great on Beretta when they sold a gun with a faulty Sear that shot on its own :)

Sent from my VS930 4G using Tapatalk
 
I'm telling you, things haven't been the same since Golden stepped down as CEO.... The new guy Debney changed a lot of things at S&W . You can't even buy parts anymore...
 
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I've posted this before. It is a M&P 45 and although I never got an official decision from Smith or Federal, I think that this was a double charge. The barrel is still locked in battery and did not fail. All of the pressure blew out through the mag well. The gun performed just as it was designed to do. Looking at that Shield, I would guess that the cause was a high primer which caused the gun to fire out of battery. I would also guess that S&W is not going to return the gun because it is unsafe to use in that condition and they don't want to be on the hook. And like one of the previous posted said, the moral of the story is to always, always, always wear eye and ear protection! That goes for non shooting bystanders also!

 
cmj8591 said:
I've posted this before. It is a M&P 45 and although I never got an official decision from Smith or Federal, I think that this was a double charge. The barrel is still locked in battery and did not fail. All of the pressure blew out through the mag well. The gun performed just as it was designed to do. Looking at that Shield, I would guess that the cause was a high primer which caused the gun to fire out of battery. I would also guess that S&W is not going to return the gun because it is unsafe to use in that condition and they don't want to be on the hook. And like one of the previous posted said, the moral of the story is to always, always, always wear eye and ear protection! That goes for non shooting bystanders also!

Click to expand...

So what ever happened about this gun? How long has it been?
 
If you take the offer of the "reduced price" they probably won't send the gun back. If you refuse to take their offer, they should send your gun back because it's your gun.

I find this whole thing very weird. Let me explain why...

I bought a SW1911(#108284) and had feeding issues with it. I called customer service and they told me to send it in for repair. I got it back with a note saying they made a barrel adjustment and test fired; I have no idea what they actually did. Still had the problem. They told me to send it in again, so I did. Came back with the same note. Still had the problem. I called a third time and told them that we weren't making any progress. I asked if there were an alternative. They told me I had three options; send it in again for repair, they send me a new gun OR they return my money. I expressed my unhappiness and requested the refund. I sent them a copy of my receipt. It took about three weeks, but I got a check for the entire amount including tax. That amount was $1,140.33. I really liked that gun and think I just got a lemon. I wouldn't hesitate to buy another if I hadn't already bought something else.

So, I'm stunned at this whole exchange. The price of my gun was almost triple yours and they refunded my money basically on my word that it wasn't working. Of course they got their gun back too. This is why I'm baffled that they haven't offered you at least a refund.
 
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