Shotgun Resurgence?

[Borderboss]

I'm sure this is based on non-gun people thinking that a shotgun is a point-and-shoot weapon that kills the bad guy with the first shot because the shot spreads out and hits the guy with a blanket of lead. The reality couldn't be further from the truth, at least as far as the shot spread is concerned.

I use Federal Tactical Low Recoil #1 Buck in my Kel-Tec KSG (photo below). I patterned the gun because it's the only way to truly know how the gun handles the load at different distances. I got the results I expected, which you can see in the photos below.

The net result is that pretty much any shotgun will be similar to a single large projectile at typical home defense distances, which is under 10 yards (unless you have a really big house). This is why there's a red dot on my KSG.

 

[old tanker]

Norinco made a pretty good 870 clone. All forged parts, no MIM, unlike Remington's current standard 870. Ghost ring sights are handy and effective. If two rounds of buckshot and three slugs are not enough then, "You inna heap'o'trouble...boy!"

 

[6518John]

I have always wondered what the wad would do to a ner-do-well? I suspect after the 00 buck, the wad would be the least of the worries, but I bet that dang thing would leave a mark!

 

[Borderboss]

I have always wondered what the wad would do to a ner-do-well? I suspect after the 00 buck, the wad would be the least of the worries, but I bet that dang thing would leave a mark!

Yeah, it almost seems like an afterthought insult. And one more thing for the surgeon to find.

 

[shocker]

The net result is that pretty much any shotgun will be similar to a single large projectile at typical home defense distances, which is under 10 yards (unless you have a really big house). This is why there's a red dot on my KSG.

Attached, (edit) #8 target load 20 gauge, 10 yds. 14" cylinder bore barrel. #6 game loads about the same pattern size.

 

[SAFireman]

I have always wondered what the wad would do to a ner-do-well? I suspect after the 00 buck, the wad would be the least of the worries, but I bet that dang thing would leave a mark!

At ten yards, with #7 shot, Tac-14, the wad would knock over our target stands

 

[6518John]

OUCH!!!!!!!

 

[Borderboss]

Attached, #6 game load 20 gauge, 10 yds. 14" cylinder bore barrel.

While the target certainly looks devastating, the penetration testing with birdshot shows otherwise. The little pellets don't have enough mass to penetrate to the vital organs, especially after passing through clothing.

After looking at these two videos, I settled on the Federal Tactical #1 Buck. But everyone can do as they like.

Multiple size shot tests

Federal Tactical #1 Buck test

 

[ContinentalOp]

While the target certainly looks devastating, the penetration testing with birdshot shows otherwise. The little pellets don't have enough mass to penetrate to the vital organs, especially after passing through clothing.

There was a news story in the previous city I lived in where an elderly woman used a shotgun with birdshot (don't know the size or the range, but it looked like a modest-sized house) to defend herself against a couple of home invaders, who were later caught. The one who got shot had minor injuries, with most of the shot being stopped by his leather jacket. I guess you could say it worked, though, as both offenders fled immediately after being shot at. Personally, not something I would want to count on. If I go the shotgun route, I'd be leaning towards #1 buck, or #4 buck if I can't find #1.

 

[ContinentalOp]

Not necessarily a bad choice, but might not be the best choice.

I'm not a long gun guy, and my experience shooting shotguns is minimal, but I've also seriously considered getting a long gun for home defense. While a shotgun would be nice to have and would work quite well, for me, personally, I think a pistol caliber carbine (PCC) would suit my needs/wants a bit better, so I'd probably get one of those before a shotgun.

Still wanna get a shotgun, though.

 

[shocker]

I'm sure this guy laughed this off as a "mere flesh wound".

 

[ContinentalOp]

However...for anyone wanting to buy a shotgun for home self defense,I would suggest an autoloader in most any brand.

Again, not a shotgun guy, but when doing my research I found myself leaning towards getting a semi-auto rather than a pump. Not because of difficulty with the pump, though. I've had some training with the Remington 870 and can't recall ever having issues with the pump. Of course, I've also never had to work the pump while someone was trying to kill me. What swayed my thinking was the thought of Special Agent Ed Mireles trying to work an 870 pump one-handed during the 1986 Miami Shootout. I like the idea of self defense guns that can be operated one-handed if necessary, including long guns.

However, I still like the Ithaca 37/87 with its downward shell ejection; if I start getting into long guns, I plan on doing it as a lefty since I'm cross-dominant.

Load it,(including chamber) put the safety on.

This is something I've always been concerned about with long guns. My understanding is that they don't have passive safeties to keep a gun from discharging if dropped, like most handguns do. I've always seen it recommended to keep the mag full but the chamber empty, whether rifle or shotgun, pump or semi-auto, when stored but ready for action if needed, including instructors I've had.

But as I said before, I'm not all that familiar with long guns, so I could be wrong.

 

[Mister X]

Not really surprising. "Just get a shotgun" for home defense is a common recommendation from hunters, backyard shooters or semi-educated gun guys to complete beginners who come to them with questions and are simply wanting a means of self-defense "just in case". Plus they are generally affordable. For me, a shotgun can serve a role or specific niche or even be ideal in certain specific circumstances, but I think they are a terrible choice if only having one gun, especially for an untrained novice.

 

[hkcavalier]

Again, not a shotgun guy, but when doing my research I found myself leaning towards getting a semi-auto rather than a pump. Not because of difficulty with the pump, though. I've had some training with the Remington 870 and can't recall ever having issues with the pump. Of course, I've also never had to work the pump while someone was trying to kill me. What swayed my thinking was the thought of Special Agent Ed Mireles trying to work an 870 pump one-handed during the 1986 Miami Shootout. I like the idea of self defense guns that can be operated one-handed if necessary, including long guns.

However, I still like the Ithaca 37/87 with its downward shell ejection; if I start getting into long guns, I plan on doing it as a lefty since I'm cross-dominant.



This is something I've always been concerned about with long guns. My understanding is that they don't have passive safeties to keep a gun from discharging if dropped, like most handguns do. I've always seen it recommended to keep the mag full but the chamber empty, whether rifle or shotgun, pump or semi-auto, when stored but ready for action if needed, including instructors I've had.

But as I said before, I'm not all that familiar with long guns, so I could be wrong.

I'm cross-eye dominant, shoot long guns left handed, and prefer the Mossberg 500 due to the tang safety.

I do have a semi, a Black Aces (Turkish) that I just couldn't pass up for less than four bills with real walnut furniture. I still really need to break it in, but it's a solid gun.

 

[ContinentalOp]

I'm cross-eye dominant, shoot long guns left handed, and prefer the Mossberg 500 due to the tang safety.

That's another one I've considered. I think Mossberg makes a semi-auto with tang safety, too. 935...? It's been a while since I've looked into them.

 

[hkcavalier]

The 930s should be laid out the same.

Having the ease of visually checking the chamber when firing left handed is a benefit. I never get distracted by shells flying around as I'm looking at the target when shooting.

 

[ContinentalOp]

The 930s should be laid out the same.

Having the ease of visually checking the chamber when firing left handed is a benefit. I never get distracted by shells flying around as I'm looking at the target when shooting.

Cool. Thanks. I'm more worried about getting hit in the face with ejected shells than being visually distracted. That's why I like the Ithaca 37/87 with it's downward ejection, or ARs with case deflectors. I'd rather not get a lefty-specific gun/controls, though.

P.S.: Off topic, but from your username I think we like the same movie.

 

[DWalt]

For home (or other stationary) defense purposes, nothing makes more sense, and is more deadly, than a handy shotgun. I won't get into the merits of types, gauges,or shot sizes as it doesn't make that much difference in results. For me, it's a 12 Gauge pump loaded with #4 Buck.

 

[hkcavalier]

Cool. Thanks. I'm more worried about getting hit in the face with ejected shells than being visually distracted. That's why I like the Ithaca 37/87 with it's downward ejection, or ARs with case deflectors. I'd rather not get a lefty-specific gun/controls, though.

P.S.: Off topic, but from your username I think we like the same movie.

Not many people get it. Movie is over 35 years old now. I don't even know why I started using it as a gun forum username. I think I had just seen the movie again and thought it would be cute.

Just remember, red Lectroids bad, black Lectroids good.

 

[ContinentalOp]

Not many people get it. Movie is over 35 years old now. I don't even know why I started using it as a gun forum username. I think I had just seen the movie again and thought it would be cute.

Just remember, red Lectroids bad, black Lectroids good.

EVIL! PURE AND SIMPLE!