I wonder if this might be the cause of the ADs: https://youtu.be/1uxqUa84hD4?si=I13qetSVuxs7-3Lh
I also wonder if the above applies to manual safeties.
I also wonder if the above applies to manual safeties.
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SIG ordered to pay 11 million for AD
- Thread starter lihpster
- Start date
This is just one of many and I don't think that Glocks are unsafe: https://www.sevendaysvt.com/news/fa...himself-with-easy-to-fire-baby-glock-38744984
Doug M.
Member
I belong to a limited access/not publicly searchable forum in which this was reported from the very start. It was well known and documented from the introduction of the P320. The causation has been guessed at, but I am unaware of anyone coming to a conclusion. The fact that it is not repeatable in part because it does not require any physical act makes coming to a conclusion very difficult.
sigp220.45
US Veteran
I think Sig’s best plan is to continue making guns that go off by themselves and keep paying enormous civil judgements. It will all sort itself out.
LVSteve
Member
This^, and the fact the jury found against Sig with the quoted evidence tells you all you need to know about our legal system.
sigp220.45
US Veteran
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I think, if I recall correctly, that somewhere above or in the links above, it says Sig has won 2
Did not look for it again above, but did find it on Sig's site:
403 Forbidden
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sigp220.45
US Veteran
That looks like 11 settlements and two wins. I’m sure there are lots of happy lawyers.
Rob613
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I think, if I recall correctly, that somewhere above or in the links above, it says Sig has won 13 cases so far, in addition to out of court settlements.
Did not look for it again above, but did find it on Sig's site:
403 Forbidden
Sig has cherry picked which cases they listed, they are missing a few important ones here.
We will never know how many settlements they pay.
sigp220.45
US Veteran
Here is a quote from one of their “wins” - Guay.
The court agrees with Guay the gun went off in the holster without him touching it. He lost because of weird lawyer stuff that makes me glad I don’t deal with lawyers anymore.
The courts will deal with this. Sig will either go bankrupt or deal with it.
I will still shoot and enjoy my various Sigs, including my 320.
The court agrees with Guay the gun went off in the holster without him touching it. He lost because of weird lawyer stuff that makes me glad I don’t deal with lawyers anymore.
The courts will deal with this. Sig will either go bankrupt or deal with it.
I will still shoot and enjoy my various Sigs, including my 320.
Attachments
Expert/Informed Commentary Requested
I would really appreciate it if those of you who have gunsmithing skills, or who understand well the internal workings of striker fired pistols, would watch this three minute video and comment.
The video explains how the internal safety of the P320 can become inadvertently disengaged when installing a trigger group.
I would really appreciate it if those of you who have gunsmithing skills, or who understand well the internal workings of striker fired pistols, would watch this three minute video and comment.
The video explains how the internal safety of the P320 can become inadvertently disengaged when installing a trigger group.
white cloud
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I am an old fuddy duddy but here goes two questions.
Why is carrying a loaded and charged striker fired pistol with a pre-tensioned striker any different than me carrying my S&W 686+ with the hammer cocked? Both have trigger safeties right? BTW, I would never carry the 686 around cocked.
And finally, does anyone remember thumb checking the hammer when holstering up?
Why is carrying a loaded and charged striker fired pistol with a pre-tensioned striker any different than me carrying my S&W 686+ with the hammer cocked? Both have trigger safeties right? BTW, I would never carry the 686 around cocked.
And finally, does anyone remember thumb checking the hammer when holstering up?
I think the difference is that a Sig P320 trigger pull weight is between 5+ lbs and ~8 lbs, whereas a 686 has a single action pull weight of 3-5 lbs (and a DA of 8.5 to 12 lbs.), per my quick internet search just now. And I think a P320 with a trigger pull weight of just over 5 lbs has been worked on to lighten the trigger.
As for me, I want a manual safety on my P320, and, yes, I was taught to place my thumb over the hammer when reholstering a revolver. (The other thing about reholstering is that, for most of us anyway, there is never a need to reholster quickly: While looking, slowly, carefully, reluctantly reholster.)
Holstered guns going off because they are banging into something, as reported in incidents above, are something else, though.
As for me, I want a manual safety on my P320, and, yes, I was taught to place my thumb over the hammer when reholstering a revolver. (The other thing about reholstering is that, for most of us anyway, there is never a need to reholster quickly: While looking, slowly, carefully, reluctantly reholster.)
Holstered guns going off because they are banging into something, as reported in incidents above, are something else, though.
I like Sigs. All of mine are police trades, P6, 229, 226, Sp2340, Sp2009, but I'll never own a 250/320.
A friend has a 250 that's junk and 320s are too iffy for me to consider. If someone gave me either one, I'd immediately flip it to fund a .357sig Sp2022, the only Sig Pro caliber I don't have.
A friend has a 250 that's junk and 320s are too iffy for me to consider. If someone gave me either one, I'd immediately flip it to fund a .357sig Sp2022, the only Sig Pro caliber I don't have.
Model 15-4ever
Member
This.
Let's stop defending sleaze, corruption and incompetent manufacture in the firearms industry. It benefits no one but the greedy to be "circling the wagons" to defend it.
The "Cooked" video posted above concerning SIG and the P320 is worth the 45 minute watch. Well-researched and documented. SIG is completely profit-driven at the expense of safety.
Glock - was sued over mishandling of the firearm by the operator. Largely unsuccessful lawsuits, although some may have been settled. Glock did several upgrades to parts in the early years to correct issues at the margins of abuse, and since identifying a potential issue, immediately makes necessary design changes.
Remington - was successfully sued over the original Model 700 trigger, which was a goofy design easily rendered unsafe through normal use and cleaning. They denied liability even when they knew it was an unsafe design. It contributed to the failure of the company and eventual purchase by the Cereberus Capital, which squeezed profit out of Remington and killed them.
Ruger - was successfully sued 40+ years ago over the original design of the Blackhawk, which allowed accidental discharge when dropped. Regardless of merit of the lawsuit, Ruger made design changes to the revolver, and to this day offers a free safety upgrade to owners of the original guns.
While lawsuits are not uncommon in the industry, and many are frivolous and based on operator error, some are legitimate and based on defective products - either design or fabrication. Pretending otherwise is a disservice to the shooting community.
I've handled dozens of 586/686 guns. I don't ever recall seeing one with a "trigger safety". Please elaborate.
While thumb checking the hammer is indeed a great idea, it seems to be no longer taught in carry or shooting classes. It certainly should be, IMO.
Beretta was once successfully sued by a dazzling urbanite. Seems the lad had his pistol in his dorm room (illegal), dropped the mag, pointed it at someone & pulled the trigger. Yes, the obvious happened.
The lawsuit was based on Beretta not warning the owner the gun would/could fire with the mag out. This is why Beretta's now have a billboard on the side of their slides.
LVSteve
Member
I am utterly baffled by this assertion. Is it now accepted that a dismissed lawsuit must have been settled out of court, or do you have inside info not shown in that list.
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Glock leg?
white cloud;142115462 Why is carrying a loaded and charged striker fired pistol with a pre-tensioned striker any different than me carrying my S&W 686+ with the hammer cocked? [/QUOTE said:
