Sigma Trigger Mod Poll

[mlk18]

Pretty simple; Sigma Trigger Mod Poll. Please only take the poll if you have personally experienced one of the above after modding your Sigma's trigger. Also please post about your first hand experience and what mod you performed. Please do not include second hand info or internet rumors. Also please do not include factory trigger issues, even if a S&W authorized gunsmith did the work. Thanks.

I have modified 2 Sigma triggers; both of which involved polishing and spring removal. None of which have experienced any issues so far. They have exceeded 5,000 rounds between them without malfunction, failure to fire or failure to reset. I will add that I do not use my SW9E for home defense or self defense but would not hesitate doing so.

 

[OKFC05]

Since your poll only allows one choice, I can't effectively use it.
I've experienced all the failures you have listed except "have been held legally liable", whatever that means. I don't work on other's guns, but I guess I could be sued by a customer if they thought I caused them to be injured while taking a class.

To be complete, I should point out that I have used the Sigmas for trainer/loaners for over a decade, and have tried every non-destructive mod for the Sigmas that I know (and reversed all except the polishing). Therefore, I can predict with some accuracy which mod (and there are at least 6 different versions) will cause which effect with which ammunition.

Polishing the slot in the sear block is all to the good and causes no ill effects except for the people who posted they cannot get the gun back together or lose springs. I made an assembly pin to simplify reassembly and have personally had no such troubles.

Replacing the striker spring was too much of a problem to be worth it to me. I let people shoot any standard (non +P) factory ammo, and some of it has too many misfires with the light striker spring to tolerate. My handloads with Federal primers work OK, but I am not licensed to sell handloads to students (Federal law). So I now stick with the stock striker spring.

For range use only with non +P, it is legal to remove the outer sear spring for IDPA, and causes no problems in my range guns. With the WIN LE +P+ 9mm, is fails to reset the sear. I personally won't carry a Sigma with the springs removed or modified, but I use them on the range and let my customers use them that way. The failure mode if somebody slips in hot ammo is the gun just won't fire.

Fooling with the trigger return spring is essentially pointless, as it is insignificant to trigger pull. The gun will actually fire with the trigger spring removed, but you have to push the trigger forward each time: not acceptable for any practical use.

Removing the inner sear spring and keeping the outer leaves undesirable slack in the sear and gives it an odd feel. Keeping the small inner and removing the outer keeps a normal feel.

I experimented with ultra-light sear springs until I got it to fail to reset with almost any ammo, just to see what it would take. Obviously this is a worthless setup, so I returned the stock inner spring.

Based on my experience:
1. polishing is good.
2. removing a sear spring is OK if you don't mind having a range queen for PF 130 ammo only instead of a defense gun.
3. leave the striker spring alone unless you want to limit to Federal Primers.
4. Experimenting with exotic springs is not much help.
5. If I sell a Sigma, I return it to stock spring configuration.

 

[mlk18]

I specifically clicked the button to allow multiple choices on the poll. I presume from your post that it didn't work?

Mods: Can you fix that? Thanks.

 

[leejack]

There's no option for those of us who haven't modified and have no problems. I guess that's not what you're looking for.

 

[cbr6864]

I dont really understand this poll as modded trigger could be almost anything? It could mean anything from fluff n buff to totally replacing the entire trigger assembly.

A person who totally reworked or replaced the trigger may have completely different results than a person who just polished the sear

 

[mtngunr]

Do unintentional discharges from a lightened trigger count as a problem? or is being sued the biggie?

 

[MitchellB]

I did not modify the trigger, just polished the mating surfaces. It has always been smooth and reliable.

 

[mlk18]

Do unintentional discharges from a lightened trigger count as a problem? or is being sued the biggie?

"Unintentional" discharges like your finger was on the trigger, you were pulling back and it went off before you expected? Or "unintentional" like the trigger caught on something and fired?

Being sued means nothing; being held liable is. The legal liability option was based in the fact that after several years of case law review I could not find a single civil or criminal case where trigger modification was a factor in someone being held liable (sans full auto conversions). I have also posted several times on several forums asking for someone to help find a case that did with no results.

 

[chessail 77]

< never modified mine either the .40 or the 9mm

 

[mtngunr]

Unintentional like leather holster collapsing ahead of trigger and firing the gun as you turned while seated, as has happened with Glock-level pulls, much less something lighter....and you may rest assured THAT would result in some litigation, or the hung trigger, if bystanders are injured or killed by bullet or fragments richocheting and hitting them....family members are not immune, either....because the first thing that happens when a gun discharges and people are hurt or killed, or a gun simply discharges in a public place, is that the gun is impounded and examined....and what will they find?....And you will find quite a bit of litigation involved around Glock and glockish guns due to that....some very high profile happenings, as many will recall....the Sigma is fairly well proof against such, if trigger is not lightened appreciably, not talking about smoothing....talking about your advice to lighten because YOU are not looking where you should for problems it might cause....including slanted polls that ignore the safety aspect.

Cop and wife just finished eating Chinese, and preparing to leave...she snapped pics since they both lived through it...what if door had been open and grandma walking by....and they impound and examine your gun?

Now, you still want to tell folk a trigger maybe even lighter than Glock is just fine? And them not know THIS can happen?

 

[cbr6864]

What kind of idiot would carry with trigger unprotected?.....oh it was LEO, seriously though why would you want to mess with the trigger on the Sigma the heavy trigger is there for safety

 

[mlk18]

Safety is obtaining training, practicing those skills and the proper use of your brain. The above holster is obviously worn out and in need of replacement. I don't know an LEO who would put into service that type of holster in that condition with a DAO style auto. That negligent discharge was a direct result of someone not using their brain and had nothing to do with the Glock, a Sigma, a trigger mod or anything else. Mandating a heavy mechanical trigger as a mechanism for safety is the same thinking the liberals use when mandating internal gun locks. You can rely on a heavy trigger, I will use my brain; hopefully at the end of the day neither of us have a negligent discharge. Accidents only happen with diapers and cars.

 

[mtngunr]

Safety is obtaining training, practicing those skills and the proper use of your brain. The above holster is obviously worn out and in need of replacement. I don't know an LEO who would put into service that type of holster in that condition with a DAO style auto. That negligent discharge was a direct result of someone not using their brain and had nothing to do with the Glock, a Sigma, a trigger mod or anything else. Mandating a heavy mechanical trigger as a mechanism for safety is the same thinking the liberals use when mandating internal gun locks.

You, sir, are advising FIRST TIME GUN OWNERS that there is no problem in lightening a pull, while neglecting to mention it is IMPERATIVE that the gun now be carried in a RIGID holster WITH fully covered trigger.....i see negligence....yours.

 

[cbr6864]

Sh@t happens when you carry, even if you have all the training in the world. I carry a DA/SA in a crossbreed supertuck with chamber empty now. I went to holster the firearm and the leather section which was cut to match outline of the gun caught the trigger, thankfully the safety was on.

There are countless examples of glocks accidentally discharging many of them LEOs (simply because they carry more and tend to carry glocks) a lighter trigger doesnt make a better gun by any means.

We can all see you are fully behind modding the trigger which may work great for you, but most who buy the Sigma are new to firearms and come here to seek advise. We should educate those who wish to know about the possible dangers involved in doing any altercations to their firearms.

Sure you might lighten the trigger and on 999 out of 1000 there is no problem but what if that 1 results in someone getting hurt or killed.

 

[mtngunr]

What kind of idiot would carry with trigger unprotected?.....oh it was LEO, seriously though why would you want to mess with the trigger on the Sigma the heavy trigger is there for safety

Next time you need help, call a nun.....both you and the other poster are completely incorrect....that holster was completely serviceable, nothing worn out at all about it, it completely covered the trigger guard AND trigger, the gun was shifted high by movement, and then the leather collapsed on the GALCO rig....

 

[cbr6864]

Next time you need help, call a nun.....both you and the other poster are completely incorrect....that holster was completely serviceable, nothing worn out at all about it, it completely covered the trigger guard AND trigger, the gun was shifted high by movement, and then the leather collapsed on the GALCO rig....

No way was that holster serviceable, even if the gun was pushed up there was too much wear around the trigger making the leather stretch and soften. Leather has no retention so the gun will back out and the trigger will get caught which is why it discharged

 

[mrasgt]

Very well said

This says it all.

Safety is obtaining training, practicing those skills and the proper use of your brain. The above holster is obviously worn out and in need of replacement. I don't know an LEO who would put into service that type of holster in that condition with a DAO style auto. That negligent discharge was a direct result of someone not using their brain and had nothing to do with the Glock, a Sigma, a trigger mod or anything else. Mandating a heavy mechanical trigger as a mechanism for safety is the same thinking the liberals use when mandating internal gun locks. You can rely on a heavy trigger, I will use my brain; hopefully at the end of the day neither of us have a negligent discharge. Accidents only happen with diapers and cars.

 

[mtngunr]

This says it all.

no sir, it doesn't...these are NEW gun owners coming here for advise and "training", if you will....neglecting to mention following advice posted here can cause a tragedy that a new gun owner could not conceive of is plain wrong, and the advice flying in the face of the owner's manual against mods as their sole source of info, does not make the person stupid...it makes the advice giver culpable, no matter how much you wish to insult a new gun owner....we ALL started somewhere, and at least I have not forgotten that.

 

[mtngunr]

No way was that holster serviceable, even if the gun was pushed up there was too much wear around the trigger making the leather stretch and soften. Leather has no retention so the gun will back out and the trigger will get caught which is why it discharged

There wasn't a thing wrong with that holster....except using a leather hideout holster for a hideout gun....but it obviously should have been rigid, preferably plastic for maximum protection....how many NEW gun owners will know that after taking all this wonderful "no problem" trigger mod advice?

 

[John@JCDLESales]

Safety is obtaining training, practicing those skills and the proper use of your brain. The above holster is obviously worn out and in need of replacement. I don't know an LEO who would put into service that type of holster in that condition with a DAO style auto. That negligent discharge was a direct result of someone not using their brain and had nothing to do with the Glock, a Sigma, a trigger mod or anything else. Mandating a heavy mechanical trigger as a mechanism for safety is the same thinking the liberals use when mandating internal gun locks. You can rely on a heavy trigger, I will use my brain; hopefully at the end of the day neither of us have a negligent discharge. Accidents only happen with diapers and cars.

Absolutely!

Leather Holsters Wear Out, Even Galcos as the one pictured was both Worn Out And Galco and probably wasn't correct for the weapon pictured. Most LE Guys find it hard to use clothing allowance funds for what they are meant for. I see it every day with guys coming in with Vests they have Machine Washed for years and Trusted Their Life On Daily.

Plopping down the Getis for new vest must be akin to Giving Up A Kidney from the looks I have seen.

Had that been a Kydex, Poly or Carbon Fiber Holster the picture and situation would have never have happened period. So don't even try to make it a Trigger Issue. Common Sense is the True Issue Here lacking that the picture speaks volumes by itself.

 

[KyWstJoe]

I modded mine and my wifes. Cleaned up all the machine marks, took some torsion outta' the torsion springs and have had no problems. I also took a little off the striker allowing it to break sooner. Shortened the trigger pull a little and I've had no problems. I wouldn't recommend anyone do that, it's a job for a qualified gunsmith. I'll not do that again on a self defense weapon.

 

[Garpo]

Even though I’m a tinkerer, this pistola's trigger is staying in it's stock configuration, as was it‘s intended SD purpose.
Just shoot, practice, and clean.

 

[mlk18]

So far 14 people have taken part in the poll. Hopefully people who were trying to improve their Sigma trigger and not people who were intentionally trying to cause problems or otherwise have a bias against trigger mods. Either way thus far 10 people have had no issues with their post-mod Sigma's and 4 people have. I am hoping to get much higher numbers as I know there are a lot more than 14 people with modded Sigma's.

 

[mlk18]

We are up to 16 votes; 12 no problems and 4 with issues.

 

[Deltaboy]

Pretty simple; Sigma Trigger Mod Poll. Please only take the poll if you have personally experienced one of the above after modding your Sigma's trigger. Also please post about your first hand experience and what mod you performed. Please do not include second hand info or internet rumors. Also please do not include factory trigger issues, even if a S&W authorized gunsmith did the work. Thanks.

I have modified 2 Sigma triggers; both of which involved polishing and spring removal. None of which have experienced any issues so far. They have exceeded 5,000 rounds between them without malfunction, failure to fire or failure to reset. I will add that I do not use my SW9E for home defense or self defense but would not hesitate doing so.

I sent mine back to Smith and they fixed my gritty Double action trigger into a nice 5.5 pound single action feel trigger. For Free Thanks S&W!