Single Shot 32 S&W Barrel Project

[Boulder350]

Chamber Length

After reading Gary's post again about the chamber on his 38 barrel I looked closer at mine. The barrel is marked "32 S. & W. CTG". The standard 32 cartridge drops right in. Looking at the length of the standard 32 cartridge and comparing it to the chamber length, the chamber looks quite a bit longer. Bought some 32 long rounds today and they almost dropped in. The cartridge sticks out about 25 thousandths (.025 of an inch). I can close the barrel but it takes some force. It looks like the brass is hitting the chamber rim, not the lead bullet because there are no marks on the lead. Measured the brass length and it measures .910. If the brass was crimped on the round it probably would chamber just fine.

Do I have a 32 S&W Long barrel or is it the standard 32 S&W Barrel? Maybe they changed the chamber when they milled the bottom of the barrel fancy flat?

Mark

The barrel is marked "Model of 91"

 

[glowe]

I think a pattern might be developing here. Did you say your barrel is not numbered? There were a ton of barrels sold off by the company and ended up on SS pistols and in the hands of collectors. I cannot state with any certainty that the factory used some of these barrels for experimentation, hence the barrel in 38/44 target. Your barrel is 32, but there was also a 32/44 Target round. The dimension of the 32/44 was about an inch (.969" case length). Check the chamber length to the step and let us know the dimension. If it is an inch long, a 32 HR Mag case would be just the ticket. Remember that a 32/44 Target round has a bullet completely seated in the case, while a 32 Long cartridge has the bullet extending and could affect the fit even if there is no mark on the lead?

As I learned by trial and error, too short a case in the chamber and accuracy goes right out the window.

 

[Boulder350]

The single shot 32 barrel is un-numbered.

Have a 32-44 target revolver. Tried the 32 S&W round in the gun and it dropped through the cylinder. The end of the barrel is about .318. The 32 single shot barrel is defiantly not chambered in 32-44 target.

Included a few pictures with rounds in the chamber in the 32 single shot barrel. The first two pictures are of the standard 32 round. The last two pictures are of the 32 long round in the chamber. You can see that the 32 long round does not fully seat in the chamber

 

[ol777gunnerz]

barrel

Here is a photo of my .32 S&W CTG, 10 inch barrel [also un-numbered] on one of my 1st model frames. As shown with a 32 S&W long cartridge in it. Your chamber appears to have been lengthened at some point, like you said.

 

[glowe]

. . . The end of the barrel is about .318 . . .

The bullet used in 32 S&W and 32 Long is only .312", and I believe the bullet used in the 320 Revolving Rifle and 32/44 Target was a .317". If you have a .318 bore, it is big for standard 32 calibers??? Did you measure land or groove dimension in the barrel? I just measured a 32 S&W DA and a 32 Long HE 1903 and got exactly .312" groove and .308" land dimensions, much smaller than .317" in your barrel. A standard .312" bullet used in either of those calibers would rattle down the barrel and not even engage the rifling. How tight is the cartridge in the chamber? The case length for a 32 Long is .93" which is only 1/32" shorter than 32/44 Target brass.

It would certainly be possible that experimentation was done for the 32 Long round, which was introduced in 1903 to see if it could have been used as a target round for the later model SS pistols, but who knows for sure why these barrels were altered?

Can you take a measurement of the chamber for us? Use a micrometer or just slide a wire into the chamber until you feel the step and measure length. Also, check the chamber diameter while you are at it. It would also be interesting if anyone else with a 32 S&W single shot barrel could do the same to compare.

 

[Boulder350]

Ol777gunnerz, thanks for the picture and info on your 32 barrel. Looked at the chamber on my 32 barrel and its blued all the way to the rifling. No recent modifications that I can tell.

Gary, the chamber appears to be .833 long. If you add the case head of the round I have of .052 the total length is .885. The diameter of the chamber is .339. The end of the barrel is .312.

Looks like I will need to handload to get target accuracy. Would need to trim the 32 long case to .880 for best results.

Mark

 

[cgt4570]

Ralph,

The 'drift adjustable' in my pic is the one sitting on top of the non-target. It was an aftermarket mod that installed a leaf in cut groove on a standard non-target latch. It was on my SA 3rd.

Thanks for the clarification about the 1st-2nd models with the clamping screws for windage versus the 3rd models with push screws for windage and elevation. Now I know what parts I've got and what they are called.

Yep, I also have several .44 size target rear sight latches. I think there were 3 varieties of those. The .44DA looks like the .38 SA style, only bigger. The NM#3 is a little different and some have the hammer catch notch while others don't.

 

[glowe]

The .312" bore makes much more sense than the .317". I would say that you have a 32 S&W chamber, little long, but in the ballpark. The 32 S&W cartridge is .92" long, so bullet would sit just short of the rifling.

 

[S&WsRsweet]

No expert here at all but just thinking out loud as I am a little experianced with 32 S&W target loads but have absolutely no experiance with S&W SS barrels just trying to keep up .So the 32 SS barel in question has been possibly modified at some point ? If that be the case is it possible that the modification was made to chamber a 32 S&W long wad cutter round ? Like I said just wondering as target shooters are and in general have been an exacting bunch and I could see if a fellow had the resources and ability where he might have a barel chambered in an exact dimension for an exact load that is his personal favorite and most accurate load .My advice or what I would do as a hand loader would be carefully and slowly trim a 32 S&W long case to exact measurement of chamber maybe just a slight tight fit then load and crimp in a wadcutter at exactly my favorite crimp ( of course no primer or powder for experimentation) and after a couple or three tries probabaly get it right if and this is the big if it was a custom chambered barel made by or for an exacting precision shooter for his or her pet load. Likei said thinking out loud probabaly showing lots of ignorance so dont laugh just feel sorry for me .

 

[NewDeparture]

IIRC, there were some SS pistols having barrels with "Olympic chambers", shorter than standard ones.

However I´m not sure this would be the same thing, since (IIRC) the idea behind an Olympic chamber would be to force the lead into the rifling by means of a shorter throat, and not a shorter chamber lenght.

On the other side of the coin, the .32 S&W Long that appears in the pictures does n´t seem to have a roll crimp (the .32 S&W round in the other pictures has it).

So maybe a .32 S&W Long round with a crimped case will seat just fine in this tight (Olympic style?) chamber.

 

[Boulder350]

Thanks to everyone for their thoughts on this 32 chambering.

It just did not make sense that a target barrel from Smith and Wesson would be so far off from the standard 32 S&W and 32 S&W Long dimensions.

Recently was doing some research on a Merwin Hulbert 4th model Frontier Army I was bidding on. Remembered Merwin had their own 32 long cartridge so looked to see what Art Phelps wrote about the cartridge in his book "The Story of Merwin, Hulbert & Co. Firearms." The cartridge dimensions he lists for the 32 MH&Co. Long will defiantly chamber in my 32 barrel correctly. Art even said that gallery loads were available for the 32 MH&Co. Long cartridge. Further research showed the 32 MH&Co Long was introduced in the mid 1880's, well before the 32 S&W Long was introduced. That also makes it available to be chambered in my barrel marked Model of 91 from S&W.

So for now I'm going to say my barrel is chambered for the 32 MH&Co. Long cartridge. None of the gun makers at that time liked to list another gun makers name on their guns so maybe that's why its stamped 32 S&W CTG? At least that makes sense to me.

 

[NewDeparture]

Very interesting. If bullet dia. is 0.309" then it seems to be smaller than .32 S&W Long bullets (0.314"dia).

Therefore, I would expect bore dimensions for .32 MH & Co to be slightly smaller than the ones for .32 S&W Long. I´m taking a wild guess here, as I´ve never heard before about that very interesting cartridge.

 

[S&WsRsweet]

Wow ! Thanks for coming back with the information on that old cartridge and your barel . As always thre is something to learn on thevS&W forum .

 

[Boulder350]

The display case is done. Bought an older S&W display box. It was a little small so all the items are pretty close together.

Working on hand loads for the 32 barrel. Bought some 32 H&R Magnum cases and trimmed them down to .890" and they fit perfect.