Well, were going to to get it shoved down our throat. The House of Representatives just passed socialist health care bill. Welcome to the the United Socialist States of America.
Socialist Healthcare
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Barnacle Bill
Member
Well,at least now we can all afford to get sick; Out Great grand children will be paying for it....
I don't think anything close to the House Bill that just passed will fly in the Senate. There will be some kind of bill signed into law, but I don't think it will be this one. I would bet that it will be sometime in 2010, probably middle of January before anything is finalized.
I think some Democrats in the H of R will pay dearly for this vote. I know I will work actively with my time and what money I can spare to get my Rep, Sanford Bishop from GA's 2nd District, beat.
I think some Democrats in the H of R will pay dearly for this vote. I know I will work actively with my time and what money I can spare to get my Rep, Sanford Bishop from GA's 2nd District, beat.
klondike
Member
My teenage daughter tells me to not worry because Obama promised to not sign any bill that would either raise taxes or the deficit one dime.
I have failed.
I have failed.
reerc
Member
Our founding fathers are turning over in their graves; the government they gave their lives for looks nothing like the one trying to control our lives. Liberty? Freedom? HA!
Spotteddog
Member
Well,
All I can say is that I'm glad that Misty's Mom, myself and many others on the Forum were lucky enough to get our cardiac surgeries out of the way before Waxman, Pelosi, Hoyer, Markey and the rest of the usual suspects installed their boards of review and eligibility panels.
All I can say is that I'm glad that Misty's Mom, myself and many others on the Forum were lucky enough to get our cardiac surgeries out of the way before Waxman, Pelosi, Hoyer, Markey and the rest of the usual suspects installed their boards of review and eligibility panels.
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Hofstet
Member
Read this from the Wall Street Journal, it will really make you sick:
Betsy McCaughey: What the Pelosi Health Care Bill Really Says - WSJ.com
Betsy McCaughey: What the Pelosi Health Care Bill Really Says - WSJ.com
BarbC
Member
H.R. 3962 (1990 pages) http://docs.house.gov/rules/health/111_ahcaa.pdf
''SEC. 59B. TAX ON INDIVIDUALS WITHOUT ACCEPTABLE HEALTH CARE COVERAGE.
''(a) TAX IMPOSED.—In the case of any individual who does not meet the requirements of subsection (d) at any time during the taxable year, there is hereby imposed a tax equal to 2.5 percent of the excess of—
''(1) the taxpayer's modified adjusted gross in come for the taxable year, over
''(2) the amount of gross income specified in section 6012(a)(1) with respect to the taxpayer.
-------------------------
SEC. 512. HEALTH CARE CONTRIBUTIONS OF NON
''SEC. 59B. TAX ON INDIVIDUALS WITHOUT ACCEPTABLE HEALTH CARE COVERAGE.
''(a) TAX IMPOSED.—In the case of any individual who does not meet the requirements of subsection (d) at any time during the taxable year, there is hereby imposed a tax equal to 2.5 percent of the excess of—
''(1) the taxpayer's modified adjusted gross in come for the taxable year, over
''(2) the amount of gross income specified in section 6012(a)(1) with respect to the taxpayer.
-------------------------
SEC. 512. HEALTH CARE CONTRIBUTIONS OF NON
ELECTING EMPLOYERS.
''(c) EMPLOYERS ELECTING NOT TO PROVIDE HEALTH BENEFITS.—
''(1) IN GENERAL.—In addition to other taxes, there is hereby imposed on every nonelecting employer an excise tax, with respect to having individuals in his employ, equal to 8 percent of the wages (as defined in section 3121(a)) paid by him with respect to employment (as defined in section 3121(b)).
''(2) SPECIAL RULES FOR SMALL EMPLOYERS.—
''(A) IN GENERAL.—In the case of any employer who is small employer for any calendar year, paragraph (1) shall be applied by substituting the applicable percentage determined in accordance with the following table for '8 percent':
''If the annual payroll of such employer for the preceding calendar year:
The applicable percentage is:
Does not exceed $500,000 ............................... 0 percent
Exceeds $500,000, but does not exceed $585,000 2 percent
Exceeds $585,000, but does not exceed $670,000 4 percent
Exceeds $670,000, but does not exceed $750,000 6 percent
''(B) SMALL EMPLOYER.—For purposes of this paragraph, the term 'small employer' means any employer for any calendar year if the annual payroll of such employer for the preceding calendar year does not exceed $750,000.
-----------------------------------------------------
''SEC. 4980H. ELECTION WITH RESPECT TO HEALTH COVERAGE PARTICIPATION REQUIREMENTS.
''SEC. 4980H. ELECTION WITH RESPECT TO HEALTH COVERAGE PARTICIPATION REQUIREMENTS.
''(a) ELECTION OF EMPLOYER RESPONSIBILITY TO PROVIDE HEALTH COVERAGE.—
''(b) EXCISE TAX WITH RESPECT TO FAILURE TO MEET HEALTH COVERAGE PARTICIPATION REQUIREMENTS.—
''(1) IN GENERAL.—In the case of any employer who fails (during any period with respect to which the election under subsection (a) is in effect) to satisfy the health coverage participation requirements with respect to any employee to whom such election applies, there is hereby imposed on each such failure with respect to each such employee a tax of $100 for each day in the period beginning on the date such failure first occurs and ending on the date such failure is corrected.
--------------------------------------------------------------
''Subchapter D—Medical Devices
''SEC. 4061. MEDICAL DEVICES.
''(a) IN GENERAL.—There is hereby imposed on the first taxable sale of any medical device a tax equal to 2.5 percent of the price for which so sold.
-------------------
SEC. 322. PREMIUMS AND FINANCING.
(a) ESTABLISHMENT OF PREMIUMS.—
(a) ESTABLISHMENT OF PREMIUMS.—
(1) IN GENERAL.—The Secretary shall establish geographically adjusted premium rates for the public health insurance option—
(A) in a manner that complies with the premium rules established by the Commissioner under section 213 for Exchange-participating health benefits plans; and(B) at a level sufficient to fully finance the costs of—
(i) health benefits provided by thepublic health insurance option; and
(ii) administrative costs related to operating the public health insurance option.
(ii) administrative costs related to operating the public health insurance option.
(2) CONTINGENCY MARGIN.—In establishing premium rates under paragraph (1), the Secretary shall include an appropriate amount for a contingency margin (which shall be not less than 90 days of estimated claims). Before setting such appropriateamount for years starting with Y3, the Secretary shall solicit a recommendation on such amount from the American Academy of Actuaries.
(b) ACCOUNT.—
(1) ESTABLISHMENT.—There is established in the Treasury of the United States an Account for the receipts and disbursements attributable to the operation of the public health insurance option, including the start-up funding under paragraph (2). Section 1854(g) of the Social Security Act shall apply to receipts described in the previous sentence in the same manner as such section applies to payments or premiums described in such section.
(1) ESTABLISHMENT.—There is established in the Treasury of the United States an Account for the receipts and disbursements attributable to the operation of the public health insurance option, including the start-up funding under paragraph (2). Section 1854(g) of the Social Security Act shall apply to receipts described in the previous sentence in the same manner as such section applies to payments or premiums described in such section.
(2) START-UP FUNDING.—
(A) IN GENERAL.—In order to provide for the establishment of the public health insurance option, there is hereby appropriated to the Secretary, out of any funds in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, $2,000,000,000.
In order to provide for initial claims reserves before the collection of premiums, there are hereby appropriated to the Secretary, out of any funds in the Treasury not otherwise appropriated, such sums as necessary to cover 90 days worth of claims reserves based on projected enrollment.
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This legislation is a disaster for our Nation's health care system.
And if you are a senior citizen, do not think you are going to be exempt from the draconian effects of this legislation! Far from it - you are squarely in the cross hairs.
And if you are a senior citizen, do not think you are going to be exempt from the draconian effects of this legislation! Far from it - you are squarely in the cross hairs.
Lomax Anderson
Member
...we have a rocky road to recovery...looks like I'll be heading back to DC...God help us all
The 40% reduction in Medicare costs will eliminate numerous procedures, as the hospitals and physicians can't do them for free. If you have anything that needs to be addressed, get it done in thenext year before this goes into effect.
Hofstet
Member
November 5, 2009
THE NEW HOUSE BILL: WHAT'S HIDDEN IN THE 1,990 PAGES?
The consolidated House bill that Nancy Pelosi will bring to the floor for a vote (H.R. 3962) is 1,990 pages. Few Congressmen will read it, and the public will find the task even more daunting.
Here are some of the items slipped into the oversized bill. You won't find these disclosed by The New York Times or highlighted on CNN.
1) CAN YOU KEEP YOUR INSURANCE IF YOU LIKE IT? NO!
Sec. 202 (pp. 91-92 on this site) "Protecting the Choice to Keep Current Insurance" – This section does just the opposite. It says if you get your health plan through your job, your employer will have a "grace period" and then will have to enroll you in the plan the government wants you to have. If you buy your own insurance, you won't have a grace period. As soon as anything changes in your current contract – co-pay, deductible, term or benefit (the kinds of things often adjusted yearly) you will have to give up your current plan and enroll in the plan the "qualified plan" the government wants you to have.
2) HOW MUCH WILL YOU HAVE TO PAY FOR YOUR LEGALLY REQUIRED PLAN?
Sec. 224 (b) (p. 118 on this site) provides that eighteen months after the bill is passed, the Secretary of Health and Human Services will announce what the benefits package is and how much the benefits package will cost.
This is like if a banker handing you a loan agreement today, saying "sign here" and 18 months later filling in the interest rate and the repayment terms.
The Congressional Budget Office, however, issued a report to Congressman Charles Rangel on November 2, on what you will be legally required to pay for mandatory health insurance. If you're an individual earning $44,000 before taxes, you will have to pay $5,300 for the premium and estimated $2000 in out of pocket costs for a total of $7,300 a year. That's 17% of your pre-tax income.
If you're a family earning $102,100 a year before taxes, you'll have to pay a $15,000 premium plus an estimated $5,300 out of pocket, totaling $20,300 or 20% of your pre-tax income.
For the entire chart of what you will have to pay, go to cbo.gov .
3) COMPARATIVE EFFECTIVENESS RESEARCH WILL BE USED TO DETERMINE WHAT DOCTORS SHOULD PROVIDE FOR THEIR PATIENTS UNDER MEDICARE AND OTHER GOVERNMENT PROGRAMS.
TITLE IV, Subtitle A, Sec. 1401 (p. 756 on this site): A comparative effectiveness
research center is established, and one of its duties is to "assist the users of health
information technology focused on clinical decision support to promote the timely
incorporation of such findings into clinical practices…" The bill goes on to specify that
the Center shall "ensure" that its findings are used for "more effective and efficient
decisions regarding medical items and services."
4) The President has stated that he intends to reduce future Medicare funding over the
next decade by an estimated $500 billion, though some 30% more people will be
enrolling as the babyboomers turn 65. The numbers don't add up. Yet despite these
severe cuts in future funding, and the reduction in access to medical care that will result,
the bill shifts priorities to fund these new services:
"REIMBURSEMENT FOR CULTURALLY AND LINGUISTICALLY
APPROPRIATE SERVICES," found in Sec. 222 (p. 617 on this site).
This new demonstration program will "notify Medicare beneficiaries of their right to
receive language services in their primary language," and ensure that there are no co-pays
for language services. A special cultural sensitivity program is also established for
providing health care on the U.S.-Mexican border area.
RACIAL AND ETHNIC PREFERENCES: You will find numerous examples in the bill.
Here are a few:
"Sec. 2521: Comprehensive Programs to Provide Education to Nurses and Create a
Pipeline to Nursing.
(g) PREFERENCE – In awarding grants under this section the Secretary shall give
preference to programs that
(2) provide for improving the diversity of the new nurse graduates to reflect changes in
the demographics of the patient population"
"Sec. 2533 Secondary School Health Sciences Training Program…
(d) PREFERENCE - In awarding grants and contracts under subsection (b), the Secretary
shall give preference to entities that have a demonstrated record of at least one of the
following:
(1) Graduating a high or significantly improved percentage of students who have
exhibited mastery in secondary school State science standards.
(2) Graduating students from disadvantaged backgrounds, including racial and ethnic
minorities …"
"Sec. 399V Grants to Promote Positive Health Behaviors and Outcomes (p1422 on this
site) (b) USE OF FUNDS – Grants awarded under subsection (a) shall be used to
support community health workers
(1) to educate, guide, and provide outreach in a community setting regarding health
problems prevalent in medically underserved communities, especially racial and
ethnic minority populations"
THESE PROGRAMS ARE A PIPELINE FOR MONEY TO BUY VOTES AND POLITICAL INFLUENCE
Hundreds of pages devoted to establishing funded programs for outreach into communities, with funding designated for entities that are vaguely defined except for having "documented community activity and experience with community health workers". Sec. 399V cited above is an example. The purpose is to "educate, guide, and provide experiential learning opportunities that target behavioral risk factors including poor nutrition, smoking, and obesity. "Each community health worker program receiving funds under the grant will provide services in the cultural context most appropriate for the individual served by the program."
These programs will "enhance the capacity of individuals to utilize health services and health-related social services under Federal, State, and local programs by assisting individuals in establishing eligibility under the programs and in receiving services or other benefits of the programs and
Providing other services …that may include transportation and translation services."
GRANDMA HAS TO GIVE UP GETTING A NEW HIP OR KNEE BUT THERE IS PLENTY OF MONEY FOR THIS!
THE NEW HOUSE BILL: WHAT'S HIDDEN IN THE 1,990 PAGES?
The consolidated House bill that Nancy Pelosi will bring to the floor for a vote (H.R. 3962) is 1,990 pages. Few Congressmen will read it, and the public will find the task even more daunting.
Here are some of the items slipped into the oversized bill. You won't find these disclosed by The New York Times or highlighted on CNN.
1) CAN YOU KEEP YOUR INSURANCE IF YOU LIKE IT? NO!
Sec. 202 (pp. 91-92 on this site) "Protecting the Choice to Keep Current Insurance" – This section does just the opposite. It says if you get your health plan through your job, your employer will have a "grace period" and then will have to enroll you in the plan the government wants you to have. If you buy your own insurance, you won't have a grace period. As soon as anything changes in your current contract – co-pay, deductible, term or benefit (the kinds of things often adjusted yearly) you will have to give up your current plan and enroll in the plan the "qualified plan" the government wants you to have.
2) HOW MUCH WILL YOU HAVE TO PAY FOR YOUR LEGALLY REQUIRED PLAN?
Sec. 224 (b) (p. 118 on this site) provides that eighteen months after the bill is passed, the Secretary of Health and Human Services will announce what the benefits package is and how much the benefits package will cost.
This is like if a banker handing you a loan agreement today, saying "sign here" and 18 months later filling in the interest rate and the repayment terms.
The Congressional Budget Office, however, issued a report to Congressman Charles Rangel on November 2, on what you will be legally required to pay for mandatory health insurance. If you're an individual earning $44,000 before taxes, you will have to pay $5,300 for the premium and estimated $2000 in out of pocket costs for a total of $7,300 a year. That's 17% of your pre-tax income.
If you're a family earning $102,100 a year before taxes, you'll have to pay a $15,000 premium plus an estimated $5,300 out of pocket, totaling $20,300 or 20% of your pre-tax income.
For the entire chart of what you will have to pay, go to cbo.gov .
3) COMPARATIVE EFFECTIVENESS RESEARCH WILL BE USED TO DETERMINE WHAT DOCTORS SHOULD PROVIDE FOR THEIR PATIENTS UNDER MEDICARE AND OTHER GOVERNMENT PROGRAMS.
TITLE IV, Subtitle A, Sec. 1401 (p. 756 on this site): A comparative effectiveness
research center is established, and one of its duties is to "assist the users of health
information technology focused on clinical decision support to promote the timely
incorporation of such findings into clinical practices…" The bill goes on to specify that
the Center shall "ensure" that its findings are used for "more effective and efficient
decisions regarding medical items and services."
4) The President has stated that he intends to reduce future Medicare funding over the
next decade by an estimated $500 billion, though some 30% more people will be
enrolling as the babyboomers turn 65. The numbers don't add up. Yet despite these
severe cuts in future funding, and the reduction in access to medical care that will result,
the bill shifts priorities to fund these new services:
"REIMBURSEMENT FOR CULTURALLY AND LINGUISTICALLY
APPROPRIATE SERVICES," found in Sec. 222 (p. 617 on this site).
This new demonstration program will "notify Medicare beneficiaries of their right to
receive language services in their primary language," and ensure that there are no co-pays
for language services. A special cultural sensitivity program is also established for
providing health care on the U.S.-Mexican border area.
RACIAL AND ETHNIC PREFERENCES: You will find numerous examples in the bill.
Here are a few:
"Sec. 2521: Comprehensive Programs to Provide Education to Nurses and Create a
Pipeline to Nursing.
(g) PREFERENCE – In awarding grants under this section the Secretary shall give
preference to programs that
(2) provide for improving the diversity of the new nurse graduates to reflect changes in
the demographics of the patient population"
"Sec. 2533 Secondary School Health Sciences Training Program…
(d) PREFERENCE - In awarding grants and contracts under subsection (b), the Secretary
shall give preference to entities that have a demonstrated record of at least one of the
following:
(1) Graduating a high or significantly improved percentage of students who have
exhibited mastery in secondary school State science standards.
(2) Graduating students from disadvantaged backgrounds, including racial and ethnic
minorities …"
"Sec. 399V Grants to Promote Positive Health Behaviors and Outcomes (p1422 on this
site) (b) USE OF FUNDS – Grants awarded under subsection (a) shall be used to
support community health workers
(1) to educate, guide, and provide outreach in a community setting regarding health
problems prevalent in medically underserved communities, especially racial and
ethnic minority populations"
THESE PROGRAMS ARE A PIPELINE FOR MONEY TO BUY VOTES AND POLITICAL INFLUENCE
Hundreds of pages devoted to establishing funded programs for outreach into communities, with funding designated for entities that are vaguely defined except for having "documented community activity and experience with community health workers". Sec. 399V cited above is an example. The purpose is to "educate, guide, and provide experiential learning opportunities that target behavioral risk factors including poor nutrition, smoking, and obesity. "Each community health worker program receiving funds under the grant will provide services in the cultural context most appropriate for the individual served by the program."
These programs will "enhance the capacity of individuals to utilize health services and health-related social services under Federal, State, and local programs by assisting individuals in establishing eligibility under the programs and in receiving services or other benefits of the programs and
Providing other services …that may include transportation and translation services."
GRANDMA HAS TO GIVE UP GETTING A NEW HIP OR KNEE BUT THERE IS PLENTY OF MONEY FOR THIS!
If we don't take back our country in 2010, it's over. The socialist plan will be validated, AND emboldened. Who knows what comes after that. Scary times indeed.
Anyone know about New Zealand or Australia? How about some of the Latin America countries that Americans are flocking to, like Costa Rica? Maybe one can live good there, even though the dollar appears headed to the scrapheap.
I suspect no guns in Costa Rica, but so what, you think they're gonna allow guns here?
Anyone know about New Zealand or Australia? How about some of the Latin America countries that Americans are flocking to, like Costa Rica? Maybe one can live good there, even though the dollar appears headed to the scrapheap.
I suspect no guns in Costa Rica, but so what, you think they're gonna allow guns here?
Texas Star
US Veteran
I am more frightened to be an American now than at any time in my life. More than during the Cold War, when Soviet bombers and missles arriving was a possibility.
And the Dems have the votes to pass their bills even if every Republican voted against them, Olympia Snow included.
T-Star
And the Dems have the votes to pass their bills even if every Republican voted against them, Olympia Snow included.
T-Star
Senior Citizen
Member
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2004
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- 712
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- 26
What does this mean to retired Military with Tri-Care
I'm a simple fellow. And sometimes no "overly bright". So what exactly does this mean to us military retirees with Tri-care. Are we gonna get to keep it or loose it and have to buy the government insurance?
confused,
Lee
XXXXXXXXX
I'm a simple fellow. And sometimes no "overly bright". So what exactly does this mean to us military retirees with Tri-care. Are we gonna get to keep it or loose it and have to buy the government insurance?
confused,
Lee
deralte
US Veteran
Lee, you are already under a government plan. Our only problem is how much they cut the plan to give it to someone that doesn't want to work. They have all of us looking at bills like the health care when in fact they only want to gain control over our lives. How do you spell "Dictatorship".
marvin the martian
Member
For once I'm actually looking forward to elections!
