Tapping Aluminum Frame (grip screws) Para Wide Body

[SW CQB 45]

a buddy was given an alum frame dbl stack 45 acp 1911 by one of his buddies.

apparently the original owner stripped out the aluminum threads and used some sort of expoy to glue the grip panels back on.

as you guessed, the glue traveled inside the action and locked the gun up.

now comes me. The gun was given to me to see if I could fix. I was able to take apart by scraping and driving stuff out and it cleaned ok except for the frame which has a dried glue on the exterior.

I called ParaOrd just to see what a new frame would cost and the service tech on the phone could not stop laughing. it is funny.

the new owner of the gun asked me if I could thread/tap the stripped threads.

here are my questions with those experienced with tapping alloy gun frame. (my experience tapping was oilfied and no where as delicate as this surface)

I have a brownells tap kit at work and the current grip screw holes (with stripped threads) are around .017".

the next size up would be 10-32 threads which the drill bit is around .02".

the outside diameter of the integral tang (grip screw area) for the threads is about .0215" so that does not give me much to play with,

but what concerns me is the thickness of these raised integral tangs is approx 1/8" and with a 10-32 thread, (32 threads per inch)

that gives me about 3 to 4 threads.

these are only grip screws, and I need to find appropriate grip screws to modify to fit.

does 3 to 4 threads raise any red flags for grip screws????

I do plan to back up the screw with pipe dope with teflon so it does not back out during recoil.

thanks for looking.

 

[SW CQB 45]

a buddy was given an alum frame dbl stack 45 acp 1911 by one of his buddies.

apparently the original owner stripped out the aluminum threads and used some sort of expoy to glue the grip panels back on.

as you guessed, the glue traveled inside the action and locked the gun up.

now comes me. The gun was given to me to see if I could fix. I was able to take apart by scraping and driving stuff out and it cleaned ok except for the frame which has a dried glue on the exterior.

I called ParaOrd just to see what a new frame would cost and the service tech on the phone could not stop laughing. it is funny.

the new owner of the gun asked me if I could thread/tap the stripped threads.

here are my questions with those experienced with tapping alloy gun frame. (my experience tapping was oilfied and no where as delicate as this surface)

I have a brownells tap kit at work and the current grip screw holes (with stripped threads) are around .017".

the next size up would be 10-32 threads which the drill bit is around .02".

the outside diameter of the integral tang (grip screw area) for the threads is about .0215" so that does not give me much to play with,

but what concerns me is the thickness of these raised integral tangs is approx 1/8" and with a 10-32 thread, (32 threads per inch)

that gives me about 3 to 4 threads.

these are only grip screws, and I need to find appropriate grip screws to modify to fit.

does 3 to 4 threads raise any red flags for grip screws????

I do plan to back up the screw with pipe dope with teflon so it does not back out during recoil.

thanks for looking.

 

[sar4937]

I'm not a gunsmith, so this advice comes from an auto mechanic. Normally you would determine the thread pitch and diameter of the original grip screws. Then if available, you would buy a Helicoil kit that would come with a drillbit, oversized tap, helicoil inserts and an installation tool. The inserts are stainless steel and will allow the reuse of the proper grip screw. Be sure to get the proper depth insert (match how deep the threaded hole is). Or you could install Colt style bushings and screws. Brownells probably sells a tap for that size.

 

[SW CQB 45]

para grips are super thin and I am unable to use that setup (1911 grip bushings)

I have thought about helicoils, but have never used them so I have no experience.

thanks

 

[shovelwrench]

I know oversized grip bushings are available. As far as the thickness of the grips, it would just be a matter of filing the bushing down till the grip fit. Or modify the grip slightly.

I would think your only other option is to machine a threaded insert with a stop shoulder, tap the hole to match stock location and modify the grips if neccessary.

You might be able to find someone willing to tig the holes shut. Should'nt cause a strength issue considering where its located. If the alloy is tigable.

 

[shovelwrench]

It sure looks like if you filed the raised area around the hole flush with the frame, leaving the top hole stick up above where the frame begins to taper(to give yourself full bearing surface), you should be able to use a grip bushing.

 

[sar4937]

Are you aware that there are thin grip bushings and screws for 1911's? You could dress down the screw and bushings as required. The screwdriver slot could be ground off after setting in loctite. It would be better to work off your existing holes than to weld up and start over. The only pix I could find http://www.esmeralda.cc/slender_series_grips.htm

 

[SW CQB 45]

I guess I forgot to add in my original post that the new owner is looking for the most cost effective means to re thread and install the factory grips back on.

the ones that were glued on with hogue rubbers and those are basically trashed after they were ripped off.

I need to re search what the thread size is for the thin bushings, and I doubt they make thin bushings for oversized holes, but I will look into that.

thanks for the advice.

any additional comments are welcomed.

 

[shovelwrench]

You're right, no thin, oversized bushings. But I did find the regular oversized bushings HERE.

Here is your regular, thin bushings.

HERE is taps and some more bushings.

Hope this helps. If the oversized are necessary, just remember, you can file them down near flush as long as they are staked or loctited.

 

[SW CQB 45]

thanks SW for the info.

one area of concern for oversized is the top screw hole on both sides.

if you notice the tang happens to be located where the frame reduces in size for the tapered mag.

if the oversized bushing is wider than the tang (which I measured at approx .215"), I will have nothing to screw to on the top side of those holes as the drill will have removed the tang.

again, thanks for the info.

 

[shovelwrench]

One other way I have fixed holes in aluminum (motorcycle parts) is to tap the hole, make a threaded peice to screw in, red loctite it, then drill the original hole in my filler peice.

At .215, even the standard bushing tap will be too large. (.236-60) 7/32=.21875

 

[sar4937]

If the Para uses bushings why not remove and replace them, are they swedged in? I'm guessing Para does not offer a way to replace the bushings. If solidly swedged, I would grind them flush and tap for standard sized bushings. I would use the old bushing as a bung.

 

[shovelwrench]

I'm gettin the impresion they're cast in the frame. I have to get mine from my dad and look, but I'm pretty sure. If you look at the metal in the hole it sure looks like aluminum.

 

[sar4937]

My Springfield looks similar but is steel. I wonder if any of the other doublestack 1911 supplier's use a replaceable insert specific to the doublestack. Like STI/SVI, or Springfield.

 

[SW CQB 45]

there are no bushings in the para frame.

the once threaded tang is integral or cast part of the frame.

 

[shovelwrench]

One thing we did'nt consider....JB weld..YEAH YEAH I KNOW. But, I have used it for filling stripped holes and retapping before. If it turns out too weak, your just back where you started anyway.

 

[m1gunner]

You want cost effective? How about some dead soft aluminum rivets. If you can buck them from the back side, they can be easily driven and upset without any further damage to the frame. Grips are seldom removed anyway. And the rivets come right out with a steel drill.

Plus, they won't work loose like screws.

 

[sar4937]

As long as JB Weld has been brought up, Loctite sells a thread restoration product that you coat things with, assemble, and the threads harden. I have never used it, no professional would, but Loctite is a reputable company. I you use an epoxy, a piece of masking tape on the inside of the magwell will finish the back of the hole and peal right off, leaving the finish flat and smooth.

 

[SW CQB 45]

OK, you folks have peaked my interest in the area of simiplicity.

The rivet deal is a good idea but the problem with para dbl stack frames, the grips have a provision to cover the trigger channel and if you go into the guts, the grips have to come off on a para

The JB weld and Loctite threads I will try first. If I screw this up, we are back where we started.

I may try the loctite version first since that would be the least work as I would have to thread JB Weld.

thanks for all the suggestions.

I will let you know what works and if the loctite or JB Weld is successful, it may take a gingerly hand behind the screwdriver to not strip them out.

Hell, now that I think of it, I dont even have a set of Para screws.

The original owner threw them away.

 

[sar4937]

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewP...productNumber=986916 http://store.summitracing.com/...&img=lct- <a <a [url=http://www.permatex.com/products/Automotive/specialized_maintenance_repair/professional_repair_systems/Permatex_Stripped_Thread_Repair.htm]http://www.permatex.com/produc...ed_Thread_Repair.htm