Thoughts on the Ammo Situation

[Ammobob]

I realize I am new around here, so please forgive me if this topic is not allowed, or if it in an improper place, I am still trying to learn the ropes so to speak. As I sit back and look at the current ammo situation, especially regarding .22 LR cartridges, I find myself thinking some things I never thought I would. And again, I mean this in no way to be disrespectful to anyone, just some general thoughts, right or wrong. It seems to me that most places I check or keep up with are getting a fair amount of ammo in on a pretty regular basis. Now granted nowhere near optimum levels, but I am seeing 10's of thousands if not more of rounds in circulation (new stock) each week, from several retailers.

I used to think that the shortage was coming from the people who have nothing better to do but stand in line at your major chains, or sit on their computer all day with alerts set up, and they are buying everything that comes out, as fast as it comes out, no matter what the price; only to resell at crazy prices. (and your just plain panic ammo confiscation buyers and other assorted conspiracy theorists) And we have ALL seen previously reputable companies cash in on the frenzy by charging ludicrous amounts for their ammo. However, quite a few places have kept their prices normal, but not many.

I see this as gun guys taking advantage of other gun guys, but that's for another thread. And for the record I know how the free market, economics, supply & demand and all that jaz works, and would have it no other way, but TO ME there comes a point when it becomes unethical. Anyway moving on.

While this certainly is happening quite often, another trend I see is people with massive stocks (gun guys) buying up everything in sight as well just to sit on, which doesn't help at all. Now a man should be able to buy whatever he wants, and however much of it he wants, but TO ME, 10k rounds of .22lr and still snapping up everything in sight seems a little excessive.

Especially when there are people (hundreds of thousands) brand new to shooting over the past 6 months or so, who have their first guns, but can't get any ammo. And then you have people caught with their pants down for whatever reason, (and it's not always lack of planning) that can't get ammo.

I'll try to wind this to a point. Doesn't it seem like gun owners are hurting gun owners by some of this behavior? And doesn't it seem like if you already have 5k-10k rounds of 22lr, (knowing there is no real confiscation or whatever going on) that those of us so well stocked should leave a little meat on the bone for others less fortunate?

I don't know, maybe I shouldn't post at 2am. I am just trying to make sense of this situation, and it seems like a lot of gun people, and gun stores, are using this "crisis" to hurt people financially more than is necessary. Maybe I just have a problem with what I see as out and out greed or unethical pricing.

As I said, I am not trying to start a war, or get people all upset, just trying to wrap my head around all of these things we find going on. I will never accept that it is not unethical to sell a 500 count box of .22 thunderbolt, that you paid $20 for, and turn around and resell it to a desperate person for $500. I am all for making a decent profit, but some of this I see really turns my stomach.

I'm sure plenty will say I am wrong, and that's okay. I just believe that ethics and integrity are worth a considerable amount more to me than hurting someone to make wads of cash, and it is my opinion that some pricing I have seen out there crosses the line. Makes me feel like some of these people would do the same with water or food. Doesn't that bother anyone anymore?

Anyway, I am done. I hope this doesn't get deleted without a chance for fair discussion, and I certainly hope I was respectful and didn't come off as nasty or hurtful to anyone.

Happy Shooting. -Bob

 

[strobro32]

Hi Bob. Welcome.

I'm going to be direct. I love to shoot rimfire. I have a lot of .22 ammo. I have been collecting .22 LR for 10 years because I've been caught in the many gun buying frenzies. I have not bought any since Sandyhook. I have sold some recently because lead is gold right now.

Ammo is not food, at least not yet. You have no right to have it at cheap prices. The only right you have to it is slowly being chipped away every day. The "fair market" is just that. I think it's time to read The Little Red Hen again. The Little Red Hen - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm sorry this has happened to you. The bullets will come back soon. I'm sure you will become like some of us an put a few extra away. Remember, the next ammo shortage is only another school shooting or election away. Good luck to you Sir.

 

[RedNeck Jim]

Now a man should be able to buy whatever he wants, and however much of it he wants, but TO ME, 10k rounds of .22lr and still snapping up everything in sight seems a little excessive.

Interesting comment... one that looks like two completely different people wrote. In one sentence you state one should be able to buy however much ammo he wants and in the same sentence state anything above some arbitrary number you have set is excessive.

You can't have it both ways. Either you are for a free market... or you aren't. Be like me telling my wife 10 pair of shoes is enough. To some 10 pair is enough but I sure don't want the government or anyone else sticking their nose into her business telling her what they think is enough. Same with any other, non essential commodity... such as guns and ammo.

 

[arjay]

I don't see the problem here.A guy can buy and sell what he wants at whatever price the market will bear.Or he can hoard it if he likes,but part of the price he will pay is that some will judge him an ******* for doing it.

 

[bobkatwells]

I understand where you are coming from Ammobob. I'm sure like just about everyone else I really can't wait until the ammo situation stabilizes. The times I have gone early in the morning to find 9mm ammo I always see the same people already there and my first thought is- don't these guys have a job??? Sometimes they show up around midnight and wait there all night. Last week there was a guy like that who said all he wanted was .22 lr and had some 9mm in his car and if anyone could get .22 he would trade for 9mm and I thought about it. Once the store opened , he snatched up a big bulk box of 9mm and when I made it to the counter they were out of nines but had several boxes of 525 rds of .22. I decided not to play that game and not get any ammo I didn't need and let someone behind me get it.

But this is how bad the ammo situation is. I'm all for a free market, but when these hoarders and scalpers try to profit from a new gun owner ....well, I'll leave it alone.

 

[diducmeb4]

I liken the situation to what the defense contractors are doing to us in Southwest Asia with the exorbitant cost for goods and services. Some people call those contractors criminals while they see nothing wrong with buying up ammo and reselling at ridiculous prices. They're both taking advantage of a situation for EXTREME monetary gain. But hey, I guess that's the way the free market works...

 

[25elk]

Free market, free country (still...kinda), freedom to think and say what you want. I do find the relationship between your forum name and the topic of your post somewhat ironic. Carry on.

 

[gdauth]

As Gordon Gecko said, greed is good!

 

[compshootfl]

From my perspective, it seems that by having websites with thousands of people telling thousands more "where the ammo is" is compounding the problem. I would think that the marketplace, left to it's own up & down cyles and people out looking on their own for ammo they may need, would be a better solution. I realize, that in some parts of the country (well almost all parts of the country now) that ammo shortages are real and online buying is the norm for many. But each person, left to their own search online or locally, would certainly curtail the ammo supplies being sold out in minutes in most cases and in turn give more people that chance to get some.

This is just an observation, good or bad. So don't hate me for my opinion.

 

[harrym]

I just checked an auction site for .22lr. Several listings starting at $125 for a brick. Some just list "500 rnds .22lr ammo" without brand, bullet weight, or any other information. And bids were $65 or more. There are some starting as low as $35 for a brick [or equivalent], so it's the buyers that are boosting the price. If the bidders dried up, what would the non-shooters do with all their ammo? And I would be surprised if some of the early morning crowd at Walmart ever go shooting. Certainly not in all the calibers they buy.

 

[Tennreb]

History repeats itself because more people than not never learn the lessons of life.

The situation that was the catalyst to all of this is a lesson in civics. The political results so far is a lesson in the application of constitutional process. And the buying of guns and ammo at unprecedented levels as a result of the aforementioned is a lesson in human nature.

Learn these lessons for God's sake and apply them to life... Makes things a little more predictable and a lot less frustrating.

Enjoyed my trip to the range yesterday shooting my M&P 15-22. Third trip in a week. Got plenty to shoot more because I had prepared a little and adjusted a lot.

This will pass. When it does, remember and apply the necessary measures to forestall the impact the next time has on you. The next time might be something much more serious than not having 22 lr to play with... and the gougers and the lemmings freaking out will be there again. Avoid both. Neither will be to your benefit. One is the buzzard and the other Is the carrion. Don't just hold your nose. Stay away from the stench in the first place.

 

[RPeacock1128]

I'm sure it's just shop talk but several of the larger retailers in my area said that their distributors have had more ammo available in May -- more so than any month since Christmas. We will see but at this point I buy what is available to me at a good price. I stick with Midway or a few well respected smaller online retailers. The Available Ammo Thread has been good to me - allowing me to purchase 5,000 or so rounds in the past 3 months. If I'm lucky I only shoot 250 rounds per month so I'm good. I will continue to pick up a brick any time I can access the Midway site fast enough to beat everyone else to the ammo. I refuse to pay GunBroker prices for .22 - I saw a post over the weekend where one guy bought a brick of Remington Subsonic for $160 ------ he is crazy. Midway (even Natchez with their ridiculous shipping) had the same for $34.99 last week.

RP

 

[Dezfan]

Enough ammo?

No such thing.

This too will pass.

When it does, I hope the lesson is learned and people will prepare for the next time it will happen as there will indeed be a next time.

BE PREPARED!

 

[LimaCharlie]

Sorry, I joined the ranks of the hoarders last week. I have been an accumulator since Bill Clinton won in 1992. I was in the local big box store and there was this single box of ammo setting there all lonely so I bought it. It was a 1,000 round box of 7.62X51mm M80 NATO. I didn't need it, but it looked so lonely there by itself.

 

[duppie]

I find it astounding the sheer enormity of rounds being sold and hoarded in these past months and say a little prayer for all those UPS,FEDEX and USPS delivery men and women out there......Let's all remember their effort and aching backs this Christmas...Shall we?

 

[rwsmith]

Keep our shirts on

Gun owners are in a very vulnerable position now. Rather than dividing our ranks in the face of an organized enemy I say be patient and things will improve.

 

[Bamabred]

And doesn't it seem like if you already have 5k-10k rounds of 22lr, (knowing there is no real confiscation or whatever going on) that those of us so well stocked should leave a little meat on the bone for others less fortunate?

Bob, I understand your frustration. I'm new to rifle shooting. Bought a 15-22 in January, and didn't know there was an ammo shortage until afterwards. I am one of those who has over 5k-10k rounds.

This morning I went to Wal-Mart to pick some stuff for the wife. Went by the ammo case and they got a huge shipment in. 9mm, 7.62x39, .223, and a lot of 22lr. They had cases of 333 Winchester; boxes of CCI Mini Mag (which I have never actually seen in the wild until today). They had bricks of CCI Quiet. You get the point.

I grabbed 3 boxes of 333 Winchester even though I have ammo. I'll be honest, I've sold some ammo (@ .07 -.08 a round). I've given ammo away to church members. I sell it for two reason. One, so I can pay for what I shoot. Two, it helps me give some away.

If I leave some "meat on the bone" I have no way of knowing who is less fortunate and who is going to sell it online for $100 a brick. So, I buy it so I'll know it goes to a good home. Folks may not like it, but I don't like driving all over the place looking for ammo either. Ammo is not a need (yet). And judging by Wal-mart and my LGS, the situation is getting better. Be patient.

 

[Scopes]

I saw a funny cartoon that had Obama smiling and read "I made you think it was about the guns, but all along it was about the ammo". It's all going somewhere, but only "certain" people know where.

 

[armallard]

Well I thought I'd put my 02 cents in since I only on a couple 22 rifles. When I go buy ammo I am looking for 22 but I barely find some, but when I do I buy and most always end up with 9mm since my lgs is 1 box per customer luckily the 9's aren't hard to come by.

 

[SickStroke6.0]

Well I bought an M&P 15-22 as my first gun purchase on Thursday (just turned 19, parents never were much into shooting/hunting). I figured it would allow me to learn how to handle an AR, without the powerful and expensive .223 cartridge, while allowing me to buy cheap ammunition so I can target shoot without breaking the bank. Honestly, when I went to buy the gun, I was oblivious to the whole .22LR shortage. I knew about the .223's, but never EVER thought the little .22's would be rare. I asked the cashier (a friend of mine) to grab me some ammo to get me started, and he sold me 200 rounds. I burnt through those pretty quickly... Then, I figured I'd go pick up some more ammo at WalMart and save some cash. Nowhere to be found. Looked everywhere locally and online.... NO AMMO. The only place with ammo wanted $17 for 50 rounds of cheap Federal ammo. So yeah, it sucks to be a new gun owner in this market. I finally bought my own gun, and now I can't even shoot it. Rant off.