Trail gun for Yellowstone...

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The wife and I are contemplating a visit to Yellowstone Park this fall, in which we'll link up with some cousins we haven't seen in many years. Now that national parks permit concealed carry (with reciprocal recognition of permits), I'm deciding on a trail gun to take along. Factors important to me are power enough for bears in an emergency, fast repeat shots (manageable recoil), portability, easy sighting, resistance to rust and reliability. I'm leaning towards this one. It's a 625-6, modified with red ramp front sight, old-style cylinder release, Ahrends retro classic smooth stocks, and an action job. .45 Colt handloads giving a 250-gr. SWC about 1000 fps should give both manageable recoil yet sufficient power to deter aggression by man or beast. Do any of you have alternate suggestions?

John

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That'll work - A bit heavy for some folks though - I have no idea what you can hike around with all day though.
BE SURE to have AT LEAST one other person with a Carry Permit with you though or you can't go into most any buildings.
 
Thats an excellant weapon and the load is sufficiant for man and beast. I like the .45 Colt as did ole' Elmer Keith because it works. Are there better or differant cartridges that will work or could be better? Of course. Carry the largest caliber that you can shoot accuratly is my motto.
If it were me it would be a Glock in .357 Sig as I can shoot it well and there are a plethora of cartridges in it and it isn't as heavy to tote all day. But, thats me. Just my two cents.
 
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The lightest S&W revolver I know of which can be loaded with heavy enough loads for bear, is the 396 in 44 Spl., but it's REALLY light and when shot with the appropriately heavy loads, it'll be a handful. The 45 Colt MG would be a very good choice, but it's heavier. Of course, that will make it easier to shoot well.

It's really a question of what you can handle recoil-wise vs. how much you'll be carrying vs. shooting. Considering that bear attacks of people inside the parks when there was no CCW allowed was virtually nil, my guess is that, unless you do something silly mindset-wise (because now you're packing a pistol), you'll carry this gun A LOT more than you'll shoot it. I'd bet you could take 15 week-long vacations to Yellowstone and never have need to shoot it, IF you do the right things for camping in bear country. Therefore, I'd pop for the 396, or the 44 Magnum version 329. You'll shoot these at home only and probably never at the park.

My one worry about the politics of this situation is that someone will carry (legally with their CCW or not - lots of knuckleheads say, if it's good enough for a CCW holder, I'll carry there too) and then feel they don't have to hoist their food into a tree at night (bear bag) or dispose of their garbage properly, or do other things which attract bears. AND, then, instead of retreating from the bear in a safe way, decide that since they have a gun, they can "have it out" with the bear. This kind of scenario will get the CCW authorization repealed... Not saying you're that way at all. In fact, my guess is that the kind of person who congregates here is the opposite of that kind of person. This is just kind of a rant about some of the mentality I see / hear in others regarding this issue...

So, another couple points:

1. If you're carrying the gun, carry some bear mace as well. It shows you're not the kind of person who is looking for an opportunity to combat a bear, but that you'd rather discourage the bear and only use the gun as last resort.

2. Study up on the techniques to deal with a bear attack. This can be a little controversial, but the people whose opinion I respect are the ones who have had successful bear encounters. They've said that a bear is a lot like a dog in that if you run, they'll perceive you as weak and "prey" which can be chased down and eaten. Stand your ground, make noise (once you've come to the bears' attention), show no fear (that's where a gun can really help - if you feel confident of protecting yourself, you can feel more self-assured to stand your ground and retreat properly from a bear), use the bear mace, and after there's been a "stand-off" back away slowly -- without turning your back on the bear.

Obviously, teach all of your party these same things, as well as the importance of not hiding food in their personal packs or tents, using the bear bag, and disposing of garbage properly.
 
I dont think you can do much better than that gun. Limbaugh thinks so too.Gunnotes...Smith & Wesson Mod 25-5
I dont advocate breaking laws, but I also have maybe too much nerve mixed with common sense. Concealed IS concealed. How many times in your life have you been patted down without reason? I wouldnt walk through a metal detector. Its worked for me for close to 70 years.
I dont feel the need to walk in federal buildings much, but I also dont like leaveing a smoke pole in the car either. Dont listen too me, but I still am loose.
 
In the early 90's I lived in Idaho Falls, and we used to go to Yellowstone on a regular basis. I had a "Don't ask, don't tell" kind of thing going with the Park, and always carried my Super Blackhawk with a hot 300 gr. hard cast lead handload. I always carried it in some kind of bag, and never had a problem.
 
REAL CARRY

throw away all the toy revolvers an go out an purchase a RUGER BLACKHAWK with 5' barrel an load up with BUFFALO BORE 45 COLT+P,300gr jfn.1325 fps and have a real bear stopper....
 
Taffin has a whole chapter in his book on the .44 about the 329PD as perfect for your needs. He had his ported and has Crimson Traces on it and swears by it. Not exactly "fun" to shoot but controllable, plenty of power, durable finish and lightweight. So it'll never be your favorite at the range...no big deal.

Amazon.com: taffin book of the .44: Books

Bob
 
Great, except you drive into California. I don't think they have reciprocal agreements with anyone for CCW. Keep your unloaded gun in a locked safe and your bullets somewhere else, until you hit Yosemite.
 
Whats with all these booger bear threads lately? Just three days ago on a bear thread here I wrote the following:
I guess the park service didnt care about our miserable hides back when I worked in yosemite in 1960 and the tetons in 61. We didnt even think about carrying a gun back then and was working in the back country daily. I do recall one stupid incident. My boss and I were driveing near glacier point turnoff in yosemite. A begger coyote was a common site at one turnout. The boss was driveing. We came around a curve and I couldnt belive what we were seeing! A old lady was feeding the panhandling coyote and a few yards away was a tourist with a shotgun injuning around his car to get a bead on the yote.
I didnt really like my boss much that was driveing, but I will say he had nerve and was fearless. He pulled to a halt next to the guy and said okay fella, give me the gun! Nobody takes muh gun! With that we both got out, however I had to come around the truck. Boss and dude were rassiling, both hanging on the shotgun! I jumped into the act and he gave up the gun. We made what probley amounted to a citizens arrest, took him and his poor family to the ranger station at wawona where we worked out of. I never did hear the outcome. I am fairly sure he probley wasnt a bad guy, just some dude redneck that read too many comic books! I remember feeling kind of bad as he had kids and wife with him and I didnt like belittleing him in front of his family, but we didnt have much choice!
ADD: If you pull that gun in a park, you better be right! Shooting a coyote pan handleing or even a rattlesnake aint going to cut it! When I was in, I even had to chase bears out of campers tents a few times. Fifty years ago I guess the bears were tamer. At least our supervisors must have thought we were replaceable as no thought was given about arming us!
 
Note that while concealed carry is now allowed at Yellowstone, it is still illegal to actually discharge a firearm there, even in self-defense.

I don't personally think this is going to to cross anyone's mind if he or she really has to use it. If I were to have to use it in a park, I guarantee that there would a good reason for it- fear of loss of life or limb.

Yes, the very first person that does use a firearm that he or she is carrying legally for self-defense in a park will likely be plastered on the news and internet, and also no matter how good the reason, they will likely face charges. I recommend having the NRA lawyers on speed dial. No, I don't know their numbers.

You: "Ranger sir...I heard the bear cracking my buddy's skull with his teeth, and I saw blood."
Ranger: "Clearly, your friend was already dead, and therefore shooting the bear is a capital offence. The bear was really a good bear at heart- he was just gett'n his life together from a rehabilitation project to keep him away from vehicles, hikers and trash cans."
 
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Every building with a Federal employee in it (or if they could be in it during the normal course of their work) will be posted. This is now at all National Parks. Makes eating, visitor centers, etc. inaccessible if you are armed.
Having a second permit holder lets you take turns going into buildings.

Now I understand, Dave. The only other alternatives would be to divest or break the stupid law and risk arrest. Geez.

John
 
throw away all the toy revolvers an go out an purchase a RUGER BLACKHAWK with 5' barrel an load up with BUFFALO BORE 45 COLT+P,300gr jfn.1325 fps and have a real bear stopper....

I have 3 "magnum load" Ruger single actions - an old model Blackhawk short barrel, and two old-style Vaqueros. I also have that exact load on hand as well as handloads that are in the .44 mag class, only intended for those Rugers. My only concern would be weight.

John
 
Note that while concealed carry is now allowed at Yellowstone, it is still illegal to actually discharge a firearm there, even in self-defense. See

Changes in Gun Laws Having Minimal Impact on Yellowstone | articles | news

I think common law covers this - if your life is in danger and you shoot, that should override the proscription. Here in Phoenix, that is certainly the case. Shooting is prohibited in the city limits, but if you fire in self-defense, you're covered.

John
 
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