Training air gunners

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not sure if this helps.. but yes, the military used shotguns to help teach aerial gunners the concept of leading a moving object...
 

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The difference between leads of a shotgun and rifle are quite a jump.

Heard they also used railway cars for training. Tossing clay pigeons from moving boxcars might be fun with a shotgun.
 

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I had a friend who was an All American Skeet shooter before the war who did train aerial gunnery with shotguns during the war. He told me they started with 97 Winchesters and transitioned to Remington model 11s. Evidently it was to impress upon many recruits that you had to shoot in front of moving targets. He was still a great skeet shooter into the 1980s
 
I had a friend who was an All American Skeet shooter before the war who did train aerial gunnery with shotguns during the war. He told me they started with 97 Winchesters and transitioned to Remington model 11s. Evidently it was to impress upon many recruits that you had to shoot in front of moving targets. He was still a great skeet shooter into the 1980s
Some 35 years ago, I spoke with a guy who had been an aerial gunnery instructor at the Laredo (TX) AAF base during the war. I don’t remember many details, but he did tell me that Remington Model 11 shotguns were used. I clearly remember that he described how the shotguns were cleaned. They would disassemble them completely and throw everything into a vat of AVGAS. I don’t know if that included the wood. Then they would be reassembled without any regard given to keeping original parts together. I suppose they oiled the parts during assembly, but I don’t remember. That is pretty good parts interchangeability. As I remember, it wasn’t done every day, but periodically. No idea how many guns were cleaned at a time, but Laredo was one of the larger gunnery training bases. So probably quite a few guns. That base later became the Laredo airport. I lived in Laredo for two years.
 
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The difference between leads of a shotgun and rifle are quite a jump.

Heard they also used railway cars for training. Tossing clay pigeons from moving boxcars might be fun with a shotgun.

I believe the AAF gunnery schools used trucks. Whether that was for shooters or target throwing I do not know. Maybe both.
 
Have had several full length barrel WWII shotguns with the “ US” stamp that were used for training. Years ago they could be found at gun shows, not theses days.
 
Eventually, learning to lead the target manually was replaced by the Sperry computerized gunsights in the power turrets that automatically calculated the lead. The computer was pure analog, operated by gears and a gyroscope, quite an accomplishment for the time. All the gunner had to do was input the target's wingspan then hold the sight on the target. I guess the waist gunners still had to lead their targets. Here's a brief explanation:

Sperry K-3 & K-4 Computing Gun Sights — Glenn's Computer Museum
 
Eventually, learning to lead the target manually was replaced by the Sperry computerized gunsights in the power turrets that automatically calculated the lead. The computer was pure analog, operated by gears and a gyroscope, quite an accomplishment for the time. All the gunner had to do was input the target's wingspan then hold the sight on the target. I guess the waist gunners still had to lead their targets. Here's a brief explanation:

Sperry K-3 & K-4 Computing Gun Sights — Glenn's Computer Museum

I read a tale from WWII where a fighter unit received their first gyro gunsight. Plan was to fit it to the squadron commander's kite for evaluation, but he disliked its bulk and figured he was good enough. So, the mechanics fitted the sight to the plane assigned to a recently arrived rookie.

Story goes that next day and his first time up, the rookie waxed a FW-190 with some extreme deflection shot made using the new gunsight. Next morning, the gyro sight was installed in the squadron commander's plane.;)
 
Dad talked a little about his Navy areal gunner training during WW2. He said that the rig he trained on was a tripod mounted semi automatic Remington shotgun like in this picture. At the end of the areal gunner training Dad came in second, breaking 24/25 targets. The guy that broke 25/25 became an areal gunnery instructor. Dad was sent to aircraft mechanics school. Although when he got to the Pacific theater, due to the shortage air crewmembers he eventually spent time as a rear gunner in TBMs and as a flight engineer in PBYs.

Dad did mention that he felt the time spent with the tripod mounted shotgun had little practical correlation with trying to fire a machine gun from a moving aircraft. The force of the wind against the barrels was tremendous!

I should mention that Dads family were amazing wing shots. The family story was that Grandad would not waste the money on shotgun ammo for the boys to learn shooting. They started hunting with a 22 caliber Stevens Favorite. When they could drop a quail on the wing with the 22 they moved up to the shotgun. My dad and uncles each had their story about lining up The Shot that earned them the right to hunt with a shotgun.

As a young kid I was skeptical about these stories until I actually started hunting with them and saw them in action. My Uncle Grady hunted with a Browning A5. More than once I watched him drop 4 quail from a covey with 5 shots , hip shooting. He would laugh at me wasting time putting my sxs to my shoulder to shoot.
 

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My Dad was a Ball Turret Gunner on a B-17 . He did his gunnery training in Las Vegas . He said they used a truck and a pump shotgun . He said those city boys that had never fired a shotgun caught hell .
 
I have a US marked numbers matching Rem 11 Sportsman with the Cutts. Posted pictures years ago. It might this form or gunboards.
 
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