Trying to identify year and value
- Thread starter Riverboater260
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The star on the butt tells us it went back to the mother ship for some work, probably a refinish. Check under the grips, left side, for a date in this form 4.52 (April 1952) or some such. The grips should have the SN stamped on them too if original to the gun. They're from the 1930s (small silver medallion) and the SN is likely mid '30s. Looks to be in very good condition. Value, as a factory refinished example, maybe $500-$600 where I shop. The 32-20s are fun guns to shoot although ammo isn't widely available and is fairly expensive when found. Welcome to the Forum.
Jeff
SWCA #1457
Jeff
SWCA #1457
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Welcome to the forum from the Colorado Front Range sir! Can’t help with the info you’re looking for but very nice looking revolver. The folks who will post next will have more info but for value they will also ask that you remove the grips and see if the same serial number on the frame matches that on I believe, the inside of the right grip. Believe the star preceding the serial number on the bottom of the grip frame indicates rework of some kind at the factory so pictures showing both sides of the grip frame that clearly show marking will also help them/you out. The added swivel obscuring the serial number isn’t original and was probably added by a local gunsmith.
Welcome once again. Always nice to have another devil dog join us!
Welcome once again. Always nice to have another devil dog join us!
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Good catch, although the butt swivel may be factory work, might be part of the reason for the star stamp. If the factory did install it, and drilled a hole through the serial number, the frame will be stamped with the SN on the left side. A non factory gunsmith might do that too. If there is no SN stamp on the side of the frame and if the hole for the swivel obliterates the SN that is technically an issue with the ATF although not that big a deal from my perspective. The SN can also be found on the back of the cylinder and on the barrel, and a couple other harder to find places.
Jeff
SWCA #1457
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Based on the serial number and the lack of Made in U.S.A. on the frame, this revolver is almost certainly from about 1921.
However, the barrel and extractor rod are from later than that, as are the stocks. I suspect it went back to the Service Department at the factory sometime after 1930. The extractor was changed, probably the barrel also and the stocks. The fact that the serial number appears on the barrel flat is another indication that the work was done at Springfield.
I agree that you should look for a Service Department date on the left side of the grip frame.
Added: I forgot to mention the swivel. It clearly was added later. The fact that it splits the serial number is suspicious. If the factory did that, they would have restamped the serial number on the side of the grip frame. That is another thing to look for when you remove the stocks.
However, the barrel and extractor rod are from later than that, as are the stocks. I suspect it went back to the Service Department at the factory sometime after 1930. The extractor was changed, probably the barrel also and the stocks. The fact that the serial number appears on the barrel flat is another indication that the work was done at Springfield.
I agree that you should look for a Service Department date on the left side of the grip frame.
Added: I forgot to mention the swivel. It clearly was added later. The fact that it splits the serial number is suspicious. If the factory did that, they would have restamped the serial number on the side of the grip frame. That is another thing to look for when you remove the stocks.
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Okay, year and value:
I can at least get you started. There will be others with vastly more knowledge and interest in such minutia will be along directly.
For openers, the star is a factory service mark indicating the gun was returned for service of some sort. I'm told (only told) there was a time when pretty much any and all items returned for work were refinished as a matter of course. That practice led to our knee-jerk reaction to suppose any/all guns with a star were refinished. I'm inclined to believe it ain't so.
The date code mentioned above may very well help with the determination of a refinish because of another aspect of star lore, and that is the practice of an automatic refinish was put to a stop somewhere along the line by someone with a collector mindset. Jinks', the Historian for a loooooooong time, comes to mind as a likely suspect/hero for stopping the practice----a hero because a refinish diminishes the value---a little or a lot depending on who did it. Current opinion puts the reduction at 15-20% for a factory refinish, 50% for any other. So much for that!
My input for value is next to worthless because it's applicable to target guns, and they're worth some more than fixed sight guns such as yours simply because of supply and demand----target guns deemed to have been something around 10% of total production. So, my two examples, early and later, fetched the amounts shown during the liquidation of my collection over the three years ending about a year ago. Both were high condition, original finish examples.
#42094, shipped December 22, 1908, fetched $3300.
#114655, shipped August 21, 1923 went out at $1225.
The rather startling difference can only be attributed to earlier and later. The premium for target guns is very likely treated in the Standard Catalog, but I wouldn't even begin to know where to look.
The shipping dates are somewhat meaningless when it comes to completion dates because the guns were neither completed nor shipped in anywhere near serial number order, and completion dates are seldom known -----or so we're told. (My best example of that is two 3rd Model Single Shots----#'s 4807 and 4826. Both guns were completed in May/June of 1911 respectively------4826, a special order, was shipped two days after completion on June 21, and 4807 sat around for FOUR AND A HALF YEARS after completion on May 9.) Go figure!!
Ralph Tremaine
I can at least get you started. There will be others with vastly more knowledge and interest in such minutia will be along directly.
For openers, the star is a factory service mark indicating the gun was returned for service of some sort. I'm told (only told) there was a time when pretty much any and all items returned for work were refinished as a matter of course. That practice led to our knee-jerk reaction to suppose any/all guns with a star were refinished. I'm inclined to believe it ain't so.
The date code mentioned above may very well help with the determination of a refinish because of another aspect of star lore, and that is the practice of an automatic refinish was put to a stop somewhere along the line by someone with a collector mindset. Jinks', the Historian for a loooooooong time, comes to mind as a likely suspect/hero for stopping the practice----a hero because a refinish diminishes the value---a little or a lot depending on who did it. Current opinion puts the reduction at 15-20% for a factory refinish, 50% for any other. So much for that!
My input for value is next to worthless because it's applicable to target guns, and they're worth some more than fixed sight guns such as yours simply because of supply and demand----target guns deemed to have been something around 10% of total production. So, my two examples, early and later, fetched the amounts shown during the liquidation of my collection over the three years ending about a year ago. Both were high condition, original finish examples.
#42094, shipped December 22, 1908, fetched $3300.
#114655, shipped August 21, 1923 went out at $1225.
The rather startling difference can only be attributed to earlier and later. The premium for target guns is very likely treated in the Standard Catalog, but I wouldn't even begin to know where to look.
The shipping dates are somewhat meaningless when it comes to completion dates because the guns were neither completed nor shipped in anywhere near serial number order, and completion dates are seldom known -----or so we're told. (My best example of that is two 3rd Model Single Shots----#'s 4807 and 4826. Both guns were completed in May/June of 1911 respectively------4826, a special order, was shipped two days after completion on June 21, and 4807 sat around for FOUR AND A HALF YEARS after completion on May 9.) Go figure!!
Ralph Tremaine
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Welcome to the Forum. The barrel raises some questions as to its originality as well as the other subjects covered above. The caliber marking for these guns from 1914 until 1922 was 32 W C.F. CTG on right side of barrel changed to 32-20 between serial numbers 111,000 & 113,000 starting around 1923. The front sight is pinned for some reason which was not the practice for standard revolvers which had forged front sights. Maybe the barrel was replaced post-WWI and target barrels were all that was left in the factory?? This caliber was phased out in the 1930s. Lastly, the serial number stamping on the barrel flat does not look like a factory stamping?? Interesting gun, but the factory rework did you no favors as far as collectability goes.
If you were to sell the gun, expect to get less than $500 for it, maybe much less.
If you were to sell the gun, expect to get less than $500 for it, maybe much less.
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Welcome to the Forum.
The serial number under the barrel looks like it was hand stamped, which would be consistent with a factory replacement. Are there any other stampings under the barrel, such as a diamond?
More and detailed pictures, especially under the stocks, are needed.
The serial number under the barrel looks like it was hand stamped, which would be consistent with a factory replacement. Are there any other stampings under the barrel, such as a diamond?
More and detailed pictures, especially under the stocks, are needed.
Non-original configuration aside, that's one nice looking 32-20. Your uncle gave you a very nice revolver.
daddio202
Member
I agree with Retired W4 the revolver is a real beauty. It also has some interesting history and was reworked during a golden age of S&W revolvers.
Unfortunately as to the value, some obsolete calibers don't bring big money. The 32-20 is a great cartridge but is truly only for handloaders. I have several in different configurations from the
20's. Great fun to shoot! But reloading is the only economical way to shoot them often.
I say- get you a box or 2 of bullets, to shoot and enjoy it before making any decisions as to selling it. Maybe you will catch the bug so many of us here have and add some to keep it company. Welcome to the forum!
Unfortunately as to the value, some obsolete calibers don't bring big money. The 32-20 is a great cartridge but is truly only for handloaders. I have several in different configurations from the
20's. Great fun to shoot! But reloading is the only economical way to shoot them often.
I say- get you a box or 2 of bullets, to shoot and enjoy it before making any decisions as to selling it. Maybe you will catch the bug so many of us here have and add some to keep it company. Welcome to the forum!
I have a 1905, 1st change with a similar barrel and ejector rod change. REDUCED:38 M&P, Model 1905, 1st Ch. Jarvis Stocks
The new barrel was numbered to the gun but there are no marks indicating that it went to S&W for the modification. Of course mine is a 38 special which had a separate serial number range from the 32-20's and was shipped in early 1907.
The new barrel was numbered to the gun but there are no marks indicating that it went to S&W for the modification. Of course mine is a 38 special which had a separate serial number range from the 32-20's and was shipped in early 1907.
Nice gun rework or not!
Mine is a October 1921 shipment according to Mr. Jinks, S&W Historian. Mine is all original including the grips. Small logo on left side, no Made in USA right side, LERK, barrel, cylinder frame s/n all match.
I am not a reloader but was given some 115 gr Cowboy Action ammo made with Starline Brass and made by HSM Hill States Munitions.
I cannot shoot it at local INDOOR range because they banned solid lead ammo due to expensive air handling equipment so I have to travel aways to an outdoor range but the gun is really fun to shoot.
If you do find ammo, SAVE your brass! I know some local reloaders that I'm thinking of asking to load me some if I buy the components and dies, or else I will take the plunge and start a "new" hobby (reloading) at age 80.
Mine is a October 1921 shipment according to Mr. Jinks, S&W Historian. Mine is all original including the grips. Small logo on left side, no Made in USA right side, LERK, barrel, cylinder frame s/n all match.
I am not a reloader but was given some 115 gr Cowboy Action ammo made with Starline Brass and made by HSM Hill States Munitions.
I cannot shoot it at local INDOOR range because they banned solid lead ammo due to expensive air handling equipment so I have to travel aways to an outdoor range but the gun is really fun to shoot.
If you do find ammo, SAVE your brass! I know some local reloaders that I'm thinking of asking to load me some if I buy the components and dies, or else I will take the plunge and start a "new" hobby (reloading) at age 80.
Attachments
If you do find ammo, SAVE your brass! I know some local reloaders that I'm thinking of asking to load me some if I buy the components and dies, or else I will take the plunge and start a "new" hobby (reloading) at age 80.
Charlie,
You certainly could take up reloading but my advice would be to buy factory ammo or, as you're thinking, find someone to load for you. Buying the reloading gear to do it right and the components is going to cost $500 or more. Looking for ammo gives you an excuse to go to gun shows, pawn shops and maybe an LGS or two . . .and you can sell the brass to folks who do reload if you can't find anyone to load it for you. Nice gun, they are fun to shoot.
Jeff
SWCA #1457
