Tulsa finds

[Toyman]

I stopped at Lee Jarret's table at Tulsa and he handed me a box of Winchester Colt 455 ammo that I have been searching for. I then went to a table where I knew there was a second model hand ejector that was a commercial gun not a military purchase. The gun shipped to Shapleigh Hardware in St. Louis in December 1917. The grips number to the gun. I showed the box of ammo to Ray Giles and from markings he thought the box was 1934 to 1940 production.
[URL="http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n152/rfsales/TULSA_zps913b7e66.jpg"] [/URL]

 

[29aholic]

Very nice find

 

[Russell Cottle]

That's a nice one!

 

[Tom K]

Terrific gun and ammo! Interesting that a gun chambered for a British military cartridge would go to St. Louis in the midst of WWI. So, .455 Colt is the same as .455 Webley?

Also, I like the "STAYNLESS" stamped diagonally across the label. I believe that refers to the use of non-corrosive priming, correct?

 

[Toyman]

Winchester produced the ammo and for what ever reason did not list it as ELEY or WEBLEY. This may have been so they did not have to pay royalities but we may never know.
Yes the STAYNELSS refers to primers and there is a small pasted lable that I wil try to get a photo of in regard to primers.

 

[Hondo44]

Toyman,

That's a beautiful gun an accompanying box of cartridges. Those 455 Colts are not equivalent to the 455 Mk II, Eley or Webly. They're longer and Colt's version of the 455 Mk I. However all Smith 455 Mk II guns are chambered for the earlier, longer cartridges per the English contract.

The 455 Colt Mk II ammo is the later short equivalent to the 455 Mk II & Webley.

 

[Hondo44]

Terrific gun and ammo! Interesting that a gun chambered for a British military cartridge would go to St. Louis in the midst of WWI. So, .455 Colt is the same as .455 Webley?

Also, I like the "STAYNLESS" stamped diagonally across the label. I believe that refers to the use of non-corrosive priming, correct?

Tom,

S&W released 1105 455 2nd Models for the commercial market at the end of the British contract. These were probably 'over-run' guns. It's very fortunate to find these unconverted to 45 Colt.

No, not the same as 455 Webley per my post above.

 

[Toyman]

A box of 455 and 455 Mark 11 side by side showing difference in height.
[URL="http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n152/rfsales/455X2_zps22de1d29.jpg"] [/URL]

A photo of top of 455 box with pasted label stating NON MERCURIC PRIMERS
[URL="http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n152/rfsales/455N_zpsbc543315.jpg"][URL="http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n152/rfsales/455N_zpsbc543315.jpg"] [/URL][/URL]
A box of 455 Mark 11 cartridges.
[URL="http://i111.photobucket.com/albums/n152/rfsales/4552_zps543eb4be.jpg"]

The letter that came with the gun states 'THIS REVOLVER WAS ONE OF THE LEFT OVER BRITISH CONTRACT HANDGUNS THAT WERE SOLD COMMERICAL TO SHAPLEIGH '

[/URL]

 

[Hondo44]

Toyman,

Thanks for the photos of both 455 Colt ammo.

I find it interesting that 691 triple locks were shipped to England at the end of the 2nd Model to fulfill the contract yet there were 1105 2nd Models left over to ship commercially.

I understand that there are commercial 2nd Models listed in the SCSW in the serial # range late 13,000 to early 16,000 but no indication of when they shipped. Is yours in that early # range or the 70,000 range?

 

[Toyman]

This one is 66860

 

[LEO918]

I too have one of the later guns in high condition serial number 61801. However the recoil shield has been shaved allowing it to accept .45 Colt CTG.

 

[1Aspenhill]

Roy,
We should have taken it out Saturday night and tested that ammo with the gun!
Great seeing you!
Bill

 

[Tom K]

While not at all in the same class, I also picked up a 2nd Model Hand Ejector. It looks to have been originally in .455 but was reamed and the cylinder shaved for .45 Colt. Except for the missing number on the cylinder, serial numbers all match. I'm sure the gun originally had proof/acceptance stamps on it but they have all been cleanly removed, and also the S&W logo which presumably would've been on the sideplate. I am impressed though with the good fit of the sideplate - usually that edge is buffed over.

(Click on the pics for a larger version.)

[URL="http://i40.tinypic.com/2gyamuh.jpg"][URL="http://i40.tinypic.com/2gyamuh.jpg"] [/URL][/URL]


[URL="http://i44.tinypic.com/2ugjeo0.jpg"][URL="http://i44.tinypic.com/2ugjeo0.jpg"] [/URL][/URL]


[URL="http://i39.tinypic.com/5dwj2g.jpg"][URL="http://i39.tinypic.com/5dwj2g.jpg"] [/URL][/URL]


[URL="http://i39.tinypic.com/20f3zbd.jpg"][URL="http://i39.tinypic.com/20f3zbd.jpg"] [/URL][/URL]



And not really relevant but kind of cool, I also picked up an American Double Action built by H&R, around 1884. It came with 40 rounds of ammo made from cut-down .44 Mag cases with the rim thinned for proper headspace. According to the seller they were loaded with about 20gr of black powder, he didn't say what weight of bullet. I also have a similar American Bulldog with a 2" barrel and a British Bulldog that I ought to be able to use this ammo in.


[URL="http://i42.tinypic.com/fn4unt.jpg"][URL="http://i42.tinypic.com/fn4unt.jpg"] [/URL][/URL]


[URL="http://i39.tinypic.com/2ahut1y.jpg"][URL="http://i39.tinypic.com/2ahut1y.jpg"] [/URL][/URL]

 

[Tom K]

While not at all in the same class, I also picked up a 2nd Model Hand Ejector. It looks to have been originally in .455 but was reamed and the cylinder shaved for .45 Colt. Except for the missing number on the cylinder, serial numbers all match. I'm sure the gun originally had proof/acceptance stamps on it but they have all been cleanly removed, and also the S&W logo which presumably would've been on the sideplate. I am impressed though with the good fit of the sideplate - usually that edge is buffed over.

(Click on the pics for a larger version.)

I ordered some age-appropriate refinished stocks from Numrich Gun Parts Corp., and a replacement lanyard ring. I think the lanyard is a reproduction. The parkerized finish doesn't really match the blue of this gun, but it's good enough. Also, if anyone orders one be aware that the retainer pin is a separate item. It's something you might not think of at the time.


























I noticed in the pictures that the cylinder chambers have some pitting, in what looks like where the original .455 chambers would have ended. Hopefully it won't be a problem, what with the low pressure the .45 Colt operates at.