David LaPell
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That's a pretty lousy crimp for factory ammo. I haven't shot factory ammo in my .357's for years, and I see now reason to start now from the QC I see.
Updated again - 8-18-2013...Holy Bullet Jump Batman!!
- Thread starter SAFireman
- Start date
luangtom
US Veteran
I can second that motion....I had Remington GoldenSaber 125-gr jump crimp on more than one box. I tried a number of boxes and it was the same. I just do not use them in my 340PD or M&P340. I use the Speer 135-gr for short-barrels and have not had a crimp-jump yet. Good luck and find yerself a good round and stick with it. Shoot safe....
ar15ed
Member
a groove around the bullet for the crimped case to "crimp" into.
Check the bullets in the photo in Post #17 of this thread. That grooved ring encircling the bullets is a cannelure. If crimped properly, a bullet with a cannelure will hold more securely than a bullet without one.
Chubbs103
US Veteran
If you take a look at Paul105's picture, you can see the cannelure above where the bullets jumped the crimp. If the round is crimped properly (unlike in the picture), the case is rolled tightly into the cannelure.
Chubbs
The first time that happened to me was with a Charter arms Bulldog and factory ammo, when the Bulldog first came out. At that time, RNL was about all you could get, so I took up reloading for the Special. Already had dies for .44 Mag, but I had to buy a .44 Spl crimp die. I used it.
I'm surprised that the instructions that came with your gun didn't warn about this. I'm sure my 325PD instructions warned about testing for this, and probably 342PD, as well. Neither of those guns is as bad as .357 Mag in an AirLite.
I'm surprised that the instructions that came with your gun didn't warn about this. I'm sure my 325PD instructions warned about testing for this, and probably 342PD, as well. Neither of those guns is as bad as .357 Mag in an AirLite.
OP
SAFireman
Member
I did test several types of rounds before I decided on the Golden Sabers to carry. I have been through several boxes during my rotations and these were the only 2 that have jumped like this...I don't believe that this line of bullets has a groove (I can't say that I have seen one out of the case either...).
I will be trying some new loads and the GS can go back into the 28's and 65's.
OP
SAFireman
Member
New box
Remington called today and they are sending me a new box and wish for me to return the 'problem' box to them. See 1st post for details...
Remington called today and they are sending me a new box and wish for me to return the 'problem' box to them. See 1st post for details...
GypsmJim
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I've been reloading pistol ammo for 40 years and have conservatively loaded 45,000 rounds without one single failure like this, or anything else for that matter.
In the past 10 years I've purchased ammo products (components or loaded cartidges) from Remington and had at least a 75% failure rate. By that I mean that 75% of the boxes of whatever I bought had at least one defective round in each box.
In contrast, I have not had one single problem with Winchester, Federal, Starline, etc.
My failure rate with milsurp Turkish ammo made in 1938 has been better!
Remington QC is the pitts. At first I accepted replacements, then required they refund my money, now I would't use anything with Remiongton on the box if it was given to me for free!!!
In the past 10 years I've purchased ammo products (components or loaded cartidges) from Remington and had at least a 75% failure rate. By that I mean that 75% of the boxes of whatever I bought had at least one defective round in each box.
In contrast, I have not had one single problem with Winchester, Federal, Starline, etc.
My failure rate with milsurp Turkish ammo made in 1938 has been better!
Remington QC is the pitts. At first I accepted replacements, then required they refund my money, now I would't use anything with Remiongton on the box if it was given to me for free!!!
I don't know about other Golden Saber bullets, but the .357 GS bullets don't have a cannelure. That's the problem, period.
Remington Golden Saber ammo is top-shelf in my book and I keep my K-frame .357 Magnum revolvers loaded with it and my choice of carry ammo in my SIG P229 in .40 S&W is 165gr Golden Sabers.
I carry Remington .357 Magnum 110gr SJHP ammo in my 13.3 oz M&P 340. It's accurate, with manageable recoil, and zero bullet jump.
Remington Golden Saber ammo is top-shelf in my book and I keep my K-frame .357 Magnum revolvers loaded with it and my choice of carry ammo in my SIG P229 in .40 S&W is 165gr Golden Sabers.
I carry Remington .357 Magnum 110gr SJHP ammo in my 13.3 oz M&P 340. It's accurate, with manageable recoil, and zero bullet jump.
OP
SAFireman
Member
I would just about swear that mine is marked no less than 120 grain bullets....that was to prevent cylinder face erosion I presume?
Only the titanium cylinder models are so marked. The steel cylinder models like my M&P 340 have no such prohibition.
Yes. It's to prevent erosion of the titanium cylinder.
tsa45
Member
My normal BUG is a M&P340 and I usually carry .357 GS rounds. So far, after several boxes, I've deliberately looked for crimp jump, but never found any (shoot four and check the fifth round - some very old Win 125gr +P 38's I have routinely jump the crimp after only 2 rounds fired - go figure). I notice that the rounds pictured by SAFIREMAN (nice photos, by the way) have the older style 'straight serrations' on the bullets where the current .357 GS's have deeper and more angled serrations. I'm not saying that the bullet serrations have anything to do with the bullets pulling away, but I'm wondering if anyhone has noticed this happening with the newer rounds? I will continue to check my rounds as I cycle them through and report any crimp jump that I find. Maybe I've just been lucky so far, but I HOPE that this isn't the case. . .
OP
SAFireman
Member
Thanks,
I keep forgetting that there are a few of the 'airlite' guns that have stainless cylinders.
It's understandable. There are so many models and sub-models today that you literally need a catalog in front of you to keep track of them all. It's much more complicated today than when I started shooting Smith revolvers in the '60s.
OP
SAFireman
Member
I can't believe that it happened again!!
Well since the original thread I have been through a lot of the GS rounds without incident. I run 10 a month through whether I need it or not.
This morning I was finishing up a range session with 10 from my EDC and almost the same thing happened again.
Bang!
Bang!
Bang!
Bang!
Crunch.....
This time only the last round jumped enough to tie up the gun, but I am now having to re-think my ammo choices for carry use. I have had Golden Sabre rounds since the range master at the academy recommended them. I have had them in everything from 357 sig, all the way up to 45 ACP and lots of stuff in between.....I have all of my 357 mags stoked with the GS loads, but now I am thinking that I need to re-evaluate that. I pretty much stick with the same loading for each caliber/gun, so as not to have to think too much in the event of a crisis......
I will be calling Remington in the morning and see what they say this time. I have several more unopened boxes of GS that I just won't feel comfortable with.....ironically, I am swapping over to my model 38 stoked with 38+P GS for EDC until I can come to some resolution with the crimp jumping issues.
Just a friendly heads-up to my forum brethren who carry the air-weight guns....shoot your gun with what you carry and make sure that it works right for you! Shoot it enough so that issues like this won't catch you off guard. I will be running two hundred carry rounds through before the next time I select a round for serious social work.
Maybe I should ditch the 340sc and just carry my 657 3" snubbie?
Well since the original thread I have been through a lot of the GS rounds without incident. I run 10 a month through whether I need it or not.
This morning I was finishing up a range session with 10 from my EDC and almost the same thing happened again.
Bang!
Bang!
Bang!
Bang!
Crunch.....
This time only the last round jumped enough to tie up the gun, but I am now having to re-think my ammo choices for carry use. I have had Golden Sabre rounds since the range master at the academy recommended them. I have had them in everything from 357 sig, all the way up to 45 ACP and lots of stuff in between.....I have all of my 357 mags stoked with the GS loads, but now I am thinking that I need to re-evaluate that. I pretty much stick with the same loading for each caliber/gun, so as not to have to think too much in the event of a crisis......
I will be calling Remington in the morning and see what they say this time. I have several more unopened boxes of GS that I just won't feel comfortable with.....ironically, I am swapping over to my model 38 stoked with 38+P GS for EDC until I can come to some resolution with the crimp jumping issues.
Just a friendly heads-up to my forum brethren who carry the air-weight guns....shoot your gun with what you carry and make sure that it works right for you! Shoot it enough so that issues like this won't catch you off guard. I will be running two hundred carry rounds through before the next time I select a round for serious social work.
Maybe I should ditch the 340sc and just carry my 657 3" snubbie?
Do you note there is no crimp groove on those bullets that jumped. It is difficult if not impossible to get a good enough crimp on a smooth bullet to keep the bullet from moving. Target loads have taper crimps, but hot loads need a crimp groove to keep the bullet from moving. The minimal weight of your handgun is a big contributing factor, but if you want to continue to use it, obtain loads loaded with properly crimped bullets that have a crimp groove.
