Value of guns for sale... insane!

[Old Navy]

Saw the Model 22, Model of 1917 - S&W Classics for $895 in a shop last week. Come close to loosing my way and buying it, even with the IL it was a beauty. Next to it was a Model 27 - S&W Classics - 4" that was about the same price. I mean both guns were under $1000 so maybe your shopping at the wrong store or have the models mixed up.

 

[tulsamal]

Now with more unemployment, some sellers have to lower their prices to compete with fewer clients and factor in the aging gun owners reducing their collections, this could be a good time to be a buyer. Be patient or flash cash.

That's where I think we are going next year. This recession is going to get worse and worse. A lot of people are going to lose their jobs. And they are going to have to sell whatever they have of value for whatever they can get for it.

I remember the big oil collapse in OK in the early 80's. The pawn shops were crammed with very nice guns and hardly ever had a buying customer. If the wife and I can keep our jobs ourselves..... I'm hoping to find some really nice deals in the next year!

Gregg

 

[smith revolver cop]

Originally posted by Notime2:
I've been watching revolvers relisted because they aren't bringing in the money the seller wants. However desirable / rare still bring good money. Now with more unemployment, some sellers have to lower their prices to compete with fewer clients and factor in the aging gun owners reducing their collections, this could be a good time to be a buyer. Be patient or flash cash.
Younger buyers are spending money on hi-cap black guns and ammo, they aren't competeing for your M-27. Merry Christmas! Notime2

A gun (like any commodity) is only "worth" what someone will pay. If it sells for a high price (no matter how outrageous), then it's "worth" that much. If it won't sell, because it's overpriced, any argument in the world won't make it "worth" that higher amount. (Kind of like the Beanie Babies that are listed in the collector books as being "worth" $200, selling for a buck or two at the flea market now!) When I first started using GunBroker, I was always amazed at the beautiful specimens posted by our friends the Fugates- at ridiculous prices. But, then I noticed how many of the same guns were listed over and over again, because they just weren't "worth" that much. Eventually, using the free market system, everything will reach an equilibrium at or near it's true "worth." All we have to do is keep the government from "correcting" (i.e., f*cking-up) the price structure!

 

[dutcher987]

I also think the economy is hurting most people. Those people that are turning to selling their guns and they want the most that they can get for it. I understand that and if they can get top dollar, then so be it. I just don't see the deals here in the midwest area. I do keep an eye out for the deal that I just can't pass up, but I was frustrated this week-end and I just had to vent.

That classic at Cabella's was not a RM. It was just the 4" classic M27 with the integrated lock. So, not worth the asking price. $850 would be a little better price, IMO. Just might sell a few more of them a lot quicker.

I do get some great deals from my local gun shop, but there really is not a whole lot of N frames passing through our area.

I do understand that GB is not a great place to gauge things either. There are a lot of proud sellers on that site. And there is not a lot of actual selling going on... more re-lists due to the items not selling. I do like to look at the pictures though. Makes me wish that I had a fatter wallet and a bigger safe to buy more things.

I am also getting tired of seeing the price of ammo going up. When will it ever end?!

Maybe I should take my .22 to the range a lot more. But, I sure do like the big bore revolvers when they go bang!

 

[stevieboy]

I think that tulsamul and dutcher are absolutely right. This economy is going to produce some very low gun resale prices, maybe on new ones, too. I've noticed that on Gunbroker guns tend to hang around much longer unsold. For the most part, the only ones that seem to be selling these days over on their Revolver page are no reserve, no minimum guns. Everything else just sits there.

In the past few weeks I've also noticed a softening of asking prices at the on consignment counter of my range/gun store. Guns are being put on offer at prices that are very reasonable. I have every reason to expect that trend will continue.

 

[dutcher987]

And to add to stevieboy's comments. I have sold on eBay for a very long time... not gun stuff, but other stuff.

I have found that all of my "no reserve" type auctions actually do a lot better than had I placed a reserve. In most cases, I would say 9 out of 10, I would actually get what I was expecting to get had I placed a reserve.

I feel that the perspective buyer feels like he has a much better chance at winning on the "no reserve" type auctions over the "reserve" type. Those auctions with reserves don't get much attention. It is truly a psychological thing. I never place a reserve, unless, I need to at least get a certain $ amount out of the auction.

Those items that do sell on GB or AuctionArms without a reserve are the true indicator of market value and what the average consumer is willing to spend. I wish that more sellers would actually do this. I think that they would be amazed.

And if the gun does not sell for their expected price, swallow that pride pill and let it go... otherwise, don't sell your stuff.

 

[smith revolver cop]

Those items that do sell on GB or AuctionArms without a reserve are the true indicator of market value and what the average consumer is willing to spend. I wish that more sellers would actually do this. I think that they would be amazed.

I like that on GunBroker (unlike eBay), most sellers with a reserve either tell you right in the listing what the reserve is, or start at the reserve price. I've found that on auctions with an undisclosed reserve, the reserve is way too high, often unreasonable. I've got no problem with somebody protecting themselves with a certain minimum price, but the reserve auctions are often so frustrating that they really do discourage some bidders.

 

[mountaingun629]

Dutcher987 made a good point - I have gotten to where I pay little attention to "reserve price" sales, because the reserve is usually close to or at the "buy now" price if one is listed.

As several have pointed out, many of the items get re-listed week after week, month after month. It baffles me that a dealer would rather not sell an item than take a little less for it. They wouldn't make as much per gun, but the increased volume should more than make up for it.

Myron

 

[maglvr]

Originally posted by s&wchad:

Originally posted by rburg:
Remember, any old fool can ask any price he or she wants. Sometimes I just think they do it to impress themselves.

That reminds me of one of my favorite gun show stories. My ex-table partner and I (he passed away a few years ago) were approached by an scruffy old guy carrying a gun case with a Winchester crescent butt sticking out of it. His clothes were tattered and filthy, he looked like a bum and his fly was open. I'm sure he smelled too, but we didn't get that close. He handed us one of the worst Model 1894 takedown rifles I'd ever seen. It was a .30 caliber round barrel, brown with no finish, cracked wood, the metal looked like someone used it as an anvil, the takedown joint was loose and every screw on it was buggered. His firm asking price was $5000.

We laughed about that for years. I miss my friend.

I suspect his fly was open to save time when he finally found someone to pay $5000 for that old junker

 

[flat top]

A bit over a year ago I found a NIB Smith on Gunbroker that really lit my fire. The first thing I did was go to the Smith web site and check on the MSRP of comparable models. The "buy now" was about 2/3's the price that Smith had listed on their web site! I called the dealer who was in Alaska and inquired about the gun...they were very helpful...they "wanted" to move product and were not afraid to say so! I bought the gun on the spot. I know this is a rare instance, but, it can happen. We have a local gunshop here that has had a reputation over many years of "asking" very high prices for firearms. I am not looking to "steal" a deal...just to get a fair price. I have been real hard on these folks when I go in to buy from them. Some of the deals I have worked with them ended in shouting matches, and threats of banning me from thier store...but, I was adamant about what I would pay for their guns...period! Well, now they see me coming, and most often when they see I am interested in one of their guns, they will whisper the "your price" (well below sticker)to me. They know I will be a good customer and continue to buy from them, if they dont B.S. me. Its been a hard row to hoe, but it works out for both of us. I get a gun at a fair price, and they get to sell a gun. They darn well know that they "must" sell product to stay in business, and if the buyer comes equiped with the numbers, and a tenacious attitude, its amazing what can be had for a reasonable price. For those that wont deal, or sell for a fair price....Let em' know of your feelings and walk away....When they see that price gouging is losing sales for them, they just might lower their prices. If not, they dont deserve to be in the business.

 

[sash]

As an interesting followup, there was a 10-8, 3" round butt on gunbroker last week with a buy now price of $390. It didn't sell. The same gun was listed a day later (same description and seller) starting at $375 with a buy now price of $425. The winning bid over the weekend was 410 -- 20 bucks OVER the buy price of last week.

I think lots of you are correct about the economy. Right now, there is some tension between the poor economy on one hand, and fear of the new administration on the other. It will be interesting to see how it sorts out, but I hope there will be some nice deals on square butt K frames over the next year or two.

 

[ricketts]

Originally posted by mountaingun629:
Dutcher987 made a good point - I have gotten to where I pay little attention to "reserve price" sales, because the reserve is usually close to or at the "buy now" price if one is listed.

As several have pointed out, many of the items get re-listed week after week, month after month. It baffles me that a dealer would rather not sell an item than take a little less for it. They wouldn't make as much per gun, but the increased volume should more than make up for it.

Myron

It works both ways. I have had many a gun offered to me that the owner wanted to wring every last nickel out of me.

If the seller would realize that money does have time value and if he took the money I offered, he could buy something else and possibly make a better margin or upgrade his collection. But, I have had guys walk away over $10.

 

[Wesprt]

Originally posted by pred:

Originally posted by armybass:

Originally posted by Notime2:
Younger buyers are spending money on hi-cap black guns and ammo, they aren't competing for your M-27. Notime2

I beg your pardon.....LOL. I am all of 38 and I am all over that M27 you are hunting. LOL.

You are 38?
I work with a bunch of younger guys, 20 somethings, and they have all bought over the past year.
S&W m&p 40s
Taurus 9mms
Bersa 9mms
On average they are spending less than 400 for a gun, And one time they asked what I had, Well that is a big Q, I only answered with "I prefer a revolver and that is what I carry"
I just dont like plastic!
One of the guys bought his wife a Skyy 9mm.
Noone seems to want to shell out 500+ for a new puney 5 shot S&W revolver when they can get a semi with 82 rounds to blast away.
To each his own.
If you were 22, You might own 3 Glocks.
Peter.

I'm 19, love old Smiths, and enjoy reading Bill Jordan, Jelly Bryce, Elmer Keith, Skeeter Skelton and Charles Askins if that helps

 

[dutcher987]

I like my local gun shop that I frequent quite often. They know me pretty good and have thrown me a deal or two. They generally sell to me below their asking price and I like that kind of treatment. It shows that they want my business and they know that I will come back. Just tonight, I bought another firearm from them. Well below their asking price and I was very happy with the deal. However, it was not a Smith nor was it a revolver. I wanted a .22lr target pistol for quite a while now... I bought it tonight.

I just wish that they had some more N frames.

On a different note, I saw a couple of Model 10's there with a 3 or 4 inch barrel. Asking price was $280. They were used, but appeared to be in good shape. Did not have original grips either. It seemed like a decent deal. What do you think? If I needed another 38spl, then I might be tempted. I need a bigger safe!

 

[dutcher987]

Originally posted by sash:
As an interesting followup, there was a 10-8, 3" round butt on gunbroker last week with a buy now price of $390. It didn't sell. The same gun was listed a day later (same description and seller) starting at $375 with a buy now price of $425. The winning bid over the weekend was 410 -- 20 bucks OVER the buy price of last week.

I think lots of you are correct about the economy. Right now, there is some tension between the poor economy on one hand, and fear of the new administration on the other. It will be interesting to see how it sorts out, but I hope there will be some nice deals on square butt K frames over the next year or two.

Wow, that is crazy that the same gun sold a week later for more money. The economy and the new administration is scaring a lot of people right now.

Gun sales at my local gun shops have been through the roof over the last month. I mean insane sales numbers. Good business for them. Get while the getting is good. I wonder what the new year will bring?

I see more insanely priced guns coming our way.

 

[GUNKWAZY]

Well, you guys that think I'm selling my guns for cheap better think again.
I'd rather sell my cash than my guns.
What I'm trying to say is that everyone and their grandmother is getting a bail out.
Who knows they may even bail out the Detroit Lions after next week.
With the way the feds keep printing money by the truck loads. I'd rather have my guns and ammo than the green stuff.
Green money is gonna be worth bumpkis at this rate.

But then again, I'm... GUNKWAZY

 

[dutcher987]

Originally posted by GUNKWAZY:
Well, you guys that think I'm selling my guns for cheap better think again.
I'd rather sell my cash than my guns.
What I'm trying to say is that everyone and their grandmother is getting a bail out.
Who knows they may even bail out the Detroit Lions after next week.
With the way the feds keep printing money by the truck loads. I'd rather have my guns and ammo than the green stuff.
Green money is gonna be worth bumpkis at this rate.

But then again, I'm... GUNKWAZY

I am with you there. Our guns are like gold. Gold keeps going up as the dollar weakens. Keep the guns. They are like an investment now.

 

[jayrod]

Notime2,
Just a friendly word. Don't for a second lump "young buyers" togather into one clump and give the "black gun" line. The closest thing I have to a black gun is my vintage PPK/S, however the majority of my collection is Smiths, M36 flat latch, M60 no dash, 1899, Model 10V, Highway Patrolman... the list goes on. Just saying, there are more young guys that have alot of reverence for these guns, personally, nearly all of my gun budget is spent on "the classics" real BLUED Smith and Wessons.

 

[Bill Bates]

Originally posted by dutcher987:

Originally posted by sash:
As an interesting followup, there was a 10-8, 3" round butt on gunbroker last week with a buy now price of $390. It didn't sell. The same gun was listed a day later (same description and seller) starting at $375 with a buy now price of $425. The winning bid over the weekend was 410 -- 20 bucks OVER the buy price of last week.

I think lots of you are correct about the economy. Right now, there is some tension between the poor economy on one hand, and fear of the new administration on the other. It will be interesting to see how it sorts out, but I hope there will be some nice deals on square butt K frames over the next year or two.

Wow, that is crazy that the same gun sold a week later for more money. The economy and the new administration is scaring a lot of people right now.

Gun sales at my local gun shops have been through the roof over the last month. I mean insane sales numbers. Good business for them. Get while the getting is good. I wonder what the new year will bring?

I see more insanely priced guns coming our way.

I work for a major retailer that sells firearms new and used. I'm just a photographer and don't speak for the comapany but I spend my days photographing used firearms and see what comes and goes through the doors.

Firearm sales and related product are through the roof. And, that is all firearms not just the "black guns". From cheap to the very high end stuff sales have been very good through the last half of the year both new and used.

Something else has changed, not many people are bringing in used guns to sell. People are holding onto what they have.

So my prediction for the near future is to see prices increase. It is simple supply and demand. Demand is through the roof. In the used market, if people are holding onto what they have, supplies will be down. That means prices and values are likley to be going up.

 

[fyimo]

I think you have hit the nail on the head in terms of the current gun market. The election and potential changes to the guns laws have caused a buying frenzy of guns (all types), Hi cap magazines, ammo, and reloading components.

Stores and pawn shops in my area are really low on inventory of new and used handguns, handgun ammo, reloading supplies. Walmart has had almost zero handgun ammo in stock for months. When they get it in it's all sold in a matter of hours.

I think the economy will stay in the tank for then next few years and down the road there will be some good deals out there on guns. I think this current buying frenzy will settle down in the next 6 months and many of these newly acquired guns will be back on the market when people need the money to eat, buy gas and pay rent.

Also like it or not Gunbroker, Ebay, and the other places where people are allowed to easily sell items to a large buying public is what sets the market prices on these items. On guns you have the factor of shipping and transfer fee but locally you pay sales taxes.

If you can buy a Model 27 in 98% condition on Gunbroker for $750 and want it then that's what its worth to you at the time. If you have done your home work and have looked at what they have been selling at gun shows, on Auction Arms and Gunbroker and the price is a good one based on recent sale prices then you got a good deal. This of course implies that the gun was represented for sale accurately.

I see this all the time with coins. Certified coins from PCGS and NGC are really a commodity and a MS 65 is a MS 65. Dealers try to get a 30 to 40% premium on these over Ebay prices and it just doesn't work. I don't care if you have more overhead costs I'm going to buy a good looking example of a Graded coin at the lowest cost I can. The coin certification process was done by dealers so they could buy correctly graded coins sight unseen for their businesses