Walther PP: What should I know about 'em

[Texas Star]

These are very nice little guns. The Manurian German police guns are a good deal. Some might work well, some might need just a little gunsmithing.

They are not as durable or reliable as modern pocket guns. I remember reading, long ago, an article wherein the acceptable number of malfunctions for the old Walther PP (post war, before the 9mm pistols like HK P7, Walther P5, etc) for the German police was 1 malfunction in 50 rounds. Today, this is a jam-0-matic. Back then, it was normal.

There was also an Army General who, in the 1950's, did a 'torture test' of some German military sidearms. The PP and PPK didn't make 4,000 rounds before they cracked, broke, and malfunctioned. I cannot remember where I read that, but it suck out in my mind.

These are well machined, nicely made pocket guns that are meant to be carried and shot sparingly.

I do like them.

That article was in, American Rifleman, and was a large influence on Ian Fleming when he gave James Bond a PPK. That was NOT his friend Geoffrey Boothroyd's doing. He favored S&W snub .38's. He told me so. He especially liked the Centennial, which was new at that time. I told B. that I favored the S&W M-36 with three-inch barrel and round butt. We both agreed on the M-60 after it appeared, because it offered the advantages of stainless steel.

Interesting article, but it pitted full size service pistols like the Colt .45, the Nambu, and P-38 against pocket pistols carried mainly by high ranking officers.

The one jam per 50 rounds average came either from me here or from an article in, Guns & Ammo, written by a German who had access to police records in his country. I was quoting him and have never seen any other reference to those figures.

 

[American1776]

That article was in, American Rifleman, and was a large influence on Ian Fleming when he gave James Bond a PPK. That was NOT his friend Geoffrey Boothroyd's doing. He favored S&W snub .38's. He told me so. He especially liked the Centennial, which was new at that time. I told B. that I favored the S&W M-36 with three-inch barrel and round butt. We both agreed on the M-60 after it appeared, because it offered the advantages of stainless steel.

Interesting article, but it pitted full size service pistols like the Colt .45, the Nambu, and P-38 against pocket pistols carried mainly by high ranking officers.

The one jam per 50 rounds average came either from me here or from an article in, Guns & Ammo, written by a German who had access to police records in his country. I was quoting him and have never seen any other reference to those figures.

Thank you for helping with the citations. I've read so much over the years, it's difficult to track down or remember exactly every citation.

 

[BB57]

In Communist times before 1990, the FEG 9mm Mak was the "poor man's PP" in the Eastern bloc. Higher ranks in the East German "People's Police", the Stasi, and the party got a German Makarov copy made in Suhl, lower ranks had to content themselves with a Hungarian wannabe PP (the two-tone alloy frame variant, to cut cost).

I think quality has improved quite a bit since FEG has been competing in Western markets. Or maybe the PA-63's low esteem was just a prestige thing to begin with. I once read something by a retired West Berlin officer who recalled feeling quite resentful about having to carry "French-made" P1 pistols instead of "real Walthers", and then feeling quite stupid when he found out later that the Manurhin-marked P1s were just as German-made as the Walther-marked ones.

I like the steel frame civilian AP series pistols but I'm not a fan of the alloy frame military PA series pistols or their alloy frame commercial derivatives.

The original 7.65 Browning caliber 48.M Walam military and police pistol was a close copy of the PP with a fair percentage of parts interchangability including post war PP magazines.

It was replaced in police service by the PPK sized, 9x18mm Makarov caliber R59 which used an aluminum frame. Not many were made and it was quickly replaced as the aluminum frames didn't last long due to both wear and a tendency to crack.

The R61 was a redesign using an aluminum-titanium alloy frame, and there were similar MR-61 (9x18) and BR-61 (.380 ACP) pistols with commercial runs of all three from around 2003 to 2007, as well as the RL-61, a commercial steel frame pistol in .22LR.

The Hungarian military replaced the 48M with the PA-63, similar to the R-61 but PP sized with a 3.9" barrel and a 7 round magazine. The commercial export version of this is the PPH.

My objection is partly due the lighter weight and the less pleasant shooting traits in 9x18 or .380 ACP. The rest of it is due to the general condition of most of these surplus pistols.

KBI imported a number of aluminum-titanium frame PMK (PP sized) and SMC (PPK/S sized) pistols but they didn't spec them at a very high level of quality and they don't tend to be as reliable as the AP series pistols imported by Interarms and TGI.

 

[shawn mccarver]

I've got a Hege Waffen .32acp (an FEG PP clone) that's in good shape mechanically but has a lot of outside miles on it.
I'd like to get a "real" one.

Would appreciate any tips, hints, info folks might have about PPs. They've been made for a long time, with Walther, Manurhin, and S&W (?) working on them. (Not really interested in PPK, I like "larger" guns!)

I want a shooter, not a collector's piece...what should I look for in terms of maker, model, year, etc. (not condition...I know how to do that).

Thanks in advance.

Go here to learn about the PP series of pistols, including the PP, the PPK, and the sport model, PPK/S:

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