Maddog 521
Member
I'd of stopped at "salting the roof"
Our power is underground and I really like that.
Our power is underground and I really like that.
Weird Power Outage
- Thread starter Tom S.
- Start date
Every house has two 120v lines and a neutral. My guess is when the tree fell on the lines, it shorted out one of the lines, or it may have physically separated one line's connection. Transformers have fuses for each line and if the line shorted, the fuse should have blown for that line segment. Or as I stated, the strain of the weight on the line physically pulled the line connection apart. End result of either situation is only one of the 120 volt lines to our homes has power, the other is dead.
Since half of my electrical panel was dead while the other half was still hot, I swapped the two breakers that supplied power to my fridge and furnace into spots that were still hot. It would have been nice if my panel had open spots but it full so I had to pull two breakers that were on the hot side to move the furnace/refrig breakers into. The breakers I pulled controlled power to the back yard lights/outside outlets and part of my garage. I lost use of my garage door opener, but was able to run an extension cord to it from an outlet that still had power.
I hope that clears it up for you. Losing the one leg means that none of my 240 volt equipment works, so no stove, no air conditioning and no welding or air compressor. 240V equipment needs two 120v lines to operate. Since it's 26 degrees, a/c is no loss, and I still have my propane grill to fall back on for cooking.
Power company was out yesterday. It seems the stress of tree cracked a pole in the NW corner of my property, a cross pole that has a boat load of wires, including fiber optics for the cable company. The plan is to replace the pole today before removing the tree which seems kind of odd to me but that stuff is out of my wheelhouse. The pole was slated to be replaced anyway as they have been replacing several poles in our area in the past 6 months including one across the street last week. Some of these poles have to be 70 years old as they still had climbing cleats on them, something the utility companies stopped using in the 50's I believe.
Ironically, the only piece of mail I got yesterday was my electric bill.I wonder if they'll accept half payment since I only have half power?
I assume Tom is just giving a short description of his solution. If 1/2 your panel is out and you need any circuits on that side to continue to have power you can't just move a breaker, you also need to move the wires for those circuits to the panel side that is still hot.
OP
Provided the wires are long enough, you only need to move the breaker with it's wire attached to a hot side.
Breaker boxes aren't divided into 'sides' per-say, even though they look that way. Instead, the first row of breakers will be on one leg of power, the second row will be on the other. The 3rd row will be back on the first leg and the 4th row on the other leg, and so on down the panel to the bottom. This is done so that when you need a 240 breaker, it simply occupies two slots on the same row (right or left) but has access to the needed 2 separate 120 lines.
In my situation, all I needed to do was pull the breaker below the ones I needed to move and plug them into the resulting spots. No need to remove any wires.
NOTE! It MUST be noted and emphasized that only people with electrical experience should ever do work inside an electric panel box!!!
PLEASE READ THAT AGAIN!!!
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I had that happen once; it seems a splice on one of the hot lines going to the house pulled apart. I lost every other circuit in the box. The power company said it was a good thing I called them first as an electrician would have just told me to call them and charge me for it. I
This is something an old construction manager talked about but I never saw. Terry might stretch the truth but only if the sun came up.
The company needed to cross lava rock in Idaho and the equipment they had could not cut it. They brought in a blasting contractor with a 2 week wait time. They drilled and set up charges. The blast reportedly set up a lot of dust, took 3"-4" off the top and created a pressure wave that "bounced 5 poles out of the ground a half mile away, just as easily as pulling popsicles out of a wrapper."
I have never had an extended out of power situation. My worst out of gas involved driving 4 hours, working 58 out of the next 72 hours, lighting pilots and running lines, then driving back home.
The company needed to cross lava rock in Idaho and the equipment they had could not cut it. They brought in a blasting contractor with a 2 week wait time. They drilled and set up charges. The blast reportedly set up a lot of dust, took 3"-4" off the top and created a pressure wave that "bounced 5 poles out of the ground a half mile away, just as easily as pulling popsicles out of a wrapper."
I have never had an extended out of power situation. My worst out of gas involved driving 4 hours, working 58 out of the next 72 hours, lighting pilots and running lines, then driving back home.
I do believe that every new home owner should read how their electrical/mechanical/plumbing systems work so they understand what Tom S. is talking about. Now that doesn't mean try to fix it if you don't do that stuff, but at least know how things work. And when you call an expert, offer him a drink or something then go away until he calls you. He/she does not need your help! And is it IS a she, don't act like it's the 1st time you ever saw a woman! I know what I can do & what not. "...gots to know his limitations!"
RobertK3026
Member
Since I was a Electricial/Foreman for 40 plus years Tom's information is spot on.
Please if you want to check things yourself don't count on all the u-tube videos are correct, they can get you hurt or damage your house.
OP
Tomorrow will be day 7 of half power operation. Did laundry yesterday by running an extension cord from a near by operating outlet to the washer and drier. Power company has missed 3 "power restoration dates" and yesterday we had another ice storm that created more outages. This has been a crazy experience!
I love my Kohler automatic generator. Bought it about 8 years ago and it runs everything including my AC. Wasn't cheap, but I believe it's worth its weight in gold and going to be more so in the near future.
But when you take a step back and look at this whole outage thing, we have to ask ourselves why should we even be going thru this?
But when you take a step back and look at this whole outage thing, we have to ask ourselves why should we even be going thru this?
OP
Indeed! The power poles in my neighborhood were put in when the subdivision was built - 70 years ago. That is a long time to expect a piece of wood stuck in the ground to remain solid and uncompromised by temps as low as -20 to above 100 degrees, plus wind, snow, ice and ultra-violet rays of the sun. And in almost all cases, the wires themselves are of the same vintage. The power company touts how much they spend on keeping the grid updated but areas like mine prove that claim to be false. As I stated in a previous post, the post behind my house was supposed to be replaced more than 10 years ago but wasn't.
The latest? The power company is offering a $35 credit to those who have been without power for more than 4 days. $35 won't run the typical 7000 watt portable generator for two days. I'm blessed that I'm still able to function albeit at half power, but if I was among the unfortunates without any power, I'd be more than just irate.
twodog max
Member
When my house had half power and the power company found it was there problem they were able to bring out a device that looked like a big set of jumper cables on a hand truck. They pulled the meter and put the cables on and we had whole house power until repairs were made. I was only a day or so but we were taken care of. Of course that company is not your and we had no ice storm at the time. Both items make a big difference
Sometimes called a " Servisavor " . That one was a type of transformer that will take 120 volts from one leg and give you another leg of 120volts with a phase shift between them .
There is also another type that will produce three phase power from a single phase source .
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OP
Utility company showed up yesterday, a crew out of Pennsylvania. After scoping things out, they cut the power and went to work. Four hours later and the power is back - both sides!
For some reason the street lights are still out but hey, I'm happy with what I got. Swapped the breakers back into their proper places, stowed away the extension cords and life is back to normal. Even the dog is happy, he can see where he's "going" when he's out back.
Still have the cracked pole in the back yard. Now they are talking about putting a girdle on it instead of replacing it, at least short term. I told the utility worker he could come back in 20 years and I'd bet the same pole with the girdle would still be there. He wouldn't take my bet.
For some reason the street lights are still out but hey, I'm happy with what I got. Swapped the breakers back into their proper places, stowed away the extension cords and life is back to normal. Even the dog is happy, he can see where he's "going" when he's out back.
Still have the cracked pole in the back yard. Now they are talking about putting a girdle on it instead of replacing it, at least short term. I told the utility worker he could come back in 20 years and I'd bet the same pole with the girdle would still be there. He wouldn't take my bet.
OP
Update to this thread. Below are pictures of a piece of machinery I had seen but never observed operating. It is an amazing piece of equipment. It is a crane that is capable of hoisting two buckets for people to work from. The buckets can be removed by removing one pin, then the unit can be used as a hoist to lift power poles. A device can be added to the end to actually grab the pole and move it into location. There is an auger for digging the hole, and hydraulic hookups to run a tamper to compress the dirt around the newly installed pole. And the unit is slightly under 4 feet wide (with the buckets removed), so it will go many places. Watching it and it's highly skilled operator was like watching a surgeon. He literally lifted and set the pole right next to the broken one, threading it neatly between the existing high voltage lines on the old pole.
Side view:
End view coming into the yard:
Boring the 6 foot deep hole (the guy sitting on the pole is the operator, using remote controls):
Lifting the pole:
Note the 'grabber' at the top:
Guiding into place - note the pole is between the high voltage lines:
Set in place:
My neighbor's departed husband used to say he loved work, he could watch it all day long. When you see a skilled group like these guys, I completely agree! The rest of the day was spent putting the cross pieces in place and transferring the wires. They still haven't moved the lower power lines running to the houses, but I think a different crew may be coming for that. Notice that the top of this tapered pole is about the same diameter, maybe a tad larger than the base of the 70 year old pole it is replacing. This pole should last a while!
Side view:
End view coming into the yard:
Boring the 6 foot deep hole (the guy sitting on the pole is the operator, using remote controls):
Lifting the pole:
Note the 'grabber' at the top:
Guiding into place - note the pole is between the high voltage lines:
Set in place:
My neighbor's departed husband used to say he loved work, he could watch it all day long. When you see a skilled group like these guys, I completely agree! The rest of the day was spent putting the cross pieces in place and transferring the wires. They still haven't moved the lower power lines running to the houses, but I think a different crew may be coming for that. Notice that the top of this tapered pole is about the same diameter, maybe a tad larger than the base of the 70 year old pole it is replacing. This pole should last a while!
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That truly is and they even brought steel used to cover street cuts to pave their path not only protecting the device but also saving the property. I love working with or watching a well oiled, professional crew.
