What .38 was my Dad issued in Vietnam?

[gfors]

My father passed away 2 weeks ago. I've been combing through his memorabilia, and I came across a photo of him, with an A1E, at Bien Hoa AFB. He has an M16 in his hand and an S&W on his hip.
I'm putting this post in this forum (1961-80) because my dad was stationed at Bien Hoa from 64-65. I suspect that the gun in question might be older. Mods, please move this thread, if it is more appropriate in another sub-forum.
Does anyone have a reasonable guess as to what he was carrying on his hip? Why weren't he and his flying buddies issued 1911's? I'm thinking there was no disputing .45 vs .38 in the lethality dept. Quicker reloads and larger capacity also favor the 1911. He wanted more capacity; so, he bought a BHP. The Browning was stolen from his hotel, before he ever got to the base. He ended up carrying the .38. Why did the AF choose revos? Was it a training issue? Reliability? Scared of "cocked and locked"?
I hope someone can shed some light on the side arm situation of those times.
Here are some pics of my dad, his ribbons, and some patches. He was awarded a Small Arms Expert Marksmanship Medal (bottom row, second from left), but he could remember few details about the gun he carried. Probably, had his "head in the clouds", as his dad often said.

 

[Narragansett]

My father passed away 2 weeks ago. I've been combing through his memorabilia, and I came across a photo of him, with an A1E, at Bien Hoa AFB. He has an M16 in his hand and an S&W on his hip.
I'm putting this post in this forum (1961-80) because my dad was stationed at Bien Hoa from 64-65. I suspect that the gun in question might be older. Mods, please move this thread, if it is more appropriate in another sub-forum.
Does anyone have a reasonable guess as to what he was carrying on his hip? Why weren't he and his flying buddies issued 1911's? I'm thinking there was no disputing .45 vs .38 in the lethality dept. Quicker reloads and larger capacity also favor the 1911. He wanted more capacity; so, he bought a BHP. The Browning was stolen from his hotel, before he ever got to the base. He ended up carrying the .38. Why did the AF choose revos? Was it a training issue? Reliability? Scared of "cocked and locked"?
I hope someone can shed some light on the side arm situation of those times.
Here are some pics of my dad, his ribbons, and some patches. He was awarded a Small Arms Expert Marksmanship Medal (bottom row, second from left), but he could remember few details about the gun he carried. Probably, had his "head in the clouds", as his dad often said.

Nice post! I might guess it would be a model 10, 38 cal

 

[Bumpus13]

Wasn't it the Air Force that issued Model 15's?

If memory serves, I believe it was.

 

[SLT223]

Thank you for sharing your photos and story. Sorry for your loss. The Airforce contracted Model 15's...4" adjustable rear sight .38 Special.

 

[triaxle]

The grip looks like a model 15.

 

[ACORN]

Sorry for your loss. Your dad was a good looking guy. I'm guessing as already posted a 15.

 

[junglefighter]

The few AF that I talked to in country who carried a 4" bbl. revolver that was issued carried a S&W M15. As to "cocked & locked",1911's were carried in Cond.3,hammer down on empty chamber.

 

[CheyenneBodie]

Probably a M-15 Combat Masterpiece. There may have been some older M-10s laying about the armory. Great pictures and very impressive rack of ribbons with the Silver Star being at the top. Love USAF humor with the A1E Skyraider patch "Crater Creator" LOL. The other picture with him as a Colonel next to the F16 -- must have been quite a difference between the A1E Skyraider and a F16 "viper" -- like a Model-T Ford to a Formula 1 race car.

 

[H Richard]

I know the USAF had Mod 15's in 59-63, but mainly the Air Police. I think pilots were still issued Mod 10's, but could carry whatever they wanted if they furnished it.

 

[OLDSTER]

Wasn't it the Air Force that issued Model 15's?

If memory serves, I believe it was.

Yes: Model 15's. My cousin flew B-52s over N. Vietnam, and has several photos in his album of him "ready to go" with his 15 ( 15-2 or 15-3) in a shoulder rig.

 

[kwill1911]

The Model 15 became the standard sidearm for the USAF in the early 1960s. If you do a search you can find lots of threads with pictures.

 

[g8rb8]

Possibilities:
.38 Military & Police (if made after after 1957 the Model 10)
.38 Military & Police Airweight (if made after 1957 the Model 12)
K-38 Combat Masterpiece a.k.a. the Model 15

From the pictures, even magnified, I cannot tell which model you dad is carrying. The differentiating characteristics of the above models:
.38 M&P (Model 10) - all steel
.38 M&P Airweight (Model 12) - alloy frame
K-38 Combat Masterpiece (Model 15) - adjustable rear sight

My guess is your dad is carrying a S&W .38 Military and Police (a.k.a. The Model 10 after 1957).

Based upon my recollections of posts on this forum and Wikipedia the K-38 Combat Masterpiece was more likely to be used by Military Police. Hopefully a more knowledgeable member of this forum can comment.

Reason for edit: By the time I finished typing my reply and reading I see there may be a bit of confusion as the the most likely revolver your dad was carrying. Without a clear picture of the majority of the revolver I am not sure if we can really be certain.

 

[jimmyj]

S&W Model 15.
In my era Pilots were issued revolvers as the thinking was a revolver would be easier to operate if one arm was injured, plus maintenance was simpler

 

[Jim Watson]

If I cross my eyes and squint, the grips look like Magnas, which would probably mean an M15.

Revolvers were secondary standard in the military for a long time after adoption of the 1911.
I conclude that pilots got revolvers because they were considered less likely to need a sidearm than a ground troop.

A coworker had been a Navy Shore Patrolman. He carried an M&P until his last spell in the service when he got one of the government Ruger Service Sixes.

 

[gfors]

The few AF that I talked to in country who carried a 4" bbl. revolver that was issued carried a S&W M15. As to "cocked & locked",1911's were carried in Cond.3,hammer down on empty chamber.

If protocol was to carry Condition 3, did you carry a rock to throw at the enemy, to gain time to rack the slide? Just kidding...but seriously, I can see why one would opt for a revolver, in that case.

 

[gfors]

S&W Model 15.
In my era Pilots were issued revolvers as the thinking was a revolver would be easier to operate if one arm was injured, plus maintenance was simpler

Never thought of that, but it makes perfect sense.

 

[gfors]

Possibilities:
.38 Military & Police (if made after after 1957 the Model 10)
.38 Military & Police Airweight (if made after 1957 the Model 12)
K-38 Combat Masterpiece a.k.a. the Model 15

From the pictures, even magnified, I cannot tell which model you dad is carrying. The differentiating characteristics of the above models:
.38 M&P (Model 10) - all steel
.38 M&P Airweight (Model 12) - alloy frame
K-38 Combat Masterpiece (Model 15) - adjustable rear sight

My guess is your dad is carrying a S&W .38 Military and Police (a.k.a. The Model 10 after 1957).

Based upon my recollections of posts on this forum and Wikipedia the K-38 Combat Masterpiece was more likely to be used by Military Police. Hopefully a more knowledgeable member of this forum can comment.

Reason for edit: By the time a finished typing my reply and reading I see there may be a bit of confusion as the the most likely revolver your dad was carrying. Without a clear picture of the majority of the revolver I am not sure if we can really be certain.

Unfortunately, I only have the one photo, with sidearm. I was thinking M&P, M10 or M15, but was really hoping someone from that time and place might see it here, and know for sure. I figured it was a long-shot, at best.

 

[Wrangler Rich]

Sorry for your loss, I'm sure you are proud of your Dad, and I thank him for his service.
I was issued a 1911 that was so loose, that I couldn't hit anything with it if I tried. I requested, from our Company Armorer, a Smith & Wesson revolver in it's stead, and received a model 15 in 1970. I would bet, that is what is riding on your Dad's hip.

WR

 

[THE PILGRIM]

Later, like when I was in Thailand, Model 15s was standard for everybody in the USAF.
Earlier, could have been Model 10.
The AF got away from 1911s long before that.
The first Military owned Gun I ever fired was a 1911.
That was the only time I ever fired one in the USAF.
The APs carried 1911s for a while after that, but went to revolvers.
That's pretty much the story for Gov guns.
Then we jump to personal pieces. Did he carry one of his guns?
Quite a few AF folks carried personal guns.
As I have posted, I usually carried my Model 19.

 

[Huski92]

Sorry for your loss. And thanks for his service.


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