What Can I Do About the Trigger Pull?

[thatroolz]

The 6.15+/- LBs of trigger pull feels horrible. While I don't have a lot of experience shooting .308, it sure does seem a bit excessive. I have an M&P .40 and the trigger pull is supposedly 6.5 LBs and it doesn't seem near as hard to pull as the M&P10s. Any suggestions?

 

[rojodiablo]

There are a couple cheap and easy things to do.
1. Shoot it al lot.
2. Break it down, and get the sear spring, the one with the 2 long legs. Work that spring manually a bunch of times. You can stress it and hold it with a bit more range of motion than the trigger/ sear will actually do.
3. You can cut one leg on this spring. (I do not recommend this, because I just don't recommend this!) But people do it sometimes, and many are happy. Look it up on the internet; search Youtube for lightening an AR trigger, etc.)
4. Say "To hell with it!" and buy a new trigger. Which is fine for a bench rifle, or a safe queen. For a carrying rifle, one that will have multiple shooters, and be shot during training exercises with other shooters moving around, working dynamically and not on the bench????

I will stick to the trigger that was designed for that purpose, as I see several times a year when guys accidentally shoot the dirt under our feet from trying to train actively with a 2.75lb Giselle trigger. Which is a thing of beauty on a bench. But IMO it's just too danm light for trying to use on a rifle on the move.

 

[rootbrain]

There are a couple cheap and easy things to do.
1. Shoot it al lot.
2. Break it down, and get the sear spring, the one with the 2 long legs. Work that spring manually a bunch of times. You can stress it and hold it with a bit more range of motion than the trigger/ sear will actually do.
3. You can cut one leg on this spring. (I do not recommend this, because I just don't recommend this!) But people do it sometimes, and many are happy. Look it up on the internet; search Youtube for lightening an AR trigger, etc.)
4. Say "To hell with it!" and buy a new trigger. Which is fine for a bench rifle, or a safe queen. For a carrying rifle, one that will have multiple shooters, and be shot during training exercises with other shooters moving around, working dynamically and not on the bench????

I will stick to the trigger that was designed for that purpose, as I see several times a year when guys accidentally shoot the dirt under our feet from trying to train actively with a 2.75lb Giselle trigger. Which is a thing of beauty on a bench. But IMO it's just too danm light for trying to use on a rifle on the move.

+1 on this. What is the gun used for? If this is a bench gun for long range precision fine get an aftermarket $200+ trigger, but for duty/hunting rifle you don't want too light of trigger. You can send your lower to Bill Springfield in Colorado Springs, CO. (just down highway from me) and he can rework it to get a couple of lbs pull off with a better break.

 

[ole-cowboy]

honestly mine is pretty good..
it is not a bench trigger and I dont want one in this gun, so I would echo what rojodiablo said. dry fire a bunch...disassemble, look for rough spots, clean and lubricate. if its a bench gun... by all means use a bench trigger

 

[thatroolz]

Bench triggers

Thanks for the thoughts on the matter. This is definitely a bench gun only. So I should be looking for something around 2lbs for a good bench rest gun? Any recommendations?

 

[thatroolz]

Look it up on the internet; search Youtube for lightening an AR trigger, etc.)
.

I see a lot of stuff about AR-15 triggers. Are they the same as this AR-10?

 

[rojodiablo]

Thanks for the thoughts on the matter. This is definitely a bench gun only. So I should be looking for something around 2lbs for a good bench rest gun? Any recommendations?

I never, ever go below 3-3.5lb pull.
As a matter of course, anything under 3 is literally getting into 'Fart& fire' light.
Giselle, Timney, and RRA has a 2 stage that is really nice.
A good bench trigger will run $150-250.

A friend has a 2.25 trigger on his prairie dog rifle. It can go off if you look at it wrong. He has a 44 S&W with a reworked trigger that is around 1.5lb. I won't shoot it. It DOES go off the second you tap the trigger. It's not even safe at that light.

For comparison, the average trigger on a Remington model 700 is about 3.25lb. And they are basically the benchmark for what a simple, good trigger is and should be. No creep. Just touch, press and boom. Most rifle triggers which are box stock and feel 'Good, and light, with no creep' are right around this weight.
The Savage Accutrigger system is very nice. Something that mimics it would be a good thing for a bench rifle.

 

[rojodiablo]

I see a lot of stuff about AR-15 triggers. Are they the same as this AR-10?

Without getting exact on size of parts in the kit, yes- the parts and design are the same. The disassembly and reassembly is the same for a 'Mil-spec' based system. I have had great results in just flexing a tough spring a bunch, and cleaning the trigger parts carefully. I usually see the trigger a touch softer, and I call it good. Sometimes, the mating surfaces are terrible looking. And with the current state of rush manufacturing of anything and everything AR related?? It is worth the time to look at all the trigger mating surfaces, to see that they are clean and smooth. A small chatter mark from a machining tool can make a lot of difference. But polish carefully, and really be sure what is what. You can make things better, and some things you can screw them up if you do too much.

 

[thatroolz]

I have had great results in just flexing a tough spring a bunch, and cleaning the trigger parts carefully. I usually see the trigger a touch softer, and I call it good. Sometimes, the mating surfaces are terrible looking. And with the current state of rush manufacturing of anything and everything AR related?? It is worth the time to look at all the trigger mating surfaces, to see that they are clean and smooth. A small chatter mark from a machining tool can make a lot of difference. But polish carefully, and really be sure what is what. You can make things better, and some things you can screw them up if you do too much.

What do you all think of this procedure?

AR15 Trigger Job - YouTube

 

[rojodiablo]

He does a pretty good job with it.

 

[thatroolz]

So much better now!!

I have had great results in just flexing a tough spring a bunch, and cleaning the trigger parts carefully. I usually see the trigger a touch softer, and I call it good. Sometimes, the mating surfaces are terrible looking. And with the current state of rush manufacturing of anything and everything AR related?? It is worth the time to look at all the trigger mating surfaces, to see that they are clean and smooth. A small chatter mark from a machining tool can make a lot of difference. But polish carefully, and really be sure what is what. You can make things better, and some things you can screw them up if you do too much.

You couldn't have been more correct. I took it apart and it wasn't even polished. It had paint on the mating surfaces still. I used a whetstone and some Brasso metal polish to smooth out the mating surfaces and wow what a difference! I also worked the spring after I put the trigger and hammer back in by pulling the trigger and letting the hammer hit my had over and over. I was pretty simple, just pull the trigger then rearm it by placing the hammer back in and pull the trigger again... and so on. I did this at least a couple of hundred times. The trigger pull used to feel chunky (worse than gritty). Now it feels smooth as silk. It also helps to see exactly how the trigger works. I can visualize it in my mind while shooting and I have a better feel of it now. Thanks for the info. I am very pleased with it now!

 

[thatroolz]

How the trigger works

For those of you that haven't looked into the trigger... this video sums it up quite well. I didn't get my mating surfaces quite as nice as his, but pretty damn close!

How an AR 15 Trigger Works - YouTube

 

[vfin]

When I bought my M&P10 I asked the vendor how many do ya have in stock...and he replied "quite a few"...so...

I asked..."If I buy one would you have your gunsmith check the trigger pull on every one and send me the one that's at or below 4#?.

He said "Sure"...he'll check every one if ya don't mind relying on his expertise.

Needless to say I've got a 3.5# pull on my M&P 10 trigger and its as smooth as my Sniper Rifle's trigger.

:::That's how ya buy a weapon when you've read about alleged trigger woes:::

vfin --> "ask and ye shall receive"

 

[thatroolz]

I was lucky to get the one I got. I had to wait almost 2 months for it!

 

[Nuker1]

I put a Wilson Combat 2 Stage TTU in my M&P 10. Huge difference, subtle 1st stage, 2nd stage breaks sharp and crisp at 4lbs. Drop in install, just requires removal of ambi bolt release.

 

[rojodiablo]

Glad to see it was a simple fix, and a good time learning a little more about your rifle.

 

[duggie76]

I finally had time to sit down and address the terrible feel of my trigger. Using a 10 lb fish scale (not the most accurate), I measured my pull at 8 lbs. I didn't like the thought of sand paper on the sears, and know of better ways to polish hardened steel. I have put over 500 rds through my gun, and barely broke the surface of the oxide. I cleaned the oxide off and began polishing with a solid carbide hone. (Had the carbide for my knives). I spent about 2 hrs polishing to get the hardened sears to a chrome like finish. After gun grease and reassembly, I reduced the pull to about 5 lbs on the same fish scale. Definately worth the time.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk

 

[MistWolf]

The M&P-10 trigger may be different, but the standard AR triggers are only case hardened and often it's a very thin layer. If you polish or stone the sears, be aware it may not take much to cut into the softer material beneath.

The long take up (creep) in the standard AR trigger is there to prevent unintentional discharges from fumble fingered shooters and rough handling. The long reset is to eliminate doubling.

A crisp, predictable trigger is better than a light trigger. In fact, a heavy, crisp trigger can feel lighter than a light mushy, gritty trigger. (Some will install lighter hammer springs for a lighter pull but going too light will result in light primer strikes.)

I have made improvements on standard AR triggers simply by removing, cleaning and applying grease before reinstalling them. It helped quite a bit with my Big Smith. Still, I think it would be much better if I installed an ALG or G2S or SSA trigger (these triggers have a pull uf 4.5 lbs or more) or an SSA-E (3.5 lbs)

I don't find the SSA (4.5 lbs) to be too light for field work but I do have to be more careful with the SSA-E which is crisper and lighter (3.5 lbs). Of course my hands have stiffened some as I've gotten older

 

[copemech]

Look up Bill Springfield on google. He will do you a 3 or 4# trigger at very reasonable cost. Just send him your group parts

 

[MistWolf]

Bill Springfield will make your trigger light & crisp but he makes no guarantee that he won't cut through the case hardening. There have been several reports of AR triggers doubling, caused by the acclerated wear of the sears when the case hardening was cut away to expose the softer material below.

An ALG QMS trigger is only $45, is safe, reliable, robust and a significant improvement over the standard AR trigger
Rainier Arms™ | Browse | Trigger Groups | ALG Defense Quality Mil-Spec - QMS

The ALG ACT is $65
https://www.rainierarms.com/?page=shop/detail&product_id=3022