What "should" I have done???

[Capt Steve]

At the local supermarket this afternoon: The store is fairly crowded and I am in the process of paying for a few items. Twenty feet away at the customer service counter is a guy, mid fifties wearing Levi's and white tee shirt. His gun, (looked like a compact 9mm or perhaps a .380), well virtually all of the grip anyway, is sticking out of the top of his pants as his tee shirt had come untucked (I guess)and was riding inside of the grip. He didn't seem to notice but a number of folks in the store did and were beginning to freak out. A few pointed, several whispered back and forth but the bottom line was that his piece was getting a lot of undesirable attention.

My first thought was to quietly tell him he was "showing" but decided to mind my own business. If he reacted badly to the news it could have turned into an ugly scene in a crowded store and I wanted none of that. He must have had an IWB holster, but I suspect that even if the tee shirt had been tucked over the gun that it would have printed through clearly.

My question is what should I have done? Tell him or let it go. If a LEO had spotted him he would have had a serious problem. While Arizona is an open carry state you have to have the gun completely visible or if legally carrying concealed, then completely (no printing), concealed it must be. Any store employee could have assumed bad intent and things could have gotten interesting. I waited outside for a couple of minutes thinking I could tell him more discreetly there but then realized if he knew it was showing he probably didn't want to hear about it from a stranger. What would you folks have done? BTW, my Bersa .380 was secure in the IWB holster completely covered by a Hawaiian shirt.

 

[Capt Steve]

At the local supermarket this afternoon: The store is fairly crowded and I am in the process of paying for a few items. Twenty feet away at the customer service counter is a guy, mid fifties wearing Levi's and white tee shirt. His gun, (looked like a compact 9mm or perhaps a .380), well virtually all of the grip anyway, is sticking out of the top of his pants as his tee shirt had come untucked (I guess)and was riding inside of the grip. He didn't seem to notice but a number of folks in the store did and were beginning to freak out. A few pointed, several whispered back and forth but the bottom line was that his piece was getting a lot of undesirable attention.

My first thought was to quietly tell him he was "showing" but decided to mind my own business. If he reacted badly to the news it could have turned into an ugly scene in a crowded store and I wanted none of that. He must have had an IWB holster, but I suspect that even if the tee shirt had been tucked over the gun that it would have printed through clearly.

My question is what should I have done? Tell him or let it go. If a LEO had spotted him he would have had a serious problem. While Arizona is an open carry state you have to have the gun completely visible or if legally carrying concealed, then completely (no printing), concealed it must be. Any store employee could have assumed bad intent and things could have gotten interesting. I waited outside for a couple of minutes thinking I could tell him more discreetly there but then realized if he knew it was showing he probably didn't want to hear about it from a stranger. What would you folks have done? BTW, my Bersa .380 was secure in the IWB holster completely covered by a Hawaiian shirt.

 

[wjh2657]

It is his responsibility to make sure his mode of dress is a "go", it's just one of those things that go with carrying. He may not have a permit and the gun may be meant for mayhem, I'm normally a "take care of folks" kind of guy but I have to say you probably were right to leave it alone. When you are not careful about your status, expect security to check, it is their job.This was a job for in-store security, not you.

 

[cmort666]

It depends upon where you are. Here in Ohio, it wouldn't matter. He could walk around with it hanging from a string around his neck. Open carry's completely legal. Inadvertent display means nothing. In other places even accidental display is a crime.

I think you did the right thing.

 

[Erich]

Good Lord. Open carry's legal here, too, but if a person's not intending to do so, help a brother out! Do the same thing you'd do if you encountered a stranger with his fly open or a big booger hanging out of his nose. Tell him in a matter-of-fact way so that he doesn't continue to embarrass himself.

"Hey, partner! You're showing - cover up, friend!" (With a smile, and then move on.)

Same thing I'd want someone to do for me.

 

[.66Cal.]

CAPT STEVE DO YOU STILL HAVE THAT 22A 5" BARREL?

Sorry but can't seem to find another way to contact you. Please email.

I think I would have said something to this guy exposing himself, I mean showing his gun.

 

[GatorFarmer]

VA is an open carry state, though one day I did see a guy with his .45 sticking out in such a way that I couldn't tell if he was intending to carry it openly or it was inadvertently showing. I said, "Excuse me, I just wanted to let you know that your .45 was showing," and he thanked me, looked at it, and shrugged. Guess he wanted it out in the open.

 

[flop-shank]

If I could tell by his actions that he's not a threat (Example: picture a man walking in a downtown shopping area holding hands and chatting with a woman who is most likely his wife. He's printing, but does your common sense suggest at all that he's about to commit a robbery?). I'd politely remind him. We have to help each other, not frighten the <STRIKE>sheep</STRIKE> ostrichs. Many will never be upset about concealed carry if they never see it.

 

[LoboGunLeather]

Back in the colonial days in America openly carrying a weapon was not uncommon, perhaps even expected in many areas. Many public buildings, and even churches, provided musket racks for the convenience of visitors.

What was frowned upon was carrying a weapon concealed. This was taken to be prima fascia evidence of evil intent.

The simple act of waving at someone was originally a form of greeting intended to demonstrate no aggressive intent by the simple fact that the hand held no weapon.

Today, in America, the general public has become unaccustomed to seeing armed citizens going about their business in public places. The mere sight of a firearm can cause unreasonable responses from some people.

Because of the likely reactions to be encountered, the responsible citizen having a need for self-defense in today's world goes to the trouble of making certain that his weapons are concealed precisely to avoid startling, alarming, or otherwise provoking negative responses from others.

So, the entire public perception has done an about-face over the past couple of hundred years. Now, when we notice that someone is carrying a concealed weapon, we know that the likelihood that he or she has criminal intent is actually very, very low. That person has simply committed a social faux pas by not adequately preventing the situation that was described.

Personally, I would have mentioned it to him as privately and quietly as possible. Naturally, I would have remained ready to react appropriately should the man respond aggressively. A smile, a friendly word or two, that's all it takes.

 

[Hikertrash98]

In AZ, with a CCW, if you happen to print or get a little exposure, that's OK. We don't have the strict CCW rules of other states. That being said, he may also have been a cop. As a LEO, I see many others printing VERY badly because this may be the first time they ever carried in plain clothes (since becoming a cop). Since he appeared to have a holster, he probably wasn't a criminal, but you never know. Personally, I would have let him know. I know that's happened to me before, but I've cought it before anyone else has. That's why I carry AIWB exclusively.

 

[rdrancher]

Yeah, I agree with Erich, I would have told him. And I hope that a fellow "brother" would tell me too.

rd

 

[Capt Steve]

Thanks for all of your input. I am still undecided if I should have spoken up or not. I doubt the guy was a LEO but who knows. If he had come out of the store while I was waiting I would have told him but elected not to with lots of folks standing in the immediate vicinity.

.66 Cal - I do have the original 4" barrel for my 22A. It probably has less than 500 rounds through it as I haven't shot it since I got the 7" (I am guessing here as it has been years). Anyway, if you have any interest make me an offer. (o;

 

[.66Cal.]

.66 Cal - I do have the original 4" barrel for my 22A. It probably has less than 500 rounds through it as I haven't shot it since I got the 7" (I am guessing here as it has been years). Anyway, if you have any interest make me an offer. (o;

$75.00 SHIPPED?

 

[Capt Steve]

.66 Cal. Sounds fine. E mail me at [email protected]
Capt Steve

 

[il Padrino]

Me, personally, not knowing if he was legally carrying concealed, I would have just went along and minded my own business.

 

[Guest]

Originally posted by Capt Steve: ...While Arizona is an open carry state you have to have the gun completely visible...if legally carrying concealed, then completely (no printing), concealed it must be...

Neither of these statements really makes too much sense and certainly isn't "common" to other Open Carry/Concealed Carry States. You make it sound like you need to wear your gun on a string around your neck or have to have it boxed up inside your jacket!

Put the shoe on the other foot - what would you have wanted someone to do if your "Hawaiian shirt" had accidentally become snagged on something and your gun had become "accidentally" exposed.

Since, according to you he was committing a crime by walking around like that so why didn't you simply call 911 and report a "Man with a Gun"???

 

[Guest]

Originally posted by cmort666: ...In other places even accidental display is a crime...

In just which of the Open Carry/Concealed Carry States is this part of the Law???

In a pure Concealed Carry State it might be but certainly not in an Open Carry State!!!

 

[Xfuzz]

Response...

Hey dude, Your slip is showing.

 

[Capt Steve]

KKG, Our instructor in the CCW class stressed that concealed carry, under Arizona law, is just that. The gun must not be visible (to include printing through your clothes) if you are carrying concealed. Conversely if you are exercising your right to "open Carry" the gun/holster must be clearly visible. Failure to comply with either could cause you a legal problem. Maybe our instructor got it wrong but I doubt it.

Having thought about it and thanks in no small part to all of the input here if I had to do it over again I would have found a friendly, non threatening way to discreetly point out he was showing. Even that however, could go south if was a BG or just a bozo.

 

[310Pilot]

KKG, Our instructor in the CCW class stressed that concealed carry, under Arizona law, is just that. The gun must not be visible (to include printing through your clothes) if you are carrying concealed. Conversely if you are exercising your right to "open Carry" the gun/holster must be clearly visible. Failure to comply with either could cause you a legal problem. Maybe our instructor got it wrong but I doubt it.

Well Capt. Steve, your instructor did get it wrong. Open carry has been legal in Arizona since it was a territory, and the courts have held that if any part of the gun or the holster is visible, the gun is not considered concealed, and is legal under state law as not being concealed. We only got concealed privileges in Arizona in the 1990s, IIRC, and the concealed weapons permit allows you to carry it concealed, but it is not illegal if it becomes visible, as that qualifies as open carry, and a concealed permit does not exclude one from carrying openly. Been that way for years and years. Most of the time, I carry concealed for tactical reasons, but I still open carry in the field.