mrcooper
Member
I became a cripple 4 years ago, I'm 71. I knew I would being going for medical at some of our larger city's, I bought a Charter Arms Bull Dog 44 special, I have never had to use it but I have it. and am very satisfied with it.
what would you recommend for a snubbie
- Thread starter Crazy K38
- Start date
For a BUG, you need a compromise between weight and power. For my tastes, I like the 442. This one has NO internal lock. It sports a Tyler T-Grip and a Barami Hip-Grip setup so I can carry it in my right front Levi's pocket without a pocket holster. It's light enough that I often forget it's there. It's also ideal for an ankle holster. This one has had an action job by Nelson Ford ("The Gunsmith") in Phoenix and is really smooth.
If the airweight clan of J-frames are too tough to handle because of the recoil with full power loads, either a 649 or a 640 would be better. They weigh a bit more and tend to drag your pants down or get uncomfortable in an ankle holster. BUT they are easier to shoot with stout loads. Here are mine:
At any rate, look for NO INTERNAL LOCK examples. The odds against a tie-up due to the lock are pretty substantial, but for my money, why take even a small chance with a self-defense gun?
If the airweight clan of J-frames are too tough to handle because of the recoil with full power loads, either a 649 or a 640 would be better. They weigh a bit more and tend to drag your pants down or get uncomfortable in an ankle holster. BUT they are easier to shoot with stout loads. Here are mine:
At any rate, look for NO INTERNAL LOCK examples. The odds against a tie-up due to the lock are pretty substantial, but for my money, why take even a small chance with a self-defense gun?
Last edited:
USAF385
US Veteran
Go buy the cheapest one you like. With or without the lock.
If you don't want the lock, this video makes it super easy to remove it. It took me 10 minutes to remove my father's lock last night.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVPYgohVCNM
Just save the lock... just in case you want to sell it in the future. My father's lock is now in an envelope and will most likely never again see the light of day.
If you don't want the lock, this video makes it super easy to remove it. It took me 10 minutes to remove my father's lock last night.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVPYgohVCNM
Just save the lock... just in case you want to sell it in the future. My father's lock is now in an envelope and will most likely never again see the light of day.
CAJUNLAWYER
Member
337, 13 oz LOADED
OP
Crazy K38
Member
you know I am thinking about a 442, they look like good guns for the price, anyone have any experiance with them?
ChadW
US Veteran
442... 642
poTAYto.. poTAHto....
My only thing about 442s is when they wear its more noticeable. Scratches can really show up.
The 442 is still a great gun.
poTAYto.. poTAHto....
My only thing about 442s is when they wear its more noticeable. Scratches can really show up.
The 442 is still a great gun.
OP
Crazy K38
Member
oh I am not worried about that, it will be a carry gun and carry guns endup looking like well fecal matter but as long as it will last for a good while I will be happy
Krazy k38:
The 442, like its brother the 642 is ideal for carry because of its size and weight. I carry mine, as stated, with a Hip-Grip in my right front pocket; it just disappears and the weight is not noticeable. It works well for ankle carry as well; heavier guns seem like an anchor when placed there.
The only downside is vicious recoil when +P loads are used. I carry Speer .38 special +P 135 gr. Gold Dot hollow points in mine. It's actually painful to shoot with these rounds, and I'm not especially recoil-shy. The same load shoots much more comfortably in my 640 or 649, both of which are heavier.
My wife also carries a 442 in her purse, where she appreciates the lighter weight. She also likes the black gun because it would be harder to spot by a casual glance into her purse. However, +P loads are way too brutal for her to manage effectively. Although some may disagree with my choice here, I load hers with standard pressure full wadcutters. Not much velocity, but the sharp-edged bullets will cut holes in an assailant rather than just push tissue aside. She can also get off fast repeat shots easily. Considering that the mere display of a gun more often than not decides the issue, I consider her well-protected.
If you subscribe to the belief that a more visible gun is a better deterrent at night, then the 642 might be a better choice, having a much lighter finish. The coating on this gun tends to wear off, exposing the aluminum alloy frame. To my mind, this doesn't matter much. Same with the 442's blackened finish wearing over time. These are working guns, not safe queens, so finish wear is of little consequence.
Both the 442 and the 642 have pretty stiff trigger pulls. I had my 442 worked over by a gunsmith who specializes in Smiths, and he got it down to a decent, smooth pull with full reliability.
Hope this helps.
John
The 442, like its brother the 642 is ideal for carry because of its size and weight. I carry mine, as stated, with a Hip-Grip in my right front pocket; it just disappears and the weight is not noticeable. It works well for ankle carry as well; heavier guns seem like an anchor when placed there.
The only downside is vicious recoil when +P loads are used. I carry Speer .38 special +P 135 gr. Gold Dot hollow points in mine. It's actually painful to shoot with these rounds, and I'm not especially recoil-shy. The same load shoots much more comfortably in my 640 or 649, both of which are heavier.
My wife also carries a 442 in her purse, where she appreciates the lighter weight. She also likes the black gun because it would be harder to spot by a casual glance into her purse. However, +P loads are way too brutal for her to manage effectively. Although some may disagree with my choice here, I load hers with standard pressure full wadcutters. Not much velocity, but the sharp-edged bullets will cut holes in an assailant rather than just push tissue aside. She can also get off fast repeat shots easily. Considering that the mere display of a gun more often than not decides the issue, I consider her well-protected.
If you subscribe to the belief that a more visible gun is a better deterrent at night, then the 642 might be a better choice, having a much lighter finish. The coating on this gun tends to wear off, exposing the aluminum alloy frame. To my mind, this doesn't matter much. Same with the 442's blackened finish wearing over time. These are working guns, not safe queens, so finish wear is of little consequence.
Both the 442 and the 642 have pretty stiff trigger pulls. I had my 442 worked over by a gunsmith who specializes in Smiths, and he got it down to a decent, smooth pull with full reliability.
Hope this helps.
John
USAF385
US Veteran
I agree with Paladin to a point.
While the +P rounds do pack more of a punch, I don't find it to be unpleasant. In fact I actually enjoy shooting with +P. I don't have large grips either.. I have the tiny Uncle Mikes rubber grips. The +Ps I use mostly are Speer 125 gr Gold Dot hollow points, Winchester 125 gr JHP, and Federal Classic 158 gr semi wadcutter hollow points.
If it ever comes down to you actually needing to use a 442 or 642 for self defense.. you won't even notice the kick. Practice with standard pressure .38s for accuracy, and also train with the round you intend to carry.
The lighter finish on the 642 being more visible to the bad guy is a good point I hadn't thought of.
While the +P rounds do pack more of a punch, I don't find it to be unpleasant. In fact I actually enjoy shooting with +P. I don't have large grips either.. I have the tiny Uncle Mikes rubber grips. The +Ps I use mostly are Speer 125 gr Gold Dot hollow points, Winchester 125 gr JHP, and Federal Classic 158 gr semi wadcutter hollow points.
If it ever comes down to you actually needing to use a 442 or 642 for self defense.. you won't even notice the kick. Practice with standard pressure .38s for accuracy, and also train with the round you intend to carry.
The lighter finish on the 642 being more visible to the bad guy is a good point I hadn't thought of.
animalmother
Member
S&w 637.
The 640-1 is all steel. On the upside, recoil is not unpleasant, so practicing with it is not a problem. (Good grips help, too.) On the downside is, yes, it is comparatively heavy. What they say about a good gunbelt is true, though. It is as important, if not more so, than the holster. I carry this with a good gunbeltfrom Mitch Rosen and in a Kramer pocket holster made for this model. With the good belt, I don't mind the weight. On the belt would be no problem at all, of course.
Would like to check out that 340PD though, Smitty. It sounds pretty nice.
After the better part of half a century packing weapons I have come to a couple of conclusions about CCW and BUGs. YMMV of course.
I use 16 oz as the break point between pocket guns and holster guns. Exceptions are heavy wnter clothing or BDUs or combat vest where a heavier gun can be easily carried. I really like my 442 and 37-2(the lockless hammerless one), they are for primary carry or for when I am carrying a compatible ammo larger weapon. For working, which I getting too old for, I carry a BHP with a 940 as BUG. The 940 can be quickly reloaded from the Browning mag if necessary. The 940 rides in a lined left rear pocket-a built in holster kind of, and I train with it for either hand use. I carry the BHP round chambered, on half cock, with the safety on. Let some gun grabber try to figure that one out.
Most .357 Magnums in small frames just plain kick too much for rapid acurate shot placement, in the medium (K) frames they are too large as a CCW or BUG (just MHO).
Ammo wise, I like the "FBI" or "Chicago" load with the 158 gr SWCHP either +p or not. A good alternative is the nyclad 158 gr SWC, which gives excellent penetration from short barrels. I may try some of the newer loads developed for the short barrels, after I shoot up my heavier ammo.
Erich has it spot on when he says: "Bullet placement is king, penetration is queen, anything else is just angels dancing on the head of a pin".
With proper placement, some really tiny guns can serve quite well, the key of course is being able to place the slug on point each and every time. A 22LR in the eyeball will discourage all but the best trained individual, and if quickly followed by the other eye, you will be the winner, I promise.
I use 16 oz as the break point between pocket guns and holster guns. Exceptions are heavy wnter clothing or BDUs or combat vest where a heavier gun can be easily carried. I really like my 442 and 37-2(the lockless hammerless one), they are for primary carry or for when I am carrying a compatible ammo larger weapon. For working, which I getting too old for, I carry a BHP with a 940 as BUG. The 940 can be quickly reloaded from the Browning mag if necessary. The 940 rides in a lined left rear pocket-a built in holster kind of, and I train with it for either hand use. I carry the BHP round chambered, on half cock, with the safety on. Let some gun grabber try to figure that one out.
Most .357 Magnums in small frames just plain kick too much for rapid acurate shot placement, in the medium (K) frames they are too large as a CCW or BUG (just MHO).
Ammo wise, I like the "FBI" or "Chicago" load with the 158 gr SWCHP either +p or not. A good alternative is the nyclad 158 gr SWC, which gives excellent penetration from short barrels. I may try some of the newer loads developed for the short barrels, after I shoot up my heavier ammo.
Erich has it spot on when he says: "Bullet placement is king, penetration is queen, anything else is just angels dancing on the head of a pin".
With proper placement, some really tiny guns can serve quite well, the key of course is being able to place the slug on point each and every time. A 22LR in the eyeball will discourage all but the best trained individual, and if quickly followed by the other eye, you will be the winner, I promise.
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