Why do people care so much about trigger reset?

[Johnny Dollar]

This is why we hear of terrible shootings from cops all the time; poor trigger control. They are doing exactly what most are suggesting here, just pulling the trigger because they are panicking. It's the "spray and pray" mentality.

Let's be clear, no one is suggesting "poor trigger control". Nor does anyone advocate a spray and pray "mentality".

What I am suggesting is if you have never been in a gunfight and you think you are going to perform like you do at the range, if you think you are going to do things like taking a breath and holding it, squeezing he trigger evenly until you get a surprise break, releasing the trigger just to the reset point and repeating the process over again, you may be in for a big surprise if you are ever in a gunfight.

I know many guys believe they have trained themselves to a level that if they get in a gunfight they will shoot 3 times and get 2 center mass hits and 1 headshot in under 3 seconds.

I don't now how accurate the LEO shooting statistics quoted here are. But in any case do you think you would do better in the same situation? Really?

 

[Biscut]

Do you remember doing this while someone was shooting at you and you were shooting back? I read where LEOs fire 137 rounds at a guy, hit him three times, and he survived. Most LEOs can't tell you how many rounds they fired, let alone when the trigger reset in a shots fired incident.

It is ingrained in me as is breaking tunnel vision. I can attest to the breaking tunnel vision. We have trained that way for 12 years now. I can sure understand why you would cast out the remarks you have. But lets face it there are 100's of thousands LEO's out there. Maybe you would get lucky and get that one that hits at such a low percentage -- chances are you wouldn't be so lucky.

You also haven't mentioned anything about the circumstances. Not long ago NYPD was dealing with way heavy trigger pulls that were nonsense. Like above 10lb. You want to send more info out there I'm game. Lets dissect the particular incident you mention. Won't take long to break it down and find the weak point for the failure.

I do not wish to disparage anyone, but if you do not realize that trigger reset can be a valuable asset then you are missing a whole lot of positive SD tactics. It's a tool that there for you and why would you disregard it?? I can see a casual shooter have this attitude, but not anyone serious about SD or competition.

There has been a lot of research since WWII on killing and how "normal" people react to shooting another even during war time. The military has worked through this and the positive trainign benefits trickle down to LE.

Good training with enough repetition can overcome a tremendous amount of disadvantage. Everybody reacts different to a life or death situation and there is only one way to find out. I've been tested a lot and I'm a very slow and methodical person in these situations. Funny because I'm a total type "A" but is what it is.

 

[Rastoff]

I don't now how accurate the LEO shooting statistics quoted here are. But in any case do you think you would do better in the same situation? Really?

Yes, and you would too.

Also, I agree that the average person is only 50% as good under stress. The answer is to practice quality marksmanship wich includes trigger control. Practice correctly and you'll do it naturally. Practice incorrectly, I.e. slapping the trigger, and you'll miss under stress.

So, by practicing quality trigger control, including using the reset, and you'll do it automatically under stress. You won't necessarily feel the reset, but you'll have quality trigger control.

Biscut posted while I was typing this. Well said.

 

[Smitty357]

If i could fit my whole hand through the trigger guard. I would attempt to "slap" the trigger, but unfortunately thats not the case.

I think some people are over exaggerating the term.

By the way i never got an answer to my question so i'll try it one more time.

Is there a certain GR bullet I should use when practicing trigger reset. I want to make sure i get this correct. I wouldnt want the intruder laughing at anyone because they did it all wrong.

 

[Biscut]

This is something that just hit me...years ago a class I was in reviewed all of the very lengthy LAPD bank robber nightmare. I'm sure it's all released by now and on Google. Check it out. It's long! But pay close attention to the lack of "chaos" shown by the LAPD basic patrol cops with min training firing back and dealing with what was insurmountable odds as they were not given the tools to hit back hard.

Most impt, tone and inflection on the rover. Initially it was rougher but during the firefight transmissions over the radio were clear enough to decipher and rather calm considering. That is total reflection of training.

One thing we do for our LE training is a 50 yard dash to the 15 yard line and then draw, fire controlled double taps for a total of 12 rounds (with a magazine exchange). All timed and there is a winner. Winner gets to rest....remaining loosers from the group run 1/2 mile and report back.

Try it...hard to shoot when your blood is pumping and you are are in a non static state. Great training tool.

 

[Smitty357]

I dunno about you guys. But me and my ole lady do our share of firing at paper targets. However atleast once a week we try to drive a few towns over and do some training with simunition. This allows us to use our own weapons to fire non lethal rounds that are basically just paint. At the same time, this allows us to get use to targets that are shooting back at us. We do a bunch of exercises where running and hiding behind cover is essential to our survival. And yes, when u get hit with these non lethal rounds, they do hurt. Eventually u learn that u dont want to be shot with one, lol.

Also, in reality if u were to get into a firefight. You are likely defending urself against some thug who probably doesnt even know what brand weapon he is using. The typical legal gun owner likely shoots 1000's of rounds more per year than this thug. So even in a case like this, the thug is under experienced to start with. The typical every day legal gun owner has the upper hand. Simply because he/she is use to using his/her weapon. Even if those paper targets never shot back at him/her. The experience far outweighs that of the street thug.

 

[Rastoff]

Well Smitty357 I don't know what a "GR bullet" is, but I can tell you it doesn't matter. You can practice trigger control through dry practice. Of course live fire is also valuable.

I also agree that the average thug has almost no idea on how to shoot. That doesn't mean he won't be able to shoot you. This is why we need to practice. We don't all have the ability to use simunitions, but we can at least add some time pressure to the mix.

Further, I would add that most gun owners have a false sense of security. I'll bet that most on this site are better than average, but I see a lot of people fooling themselves at the range. They've put 100 rounds through their gun since they bought it 4 years ago. Then they shot 20 rounds, slow fire, at a CCW course so they think they're safe. One went to show me the gun he keeps in his car for self defense and couldn't get it out of the pouch it was in. Yeah, he's ready.

Look, I've said it before and I'll say it again, shoot how you want, but you can shoot better.

 

[LimaCharlie]

I keep hearing about training, simulation, and qualifying. I have yet to hear someone who went through actual unexpected close quarter combat say they remember the breathing, the trigger squeeze, the trigger break, and the trigger reset.

 

[Smitty357]

If there is anything i remember. Its 2 things......

Its harder to shoot moving targets that also shoot back.

And of course getting hit is not the best idea.

We all can shoot better, i agree. However we are all also different from one another. Just because one thing works for one person, doesnt mean that it also works as well for the other person. I know some guys who can take ur average cheap scope and shoot better good with both eyes open. I know some guys who take the same weapon/scope and shoot good with one eye open. So can they both technically shoot better than themselves? Yes.