Why do people keep buying Sport IIs and then modifying them?

[cyphertext]

All that said.. For the life of me, I can not understand why it is, that I find my self on a Smith and Wesson forum, with a section dedicated to the Smith and Wesson sport 2 and having to steady defend it against people who apparent see it as a ***, or other wise a "Truck gun" blah blah blah..
Man, cant the actual OWNERS of a Smith and Wesson M&P Sport II, Just ask questions and do whatever we want with OUR guns without getting lectured on how we could have done better to begin with?..

Obviously the question has been answered over and over.. Yet still, here we are..

Well, first of all, this is not a section dedicated to the Sport 2. It is for M&P 15 rifles... they do make more than just the Sport, but it is hard to tell that from this board.

And that is kinda the point of the question... why buy a Sport 2 in a configuration that you don't want, when there are configurations available that match what you do want? Forget about other brands... look at S&W's product offerings. They have several free floats to choose from, at different price points.

I've seen folks on this board who have never fired a shot through their rifle, and they want to know how to make it look like some pic they found on the net.

And for the record, I own a Sport. The first model... no dust cover, no forward assist. When that was the entry model, so many people would buy them and then ask about adding those features.. again, buying a rifle that they really didn't want based on price alone.

 

[WVSig]

Well, first of all, this is not a section dedicated to the Sport 2. It is for M&P 15 rifles... they do make more than just the Sport, but it is hard to tell that from this board.

And that is kinda the point of the question... why buy a Sport 2 in a configuration that you don't want, when there are configurations available that match what you do want? Forget about other brands... look at S&W's product offerings. They have several free floats to choose from, at different price points.

I've seen folks on this board who have never fired a shot through their rifle, and they want to know how to make it look like some pic they found on the net.

And for the record, I own a Sport. The first model... no dust cover, no forward assist. When that was the entry model, so many people would buy them and then ask about adding those features.. again, buying a rifle that they really didn't want based on price.

Exactly! If the Sport II is setup the way you want it then it is a great deal. For many shooters it is a great spec for their intended use and there is no need to buy more rifle or a different rifle. The Sport II is a perfect fit.

If you go back and read the OP it states:

I will go ahead and put on the flame suit now because I know what is coming but I have to ask. So many of the threads in this section of the forum are about how to modify a Sport II to replace the hand guard with a rail system, remove the A2 front post, swap the gas block, change out the stock, the grip etc...

Most of the time is seems to revolve around the A2 post and the handguards but if you have posted here long enough you know what I mean. So if all these people are going to rip the handguards off their basically NIB Sport II and remove the front A2 post, gas block and the handguards I have to ask.

Why are people buying the Sport II? Why not buy a optic ready carbine with a low profile gas block no handguards and simply install what they want. Once they have hacked it up the warranty is not going to be 100% in play. It doesn't save any money to pay for parts you are not going to use. Buying an OEM optic ready gun and installing the parts you want from day one makes economic and just plain common sense.

So educate me why are people still buying Sport IIs?

PS this is not directed at anyone specific. I own a Colt 6920 LEO which was the standard when I bought it and I modified it to suit my needs but when I did that there were a lot less options NIB.

The top answers seems to be price point and lack of knowledge and understanding of the platform and what they want the rifle to do and what they want the rifle to look like. Oddly enough most of the time its not about function because what trigger should I install so my Sport II shoots better is asked in about a 1/5 ratio vs how do I install a free floating rail and remove the A2 front sight post and gas block. The number one thing you can do to most factory mil-specish rifles like the Sport II that will actually improve its shootablity is the trigger. IMHO.

I am asking specifically why do people buy a budget gun in a configuration they don't want? It is not directed at people who know what the Sport II is and got it because it meets their needs. I am asking why do people buy this rifle and too often immediately start to swap parts sometimes even before hitting the range or after only a few hundred rounds down the pipe. It seems like 99% of the time its not about the function of the rifle its about how the rifle looks. They saw a gun in a magazine, on the web or on a forum and they want to make theirs look like that one.

The question isn't geared toward guys like Brian in Oregon who knew what he bought and he bought it because it meets his needs better than other guns. It is asking why is the novice buyer continuing to buy something they actually don't want.

In the end it seems like people are so personally attached to their gun of choice that any negative comment or discussion of the gun is treated like a personal affront. It is as if their ego is intertwined with this piece of steel, alum and plastic. I never understand why people take it so personally. This is not emotional question. It is not "personal" question in that one's answer does not define one's worth as a human being. It is a question which originally was intended to prompt another question which I will pose in another thread.

 

[LAA]

I am asking specifically why do people buy a budget gun in a configuration they don't want? It is not directed at people who know what the Sport II is and got it because it meets their needs. I am asking why do people buy this rifle and too often immediately start to swap parts sometimes even before hitting the range or after only a few hundred rounds down the pipe. It seems like 99% of the time its not about the function of the rifle its about how the rifle looks. They saw a gun in a magazine, on the web or on a forum and they want to make theirs look like that one.

It's far too easy to figure out why. They buy the rifle without much, or no experience with AR15s. Once purchased, they start looking at internet forums, all the pics, etc. It only takes a week or two. Then they want to upgrade. I did the same thing myself. I think this is a very simple explanation.

 

[WVSig]

It's far too easy to figure out why. They buy the rifle without much, or no experience with AR15s. Once purchased, they start looking at internet forums, all the pics, etc. It only takes a week or two. Then they want to upgrade. I did the same thing myself. I think this is a very simple explanation.

Which begs the question is that the best most cost effective and efficient route to take when buying a S&W M&P AR15?

 

[Pro2nd]

Well there ya go, you see things one way, others see things a different way..

case closed.. Unless of course.. you can not stand the fact that others do not feel the same as you, that is..

I mean, this IS the Smith and Wesson Sport II section..
Which I do not believe is tittled the "Smith and Wesson sport II, you should not have purchased" section..

One would think they could discuss their Smith and Wesson sport II here in this section dedicated to it, without steady getting an ear full about it being a "bad purchase", "You could have done better", "You must be a newbie shooter" blah blah blah..

If someone wants to make radical changes to their Sport II, how about simply trying to post information on how to, or why NOT to etc Vs steady complain and tell them they don't know what they're doing, they should have purchased something else, boo hoo hoo..etc..
my god man..

 

[Disabled1]

Because some of us remember when S&W was crazy enough to install a Thompson Center, 1:8 5R progressive gain twist, Melonite barrel in the entry level gateway Sport V1.0. The rifle was also equipped with a very nice chopped A2 rear sight, not those plastic flip up abominations that are everywhere now.

Thank you JaPes, well said! I own one of these fine pieces of machinery! This S&W is frowned down upon by the "new age" owners of AR's. Just because there is no dust cover or forward assist, they think their "over rated" Sport II is so much better.
"Ew, my Sport II has a dust cover and forward assist......Ew, Ew....."

 

[cyphertext]

Well there ya go, you see things one way, others see things a different way..

case closed.. Unless of course.. you can not stand the fact that others do not feel the same as you, that is..

I mean, this IS the Smith and Wesson Sport II section..
Which I do not believe is tittled the "Smith and Wesson sport II, you should not have purchased" section..

One would think they could discuss their Smith and Wesson sport II here in this section dedicated to it, without steady getting an ear full about it being a "bad purchase", "You could have done better", "You must be a newbie shooter" blah blah blah..

If someone wants to make radical changes to their Sport II, how about simply trying to post information on how to, or why NOT to etc Vs steady complain and tell them they don't know what they're doing, they should have purchased something else, boo hoo hoo..etc..
my god man..

If you would take a deep breath, read what WVSig is saying, and not look at it as a bash against your rifle, you would see that he is actually trying to tell you why complete configuration changes may not be the best way to go to arrive at the rifle of your dreams... That there is something closer

He, and I, are not talking about simple hand guard swaps for the most part... although if you aren't married to S&W, the OEM rifles offer some nice features or upgrades.

But if you know going in that you want a free floated barrel, with a BCM 13" Keymod rail, a gun fighter medium charging handle, and a full auto type BCG... is the Sport really the best way to get there?

Fully configured, complete rifles are typically best purchased in a configuration that is closest to what you want.

This is the thought that WVSig is trying to convey.

ETA: I have not seen him bash the Sport II. He even says he would get one for a truck gun, that he is going to leave stock.

 

[Pro2nd]

If you would take a deep breath, read what WVSig is saying,

Sorry, it is CLEARLY the other way around, the dude done went nuts and is now putting up polls etc..
I haven't a clue why he is so butt hurt over the Sport II, but he needs to learn that people are going to continue to buy the Sport II, and people are going to continue to want to change various parts etc.
If it bothers him THAT bad, he should just avoid this section, especially since he does not even own the riffle in which this section is dedicated two..

This section is not called the "the M&P Sport II STOCK configuration only"..

P.s.. I am, and will always be two steps ahead.. He, will realize this eventually..

I started out here posting some very basic questions etc, breaking the ice here as a new forum member etc, and I really do not much care a thinks he knows it all, taking every opportunity to slip in a smart *** comment, or dig..

Lets take a look at my post about how poorly some items are described, and my comments on reviews.. His reply to that was loaded.. to ME, that was obvious as can be.. Instead of suggesting sites that perhaps have better descriptions etc, he choose to ask me what sites I am searching, reason is, he was HOPING, I would reply with some rinky dink amazon or whatever, but it didn't happen.. So I had to come out and ask if HE knew of any sites with good descriptions, he then listed sites I already am, and have been familiar with, but it was the point.. Twp steps ahead, always..

Just saying if someone wants to basically TROLL the M&P section and pick me as a target (I can easily read between the lines on his comments, poll etc), well, put your set belts on boys!

 

[cyphertext]

Sorry, it is CLEARLY the other way around, the dude done went nuts and is now putting up polls etc..

Sorry, you are the one coming off looking like you "done went nuts"... I'll show you why.

I haven't a clue why he is so butt hurt over the Sport II, but he needs to learn that people are going to continue to buy the Sport II, and people are going to continue to want to change various parts etc.
If it bothers him THAT bad, he should just avoid this section, especially since he does not even own the riffle in which this section is dedicated two..

This section is not called the "the M&P Sport II STOCK configuration only"..

He isn't butt hurt. He is just simply asking why folks continue to purchase a rifle that is not the configuration that they want, when something equal to or better is available at the same cost.

P.s.. I am, and will always be two steps ahead.. He, will realize this eventually..

I don't think so... let's keep reading....

I started out here posting some very basic questions etc, breaking the ice here as a new forum member etc, and I really do not much care a thinks he knows it all, taking every opportunity to slip in a smart *** comment, or dig..

Usually, I am told that I am the smart donkey of the group...

Lets take a look at my post about how poorly some items are described, and my comments on reviews.. His reply to that was loaded.. to ME, that was obvious as can be.. Instead of suggesting sites that perhaps have better descriptions etc, he choose to ask me what sites I am searching, reason is, he was HOPING, I would reply with some rinky dink amazon or whatever, but it didn't happen.. So I had to come out and ask if HE knew of any sites with good descriptions, he then listed sites I already am, and have been familiar with, but it was the point.. Twp steps ahead, always..

Just saying if someone wants to basically TROLL the M&P section and pick me as a target (I can easily read between the lines on his comments, poll etc), well, put your set belts on boys!

Let's take a look at that post. WVSig didn't reply to you. Japes, another respected member of the forum, replied asking what sites you were looking at, and then replied with the familiar ones. I also wondered what you were looking at... never had the issue that you did. But glad you were two steps ahead!

 

[Pro2nd]

Sorry, you are the one coming off looking like you "done went nuts"... I'll show you why.




He isn't butt hurt. He is just simply asking why folks continue to purchase a rifle that is not the configuration that they want, when something equal to or better is available at the same cost.


I don't think so... let's keep reading....




Usually, I am told that I am the smart donkey of the group...




Let's take a look at that post. WVSig didn't reply to you. Japes, another respected member of the forum, replied asking what sites you were looking at, and then replied with the familiar ones. I also wondered what you were looking at... never had the issue that you did. But glad you were two steps ahead!

I am a bit short on time right now, but when I get back later, I will educate you on reality..
sorry to are unable to spot a TROLL when you see one, and WVsig is most CERTAINLY a TROLL in the M&P Sport II section..
P.S.. Japes is pretty much the same thing in THIS section..

 

[cyphertext]

I am a bit short on time right now, but when I get back later, I will educate you on reality..
sorry to are unable to spot a TROLL when you see one, and WVsig is most CERTAINLY a TROLL in the M&P Sport II section..
P.S.. Japes is pretty much the same thing in THIS section..

Again, where is this M&P Sport II section? There is no such thing on this board. This is the M&P 15 rifles section... S&W makes other AR-15s!

And I think you should probably search Japes and read his posts... You will see that he started with a Sport I and no knowledge of the platform. Upgraded his Sport this way and that way, until he realized he had $1200 in a Sport. He has gone down the path that WVSig is trying to keep others from going down... not a troll in any way.

 

[Brian in Oregon]

Don't think it's a dead horse at all. Any rifle is only a good deal or a bad deal if it meets your specs. The whole point of the thread is that it seems like lots of people buy rifles like the Sport II when the gun doesn't seem to fit their needs requiring modification of the gun.

Sometimes that modification is very basic other times it seems more involved and that maybe another rifle would have been a better starting point. If you are done with the topic I respectfully suggest you stop posting in the thread.

Exactly my point. You keep throwing out alternatives to the Sport II that do not meet specs some people are looking for. If a furniture change is all the Sport II needs, vs a gun that has that furniture but is going to require a barrel change to get the twist and/or the barrel profile you want, which is the better buy? What you're not seeing is that your point ALSO applies to the guns you are comparing the Sport II to. For example, one of the guns you used for comparison had a forend that personally I would change out. So it was not a bargain for me.

You do have a valid point but are trying to make it a black and white issue when there are a lot of shades of gray in the decision making process.

The point of sinking so much money into a Sport II that it winds up being $1200 is valid. But that does not mean sinking another $150 into it makes it invalid.

One thing not mentioned in this thread is that the Sport II is a real bargain compared to trying to piece together a budget AR15 from various parts. I looked at building an AR15 that met my specs for barrel profile and twist, etc., and the Sport II could provide all that in a package that was either less expensive or nearly matched the cost of DIY. Plus having a factory lifetime warranty. If I had held out for some PSA 1:7" twists I could have built cheaper, but I did not want a 1:7" twist. I suspect that S&W took a look at the DIY AR15s and decided to target that market.

 

[s&wchad]

Any surprise this thread got heated?
Note how it was prefaced:

I will go ahead and put on the flame suit now because I know what is coming...

We're done here. I don't have time to wade through 150+ posts and ding the appropriate parties right now, but a number of replies to this thread that I've seen simply don't meet our standards.

READ THIS (from our rules):

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