Why is the 38 Smith & Wesson Single Action, 3rd Model (Model of 1891) So Scarce?

glowe

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Why is the 38 Smith & Wesson Single Action, 3rd Model (Model of 1891) So Scarce?​

Before I start, I would like to thank all of our Forum experts and S&W authors who have added information and comments to this commentary. I have been perplexed by the lack of 38 Single Action, Third Model, or Model of 1891 revolvers on the market and have been researching this phenomenon. As most know, these revolvers rarely come up for sale, but the question is why? There were more 38 Single Action Third Models made than the Model 3 American and the Americans are regularly seen for sale. Another comparison is that I find more No. 3, 2nd Model Commercial Russians for sale and only 6200 were supposedly made. According to the Standard Catalog of Smith & Wesson, 3rd ed. By Supica and Nahas, there were 26,850 of these revolvers manufactured, so why do we rarely see them for sale?


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38 Smith & Wesson Single Action, Third Model Target Revolver

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38 Smith & Wesson First Model Single Shot


The 38 Single Action, Third Model revolver was manufactured from 1891 to 1911. This gun came in 3¼”, 4”, 5”, and 6” barrel lengths and was available in nickel or blue. It is stated in various sources that almost all had “Model of 91” stamped in the middle of the barrel top rib address line, but some double action barrels were supposedly used as well on factory guns. I have not been able to locate any documented examples with matching serial numbers on frame and barrel that lack the “Model of 91” stamping. Those I have encountered had mixed serial numbers.


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38 SA Barrel Stamping


The standard stocks were black hard rubber, round butt, but monogrammed pearl stocks and hard rubber or walnut target stocks were available at a premium. After-market pearl stocks were also very popular around the turn of the twentieth century.


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Standard

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Factory Pearls

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HR Target

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Walnut Target

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Aftermarket Pearl​


An additional option for this model was target front and rear sights. Factory target versions of the 38 S&W SA, Third Model should be considered rare, certainly only a small percentage of these guns were furnished with target sights. In the 1900 S&W Catalog, the rear target sight was available for an additional $2.00, the Lyman front sight added another $1.75, while replacement black hard rubber stocks were $0.25 each.


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1900 S&W Catalog​

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Rear target sight​

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Lyman Front Target Sight Available from the Factory​

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Flat Blade Front Sight​

As for value, a quick look at historical references is of interest. Martin Rywell’s 1953 book states that the 1891 revolver was worth $25.00, while the 1891 Single Shot was valued at $35.00. Rywell revisited S&W values in his 1962 work and the values remained the same. Rock Island’s April 2013 auction had 2 non-target Model of 91 SA revolvers available, in perhaps Very Good condition with major bluing loss at the cylinders. They sold for $2500 each, which is far above SCSW’s 2006 valuation of $650.

What I have been able to determine is that there were a total of 28,107 Model of ’91s manufactured in a few configurations. According to Neal/Jinks 1966 book Smith & Wesson 1857-1945, there were 3198 First Model single shot barrels made, but only 1251 were originally sold as single shots. There were also 92 combination sets shipped from the factory. This would dictate that all the remaining barrels were used post-factory. Neal/Jinks also states that the Mexican Model totaled 2000 or so. This leaves over 24,764 revolvers made.


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38 Smith & Wesson Single Action, Third Model, Mexican Model​

McHenry & Roper’s 1958 Smith & Wesson Handguns, is contrary to Neal & Jinks and suggested that most of the 3196 Single Shot barrels were used in factory combination sets or First Model single shot configurations. This is an interesting statement since, in the current market, Single Shot sales seem to outnumber 1891 SAs by a large margin. Single Shots are prevalent on almost all major gun auction sites, but there were supposedly twenty times more 1891 SAs made than Single Shots. Lastly, the SWCA Database has only 17 - 1891 SAs (<1% of all made), while having 27 – 1st Model Single Shots (2% of all made). McHenry & Roper also state that 7000 Mexican Models were manufactured.

When compared to the 38 Single Action 1st Model (Baby Russian), as stated by Jim Supica, there are 10 Baby Russians for sale for every Model of 91 38 SA, yet they were made in nearly equal numbers!

I was reading Martin Rywell’s 1953 edition of Smith & Wesson – The Story of the Revolver. He claims that 7,000 Model of 1891 revolvers were made for the Russian trade. He also mentions the Mexican Model, but no production numbers were stated.

Even if we add these 7,000 Russian trade revolvers into the equation and 3000 First Model Single Shots, the total of revolvers made is reduced to just over 13,700. Still seems like enough that you would see them in trade from time to time.

Our last option is to look at attrition rates. Using attrition rates for durable goods does not work for firearms, since applying that regression virtually eliminates all 38 SAs by 1960. Just for statistical purposes, if we assume that some revolvers are just lost every year for any number of reasons. Let’s assume this would have mostly occurred from 1891 to 1970. Secondly, there are a number of these revolvers worn out or broken and discarded per year. This would have most likely happened from 1920 to 1960. Lastly, it is known that some 1891s ended up being parted out in more recent years to restore others. This would have mostly happened after the revolver became somewhat collectable, let’s say 1950 to 2013. The reader can use any percentage, but I would think it would be possible to lose ½% per year based on a combination of all the above possibilities. We can reasonably estimate 6000 revolvers might no longer exist. Applying these scenarios and the preceding data, the number of remaining revolvers would be 7700. Now we are getting somewhere, but there will never be any way to verify these numbers.

Questions that remain unanswered:
1. Did S&W actually export 7000 Model 1891 revolvers to Russia?
2. Were there only 2000 Mexican Models made?
3. Were most of the 3196 single shot barrels used in original Single Shots and Combo Sets?
4. Have collectors cornered the market on these revolvers and are they holding onto them?

Roy Jinks has commented that the Model 1891 was a very popular export revolver. He stated the exports went mostly to Europe and South America. This could be the most credible explanation for the rarity of the 38 Single Action, Third Model. If 20% went to foreign countries, it is possible that over 5000 revolvers are not available in the US market. Using all possible reasons as outlined above, the minimum number of 1891s in the US today could be 2700.

Realistically, what we do have is enough evidence to estimate that there may be in the neighborhood of 5000 to 7500 Model 1891s in the US today. There is no way, however, to justify the discrepancy between the apparent numbers of Single Shots, as compared to revolvers, for sale.

This is an interesting model that does not get the attention it deserves. As SCSW-3rd states: “these are very attractive guns and. . . are highly sought after”.

Where they all went may be lost to history.
 
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Gary, very interesting, and thought provoking. I have often thought the same, where are they as I would like one for my collection. I don't believe I have ever had the opportunity to actually buy one, other that a rare one or two in auctions, which were way above my purchase limit. I'll be interested in watching this to see what possible answer's will materialize.
 
Gary,
A very interesting study you have done and thanks for posting it.
I have 3, none of which are in the SWCA Database. I thought they were in the old database that was transferred, but I can't find any of my serial numbers in the transferred database.
Anyway, in the attached photos are:

Top Left: Serial No. 11311, Nickel, 3.25" barrel, all numbers match including right grip, and factory letter stating it was shipped on April 13, 1892 and delivered to Hartley & Graham Co., New York City, NY.

Top Right: Serial No. 13825, Blue, 4" barrel, All numbers match except grips (when purchased, it had a pair of target stocks on it and the pair of black hard rubber grips shown in photo, neither of which have a number stamped on them. Factory letter states it was shipped on April 22, 1899 and delivered to W.E. Sheard, address is unreadable. It was shipped with black hard rubber grips.

Bottom Center: Serial No. 18691, Blue, 4" barrel, lanyard ring, Mexican Model. All numbers match including the right grip & left side of the frame under the left grip. Factory letter states, it was shipped from our factory on October 17, 1899, and was delivered to Max Fiedler (Russian agent in St. Petersburg, Russia). Your revolver is one of the original Mexican Models. It was part of a shipment of 28 units sent to Russia. Russia was one of the major markets for this model. When these guns were shipped they were equipped by the factory with lanyard rings. Since the lanyard ring was installed through the butt serial number, the factory restamped the number on the left side of the frame under the left grip.
I posted this Mexican Model here on 4/22/13, here is the link, (http://smith-wessonforum.com/s-w-antiques/312706-38-s-model-91-mexican-model.html). Several photos and factory letter can be seen here.

I hope this can help you in your research and will be looking forward to seeing more data as you get it.
Thanks for posting your research,
Dave
SWCA LM #836
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Gary, Another "option" for these Model of 91s were two factory kits, one to change the bow trigger guard and trigger to the spur trigger style of the Mexican model, and the other to change a Mexican model to the bow trigger style. I have both kits and two Model 91s, one in nickel, with a six inch barrel and after market pearls, ser. # 10670 on frame & cal., and 20090 on barrel & latch, plus another one, ser # 7049 all matching, a special order gun, cased, gold plated, 4 in. barrel, medallion pearls with a ruby over the right side grip screw escutcheon , shipped Sept. 30, 1893, to an individual. This gun was possibly made for the Columbian Exposition and then sold to an individual afterwards, a common practice for S&W. Ed.
 
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Single Shots

While in Denver last week for the Colorado Gun Collectors Show and local gun shops, I saw at least 12 Single Shots, all 3 models and even a Straight Line in the box with all accessories. Guess you need to come West.
Really good information in this thread.
Thanks!
 
While in Denver last week for the Colorado Gun Collectors Show and local gun shops, I saw at least 12 Single Shots, all 3 models and even a Straight Line in the box with all accessories. Guess you need to come West.
Really good information in this thread.
Thanks!

Thanks TLflag - you just helped make my point. How many Model 1891 SA revolvers did you see? I see many more Single Shots than SAs.
 
Thanks to all for adding some revolvers to this thread that were not in the database. My assumption is, however, that there are probably many single shots that are not currently in the database as well, so the percentages probably would remain the same. Some nice examples added. Thanks
 
Okay Gary-----you now have a documented example of a single line barrel address with matching numbers (frame/cylinder/barrel). It is #22530, 6" Target (Lyman Ivory Slide), HR Target grips (with a funky little grip adapter which snaps in place, and fills about half the (vertical) space between the front strap and the trigger guard). It was shipped June 7, 1910 to Markt & Hammacker (New York City).

Interestingly enough, the rear sight/latch is not numbered----first unnumbered sight/latch I had the guts to buy. Letter notes as special order, and Jinks opines order was filled by taking standard gun from stock and slapping target sights on it.

Ralph Tremaine
 
Good post. I've also wondered this many times. In my collection, I've got five of the .38 3rd Model Single Actions and close to twice as many 1st Model Single Shots. Two of the Single Actions came from the Gary Garbrecht collection, so those are possibly already in your database. I will post serial numbers of all five when I get the chance. I also believe one of the other three is a numbers matching early revolver that does not have the 'Model of 91' marking on the barrel. I believe there were a number of the early models that did not have that marking, as they possibly used up the barrels of the 2nd Model .38 Single Actions.
 
Here is my 1891 revolver "wannabe"

Here is my "1891 revolver" at bottom in photo, posted with the other 2 38 SA models. I too have wondered why I ended up with literally 3 Baby Russians before finding one original 1891 revolver. This thread so far has been informative, helpful and very interesting. Thank you Glowe.

The pistol below has the SN of 10505 on butt (NOT on front strap). There is no SN marking on the barrel or the top latch. I was told that the gun could have shipped as a set, with 1891 revolver and single shot barrel(s) but then I was told another time that in the scenario of a cased set, extra barrels were numbered to the gun.

Anyone have any opinion either way? Can anyone tell me if their cased set has SN'd single shot barrels or not?

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Gary, very interesting, and thought provoking. I have often thought the same, where are they as I would like one for my collection. I don't believe I have ever had the opportunity to actually buy one, other that a rare one or two in auctions, which were way above my purchase limit. I'll be interested in watching this to see what possible answer's will materialize.

I will have two for sale at the annual in KC.
One is a combination set, Mexican Model. The other one is in the box.
As a matter of fact, I will have a 1st, 2nd and a 3rd all in boxes for sale there.
Don
 
The pistol below has the SN of 10505 on butt (NOT on front strap). There is no SN marking on the barrel or the top latch. I was told that the gun could have shipped as a set, with 1891 revolver and single shot barrel(s) but then I was told another time that in the scenario of a cased set, extra barrels were numbered to the gun.

Jim - I might be wrong here, but I thought that all 3rd Model frames had the serial number stamped on the butt and not the front strap. I do know that there were spare barrels sold unserialized from the factory and you can still find them for sale from time to time. Problem is that there are most likely no records as to how many of the over 3000 barrels were sold without frames?

It is also my understanding that all factory fitted single shot barrels were sent out numbered to the frame, no matter whether they were sent out as single shots or in combination sets. That would mean that yours may well be an after-factory barrel added to a 3rd model frame. I bought a 10" 38 S&W barrel recently that has no serial number either. There was an old post where the OP had found a barrel and cylinder to go with his single shot '91 so there may well be some other barrel/cylinder assemblies floating around out there, and maybe one from your '91 as well.
 
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I might be wrong here, but I thought that all 3rd Model frames had the serial number stamped on the butt and not the front strap.
Gary,

Here's a quote that Roy Jinks made some years ago now that I believe should clear up the Serial No. Placement Issue!!

Quote) "It has been my experience that factory made Single Shots always have the serial number on the front strap of the grip frame. Any revolvers returned to have Single Shot Barrels added were not re-serialized on the front strap but the replacement barrel & barrel catch were serial numbered with the guns. I have never examined a Single Shot with the serial number on the butt that left the factory as a Single Shot." (End Quote)

Unless something has changed to date, his statement also seems to be backed up with add'l studies taken on by other collectors in later years as to where the Serial No.'s were placed if in fact they originally left the Factory in a Single Shot configuration!! Hope this helps!!
 
Don, I recall reading that you had a sack full of '91s at a prior show that did not sell because people did not know what they were? So are you lowering your prices for this show???:D

Gary
Yes, its true. I need cash as I am soon to be a father. When my wife finds out, I'm dead! Just kidding, I am selling of my collection of .38 SA's. Except for the Club Guns.
See you in KC?
Don
 
Well as for the SN marking being on the butt, I was actually acknowledging that my gun *is* a revolver frame, because I mentioned that my gun has the SN on the butt, making it an 1891 revolver rather than a 1891 single shot. In addition, I believe the gun is well out of SN range of the 1891 single shot pistols. I put the "1891 revolver" in quotation marks in my earlier post, because its obviously no longer a revolver at this point, but the frame itself is from a 1891 revolver. I mentioned the SN location so no one would think I actually have a 1891 single shot, rather than the 1891 revolver.

It is also my understanding that all factory fitted single shot barrels were sent out numbered to the frame, no matter whether they were sent out as single shots or in combination sets.

That is what I expected to hear, and it only makes sense.
 
1891 .32 Single Shot

Nice job GLOWE!!! The 3rd Model SA Revolver is a hard one to find. I enjoy the hunt and when a Single Shot or Combo pops up during the process, I try to latch on to them.

Here is my last find. .32 Single Shot 1st model 1891 in the box that is numbered to the gun. Front strap numbered in the 17,000 range.

One more SS to take away from the frames of the 3rd Model SA.

I will do a search as to where to send my data for the SA 3rd models I have.

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