Why was the firing pin moved to the frame?

[7tenz]

Dunno if true, but I read several years ago in this forum that the MIM parts lack the strength and resiliancy for a hammer mounted firing pin.

 

[Berserker]

Any concern with it getting gunked up with oil? Been wondering if I should run some break clean through it, and leave it dry?

I realize old thread, but was hoping someone would say what they do.

 

[Protocall_Design]

Remove the firing pin and it's spring once in a while and clean the FP channel with a brake cleaner soaked Q tip. Let it dry out and reassemble, leaving everything dry and clean with no oil.

 

[Jim PHL]

I always tell my wife, when the question is about a business and begins with “why”, the answer is always money.

 

[Jim PHL]

I always tell my wife, when the question is about a business and begins with “why”, the answer is always money. Lots of good answers here and some that are not overtly about money can still be tied to it in some way.

 

[Nightowl]

I've never had a hammer nose break. I have seen guns that have had them break, but never mine. My brother in law had a 629-3 or 4 break with very little use. However, I have had a couple of frame mounted firing pins "grow" fat that failed to fire and had to be replaced and one that broke where the nose meets the barrel part. The FMFP's were in a 627-2 that had a lot of rounds through it.

 

[Model29-26.5]

What is the design advantage to having the firing pin on the frame instead of the hammer?

This is a hammer with a firing pin attached on a bushing.
Anything else is neither a hammer or a firing pin

 

[murphydog]

This is a hammer with a firing pin attached on a bushing.
Anything else is neither a hammer or a firing pin

Hammer nose, not firing pin, in S & W speak.

 

[Bullet Bob]

When the Colt Python with it's hammer mounted firing pin first came out, the print media of the time praised it for being safer in the event a cartridge case or primer blew.

1955 saw introduction of the Python, S&W .44 Magnum, S&W Combat Magnum, and the small block Chevy V8. A good year indeed.

 

[Model29-26.5]

Hammer nose, not firing pin, in S & W speak.

In that case, a firing pin only exists on a model 53. That has the only valid reason to exist on the frame!

 

[SWFan27]

I don't know if this is true or not but some of the personnal at my shooting range/gun store told me that it was strictly a safety deal. Also, some states like California might not approve Smith and Wesson revolvers if they did not move the firing pin to the frame like other revolver manufactures. I have three Smiths with the old firing pin on hammer and one with the new firing pin in the frame. The action is not as nice on the new revolver as with the old revolvers.

Summary, keep your older revolvers. If you want to buy a new revolver I would buy a Ruger. They have perfected there transfer bar/firing pin system and now their revolvers have a better action than the current Smith & Wesson revolvers.

Too Bad!!!

My new S&W revolvers work just fine, and I have never had a light strike with any of them. Plus, my S&W revolvers have better triggers than anything Ruger makes.

 

[murphydog]

In that case, a firing pin only exists on a model 53. That has the only valid reason to exist on the frame!

Aside from all rimfire revolvers, since the .22 Hand Ejector (Ladysmith).

 

[ISCS Yoda]

I don't have as many S&W revolvers as some of y'all but I have more than a few and none of them have ever failed to fire, hammer-mounted or frame-mounted firing pins, so I guess I just don't understand the controversy. Same as having the IL. No failures to fire.

 

[SGT ROCK 11B]

I realize old thread, but was hoping someone would say what they do.

15 1/2 year old thread.

 

[Berserker]

15 1/2 year old thread.

A

I realize old thread,.

Ahh, haaa..

 

[SLT223]

I thought that title looked familiar . I’ve officially been here long enough to have my own zombie thread! 15 years…that’s a good one

 

[TheTinMan]

I think the movement of the firing pin from the hammer to the frame was done to increase the cartridge circle to increase the round count of the Model 27 from 6 to 8. The chamber pattern radius was increased by something like .030”. That necessitated a new hammer design, or they could make lemonade from lemons and change the firing pin to a frame mounted pin and increase commonality between the different frame sizes.

I think Tom nailed it. I was so surprised when I realized that my early 1930s K-22 Outdoorsman had a frame mounted firing pin. However, it makes sense. The firing pin hits the rim well above the center of the cartridge so something had to change. Obviously there’s a change to the recoil shield and that small area of the frame. However, the change to the hammer geometry compared to the center fire Outdoorsman models is minimal.

 

[chief38]

Some manufacturers modify their products mainly to improve them. It seems to me that S&W modifies most of their products to cut their cost and maximize their profits. Not saying others don't do that as well, but S&W has been very pro active at cost cutting over the last few decades. The quality they now ship reflects that as well.

All of my revolvers have the firing pins on their hammers, but that feature is not a deal breaker for me. Colt, Ruger and others are the same way now.

 

[MajorD]

When the older style parts were hand fit, labor was cheap and materials were expensive.

The sad reality of modern manufacturing is that the reverse is now true. Labor is the largest cost of manufactured goods.

Bash the company or not, but finding hiring and retaining skilled workers is difficult. The skill involved in the old school fitting of guns required a level of craftsmanship that would be simply too costly today. Take look at the “shop rate” for labor from a gun smith or auto repair shop today.

Mim and cnc have replaced skilled labor not only because it is cheaper, but because it is available

 

[SlamFire]

Shortly after the change, I called S&W for some reason and asked the customer service representative for the reason behind the firing pin change.

It came down to labor costs. S&W had not figured out how to automate the drilling of the frame hole for the hammer mounted firing pin. It took a specialized machine and a dedicated machinist.

I prefer the hammer mounted firing pin, as more energy (all things being equal) is applied to the primer.

With a frame mounted firing pin, energy is lost in the impact between hammer, firing pin, and primer. A hammer mounted firing pin ignition system will ignite primers with marginal mainsprings. The frame mounted firing pin system is more sensitive to mainspring strength. Not that one style is an excuse not to maintain your revolver. I could tell a difference in lock time with my 1952 K38 when I installed a new mainspring in 2024. Hammer fall was faster and I am sure that means more powerful ignition.