Win231/HP38

[Alk8944]

If you want the real answer try contacting General Dynamics. They manufacture the following which are pertinent to this question:


H110 and W-296 which are both distributed by Hodgdon under the Hodgdon (H110) and Winchester brands. Hodgdon does the final packaging and distribution for both brand names.


HP-38 and Winchester W231 which are both distributed by Hodgdon under the Hodgdon HP-38) and Winchester W231 brands. Hodgdon does the final packaging and distribution for both brand names.
You can contact Hodgdon too, but will probably not receive a definitive answer there.


I will let you look up contact information yourself.


If it helps this question has been going around for over 30 years. I called General Dynamics, Engineering specifically about H110/W296 and was informed that both product shipped to Hodgdon and Winchester were identical and could often come from the same lot number! Why would anything change now that all production all production is distributed by Hodgdon??? You can be as paranoid as you like, but there is no reason to not mix in these specific cases.

 

[Skeet 028]

I personally would not mix a 1 pound with a larger can...just use the 1 pounder first. I once had an anomally with 231.. I opened a new sealed can(different lot) and started loading it without checking and the new can of powder was throwing charges that weighed more than a grain heavier 6.5 grains ...no changes to the press or powder measure. . Never could figure that one. I actually dumped the powder from the Dillon measure and tried a different jug of powder and it went back to the original amount of powder...5.4 grains. I still have most of that anomalous pound of powder. That was in my Dillon Super 1050 in 45 auto. I loaded about 175 rounds before I checked the powder charges. duh! Still have them in a box to be torn down

 

[Skeet 028]

BTW many years ago I got a large box...25 lbs... of HP 38 from a master powder distributor...really cheap....10 bucks. When I opened the box the powder was in a plastic bag....with a tag denoting the powder to be Winchester 231. Don't know why he had the powder but he was one of the last full line powder distributors on the east coast. Also I was told by a fellow at Hodgdon that HS 6 and Win 540...HS 7 and Win 571...H414 and Win 760 are all matching numbers of powders... I was also told that 760 and I think AA2700 are the same powder...but don't take that to the bank. I'm sure there are other correspomding types of powders too...such as AA 9 and WC 820 may be a match...but I have never used AA9

 

[fordson]

Mixing the remains of one Lots of HP38 or 231 with a new Lot # of the same powder is one thing. I've done it, as I'm sure some here have. Mixing two "different " powders together, because the internet said they are the same? Don't think so - but that's just me.

 

[rosewood]

Mixing the remains of one Lots of HP38 or 231 with a new Lot # of the same powder is one thing. I've done it, as I'm sure some here have. Mixing two "different " powders together, because the internet said they are the same? Don't think so - but that's just me.

What if you call the manufacturer and they say they are indeed the same?

 

[Twoboxer]

What if you call the manufacturer and they say they are indeed the same?

In this case (HP38 & Win231) they are NOW the exact same. Both are NOW packaged from the same lot of powder, and can be seen to have the same lot numbers.

They have not always been identical.

The downside of mixing them is the same as mixing two different lots of different ages. Maybe no downside at all.

The upside is you get to throw out one empty bottle now. Pffft. Run the one pounder through your PM, and follow it with the remnants of the 8 lb. If your ammo changes, you'll know why.

 

[minconrevo]

Even lot to lot Win 231 is not exactly the same. Several years back their was a "hot" lot of 231. As I recall, in that instance 5.3 grains of the hot lot gave velocity equal to the usual 5.8 gr loading.

The only time I'd suggest dumping the remnants from one container into another is if BOTH are exactly the same lot number.

Unlikely the two containers you mention are exactly the same.

 

[swamprabbit]

I do not mix powders. Even of the same type and brand. I have never mixed powders of the same lot either. That may be acceptable but I have never found the need to do it. I have heard for years that 231 and HP38 are the same powder but time and time again I run across load data that shows them using different charge weights for the same load.

 

[mike from st pete]

Are they both made in St. Marks FL?

 

[fordson]

What if you call the manufacturer and they say they are indeed the same?

Then I'd ask the manufacturer to explain why they have two different labels. If it's just for "marketing", then the question is where is the explanatory statement on their website or on the label itself that states the powders are, indeed, the same and interchangeable.
Trust but verify.
If it's not in "writing", then it's not supported.

 

[Johnnu2]

I've always found that the best way to avoid liability is to say: "IT's UP TO YOU.. YOUR DECISION".... or:
"DON'T EVER MIX ANY POWDER"... period.
IMHO again,
J.

 

[Skeet 028]

. I have heard for years that 231 and HP38 are the same powder but time and time again I run across load data that shows them using different charge weights for the same load.

Check the load data for the 2 powders on the Hodgdon website and their loading books. The reason load data differs is mainly because of the testing procedures by different testers Remember their euiipment differs from each other as does the lot numbers and other components. That said I still don't mix large amount of powder anyway. Maybe an ounce or two. And only if in the same lot and typically from the same jug or keg

 

[AJ]

Was taught a long time ago not to mix any powders. Went I get that low that I can't get enough to make up more than a few rounds, it goes in the wifes posey bed..........

 

[Huskerguy]

OK, a different take although some touched on it.

I believe many adhere to the principal that the powder measure needs to be "at least" half full, preferably more to get accurate drops. I have a reloading buddy who is adamant about that.

So what do you do when you empty you last 1lb bottle of W231 and you have very little in your powder measure and it can throw off your drops?

 

[Johnnu2]

I then hand weigh each charge.... because I'm that cheap. Previous advice is also excellent.... dump it in your wife's posie patch....

J.