Winchester Small Pistol Primers

[jordan57]

Winchester small pistol primers come in two flavors 1 for standard loads, and 1 for magnum loads. I know the magnum primers have a hotter spark to ignite harder to ignite powders. Does anyone one know are the 2 type cups of the same strength? Will a standard primer flatten in a high pressure load easier? H110 and W296 always are recommended to use magnum primers. My question is this I loaded some rounds with H110 and they were starting level loads, but I used standard primers. They sure seemed to flatten more than I have ever seen with the magnum primers, even with much higher loadings. So are the cups softer? Tomorrow I'm going to go get magnum primers, but I'm just curious now.

 

[chief38]

I think that question would be best answered by the manufacturer as I'd bet there are few if any Fellas here (including myself) that could answer that accurately.

 

[jordan57]

Re

I actually did that. I spent way over an hour attempting to do just that very thing. Winchester Olin is a very large company, and it is not a very simple process. This is a generic question, their website is setup only to file a particular complaint. You really just can't ask a simple question. They want to know exactly what gun their ammunition damaged, what lot, etc, etc. I did the best I could do, because nothing was damaged at all. This was just a general question, about an observation that I appeared to make. I did get magnum primers yesterday, and the magnum primers do not appear to flatten to the same degree as the standard ones with the same starting level loads. The cases do not appear to be high pressure at all. Just appearance of primers, and I know that is a poor indication of pressure.

 

[Rule3]

Primer makers are tight lipped about actual construction.

"Generally" mag primers have a "thicker" cup not "harder" The main thing about mag primers is they are needed for hard to ignite powders and for cases that hold a LOT of powder,

For H110 it is a hard to ignite powder so a Mag primer is called for. If you use say 2400 powder then you can use a regular primer
Don't use a regular primer for H110

Even though Hodgdon shows a mag primer for all their powders it is not not needed, it is just the way they tested. Yes, I called and verified long ago, IE you don't need a mag primer for HP38

 

[jordan57]

Yes, I said "harder", actually should have said "thicker". Makes all the sense in the world. I had never used a standard primer for H110 till yesterday, I went and got some magnum ones after I fired the first one and seen flattened primer with standards. I could tell by case that they were not high pressured, but chose not to continue with the standard primer ones. I figured if they were flattening, they were being stressed.

 

[ArchAngelCD]

Are you sure the primers are flattened as with pressure or just l ok flatter that other brands? When I was buying ammo Winchester ammo primers always looked flatter than other ammo. Pictures would help us help you.

 

[Nevada Ed]

Over the years I notice that "Flattened" area of primers in my revolver full loads was..........

Federal std: medium flat
Winchester std: some what flat
CCI std primer: add some more powder........ not flat yet.

Win Mag primers will hold up to higher pressures but I do not have their 296 type powders....... just w231.

 

[alwslate]

The short answer is that you are not getting actual flattened primers from
any of your loads. Winchester SR and SPM primers are virtually identical
and are best for loads with any slow powder like 2400 or H110/296. You
could use SPM primers with all 38 spl and .357 loads with zero worries
because they help with the slow powders and have negligible effect on
small charges of fast burning powders.

 

[bigedp51]

CHOOSING THE RIGHT PRIMER - A PRIMER ON PRIMERS
Primer Info & Chart + Milspec Primers for Semi-Autos & Other Primer Applications


PRIMER CHART & REFERENCE GUIDE

Small Handgun Standard .017" cup thickness

CCI 500
Federal 100 - Has a soft cup - good to use if hammer strike is light.
Federal 100M - Match version of above
Magtech PR-SP
Magtech PR-SPC - Lead-free "Clean Range" primer for indoor ranges etc.
Remington 1 ½
RWS 4031
Winchester WSP
Wolf/Tula Small Pistol SP #KVB-9 - brass cup - "For Standard Pistol loads"
Wolf/Tula Small Pistol #KVB-9SP - "For 9×19 NATO cartridges"
Wolf/Tula Small Pistol #KVB-9S - "For Sporting Pistol loads"

Small Handgun Magnum .017" cup thickness

CCI 550 See Note 1 at the bottom of page
Federal 200
Federal 200M - Match version of above
Magtech PR-SPM
Remington 5 ½
RWS 4047
Winchester WSPM
Wolf/Tula Small Pistol Magnum SPM #KVB-9M - brass cup - "For Magnum Pistol loads"

Large Handgun Standard .020" cup thickness

CCI 300
Federal 150 - Has a thinner cup
Magtech PR-LP
Remington 2 ½
RWS 5337
Winchester WLP
Wolf/Tula Large Pistol LP #KVB-45 - brass cup - "For Standard Pistol loads"

Large Handgun Magnum .020" cup thickness

CCI 350
Federal 155
Wolf/Tula Large Pistol Magnum LPM #KVB-45M - brass cup - For Magnum Pistol loads


NOTE 1: According to Speer/CCI Technical Services - Both the CCI 550 Small Pistol Magnum and CCI 400 Small Rifle primers are identical in size. Both primers use the same cup metal and share the same cup thickness. Both primers use the same primer compound formula and same amount of primer compound. They can be used interchangeably.

 

[jordan57]

Thank you all for the above replies. bigedp51's reply was most informative. I have since found out that CCI primers are definitely harder than Winchester primer. I never did receive a reply that I sent to Winchester/Olin. Again, thank you all. I knew the loads I was referencing were well below spec pressure wise, just trying to reason why I was seeing what I was seeing. I was using a newer gun, and it just seems to flatten primers to a greater extent than other guns in my collection.