winter EDC

[cracker57]

So I have switched from my summer EDC the shield to my winter carry the CZ PCR.
with the temp dropping I was thinking I need to check my gun ammo combo for cold weather. I was thinking I should leave my gun and ammo out in the cold and see how it performs when temps are well below Zero.
than I thought why, as if its below zero I will just stay home and warm.

 

[URIT]

A timely topic. Here is a nice article worthy of a good read...

The Effects of Cold Weather on Guns and Ammo - IFA Tactical

 

[Piwo]

Back in the day I used to practice outside in the winter. I tried to practice with my guns as I would normally carry them. Not extended sessions, but usually with whatever loadout for that particular weapon. I wanted to check my abilities when my hands were cold or I was cold. Under those conditions running an airweight 38 snubby could be a challenge. Reloading with loose rounds with frozen hands was much slower. Speedloaders were a great help. Recoil was felt more. I also found I was more likely to fumble with reloads, dropping ammo in the snow on occasion. Because of that, I tended to carry more ammo in the winter time. I still do to this day. It is the first reason I offer to those that "script" their self defense shootings, saying "you don't need more than X amount of shots." I don't carry extra ammo generally because I expect to shoot a lot. I carry it for malfunctions and for the times under stress where I may drop ammo in the snow, or at a dead run.
I also discovered that it was a lot easier to shoot a semi auto with cold hands. Especially the Glock. Easier to reload and to keep running at speed. They were less cold to the touch than the aluminum frame guns. I also favor the NY1 trigger for its feel and heavier pull. I shoot it as well as a standard trigger. I feel I have more of a margin of safety with the heavier pull with cold and numb hands. My snubs are 95% of the time used as back up guns, if and when needed as such. In the winter they usually are in an outer coat pocket.
I was and am fortunate that I have a place to shoot outside year round. Shooting under all weather conditions can give one a better insight as to what works and doesn't work. If you live or operate in places where it can get brutally cold, I highly suggest you practice under those conditions. Even if you can only do it a few times.
Just my observations, FWIW.

 

[ImprovedModel56Fan]

Interesting. I do not view winter as any sort of challenge regarding concealed carry. I see it as an opportunity to carry full-sized defensive weapons if I so choose. The weapons do not get cold because they are close to my body. If I am walking any distance I may put a J frame in a coat pocket, but my hand can still keep it warm if necessary.

Obviously, different circumstances may create different needs.

 

[Doug M.]

All good points. Remember that depending on how one dresses, there is a good chance that the pistol will not be at ambient temperature as it will be under layered clothing that will keep the air temperature near your body noticeably warmer.

The difficulty of draw and shooting with real winter gear on means that moving away from things that don't seem right is more important.

 

[Bald1]

Listen, this is Western NY here. The way we dress in the winter we can conceal an AR with 30 rd mag. We don’t need no stinking reloads.

 

[375hh1973]

My winter EDC is the same as my summer EDC.

M&P 45c or.....
Sig P226 .357sig or....
Kimber 10mm 1911

 

[zeke]

Yup it can get cold up here in the winter. With lots of heavy clothes on, my main concern isn't concealment but being able to access the pistol quickly while the heavy clothes are being worn. For this a switch over is made to front pocket carry so not digging through jacket.

 

[Krogen]

I am a proponent of the single EDC gun. I use a gun suited for summer and light clothing year 'round. Different seasons' clothing may mean different techniques. Even so, the gun is always the same. I don't subscribe to the notion of "carry rotation" or cold/hot weather guns. I want the gun to be the one predictable constant. Presentation techniques may have to adapt to the season. I don't worry about outside temperature; the gun is close to my body. Cold fingers and maybe a dulled mind are cold weather things to ponder and train for.

 

[chief38]

I am in the "boring club" that carries the same gun 365 days a year. I see no real reason to "rotate" guns. IMHO that can lead to confusion, unfamiliarity and delays in deploying a firearm in a stressful and important time of need.

I personally carry an original size Sig P365. It weighs 17.6 ounces not loaded and about 21 ounces loaded with 11 rounds of 124 grain 9mm HP's. It is also small enough to easily pocket carry, has excellent sights, is extremely accurate, reliable and is capable of handling the very successful 9mm +P ammo. It is fast to reload and I now carry it about 50% of the time in my pocket with a DeSantis Nemesis holster and 50% of the time in a Kramer Horsehide OWB holster.

I am quite familiar with it, I always know what I am carrying, exactly how it operates, how many rounds it holds, where it shoots and exactly what to expect. What sense would it make to me to mix that up with rotating CCW firearms?? Because of it's light weight and small size, it can be carried during any weather conditions and to me, along with similar guns like the Hellcat, FN Reflex, etc. it never requires rotations and shoots the very competent and effective 9mm.

If one wants to strap on a new gun of the week, I would suggest doing that at the Range but see no practical reason to do it "for real" when CCW. Rotating carry guns may feel kind of cool, but may cause you a major issue if and when you ever need to use it. Call me boring!

 

[MSD2343]

My winter carry is a subtle change: Same Shield Plus I always carry but I switch out the 10 round magazine for a 13 rounder.

 

[Oldsalt66]

South Florida here, and if the temperature drops all the way down to the 60s I simply wear socks under my sandals and soldier on.

 

[45Smashemflat]

South Florida here, and if the temperature drops all the way down to the 60s I simply wear socks under my sandals and soldier on.

Black socks, correct?

 

[biku324]

When I wear a heavy coat, my EDC is my 625-8.

 

[rockquarry]

South Florida here, and if the temperature drops all the way down to the 60s I simply wear socks under my sandals and soldier on.

Wearing socks with sandals?

 

[Krogen]

I am in the "boring club" that carries the same gun 365 days a year.
<snip>
Call me boring!

Apologies for clipping the meat out of your post. You said above exactly what I'd say. A big ME TOO is in order. Thanks to one of your older posts, I investigated the P365 and found it's perfect for my needs. Like you, I carry one gun year round; a P365.

I figure I'm a life member of the the boring club!

 

[zeke]

So I have switched from my summer EDC the shield to my winter carry the CZ PCR.
with the temp dropping I was thinking I need to check my gun ammo combo for cold weather. I was thinking I should leave my gun and ammo out in the cold and see how it performs when temps are well below Zero.
than I thought why, as if its below zero I will just stay home and warm.

Always a good thing to check, especially in climes with extreme fluctuations. As is checking your firearm is degreased, or minimum of syn grease suitable for possible temp.

This is Wi, not Florida. NW temps may be in the -15 f real quick.

 

[BAM-BAM]

I use to go from a 9mm 3913 in three seasons to a .45 Sig 220/245 in winter. Last few years I've stuck to 3rd Gen Smiths year round;3913 8+1 and a Shorty-9 in winter that can be either a 12 or 15+1.

 

[BabaBlueJay]

I am from a part of the country known as the snowbelt, and specifically one of the harshest parts of the snowbelt. So much so, that the school I teach at had a roof collapse due to five feet of snow in a few days.

Ashtabula high school students headed to new building after roof collapse

I grew up in this area and have tons of outdoors experience in cold and snowy conditions. That being said, I am with Chief38 on this one and do not carry a special gun or ammo for the cold. I think this is another example of the "what ifs". You can drive yourself crazy diving deep into pseudoscientific tests where people freeze their guns in nitroglycerine or put their bullets in a freezer and begin to doubt things you know for a fact will be just fine regardless of the weather.

For one thing, most of these "tests" are completely unrealistic for most people. I don't know about you, but when I spent the better part of two days shoveling 6 feet of snow to clear our vehicles out so we could go to the grocery store, my EDC was in my coat as toasty as I was. I have never had a situation where my gun got too cold to operate because it is usually concealed under several layers or in a coat pocket that keeps it protected from the elements. It is not like I just chuck my revolver in the back of my pick up truck and let it sit in the snow for hours to see how it performs... Also, even for someone who enjoys the outdoors as much as I do, it is not like most people are spending hours or days on end exposing their guns or ammo to these conditions. So I would not overthink specializing your gun or ammo based on it, I certainly don't and I live it.

Finally, there are some extreme circumstances for people who may benefit from specialized guns and ammo. Soldiers and hunters with long guns who very well may be exposed to the elements for hours or days or even longer. That makes sense to me to specialize for an Elk hunt or to go fight in an environment with extreme cold. I am guessing this applies to a very small percentage of people, however, and since the OP is asking about an EDC I am guessing this is not what he is asking about.

 

[robertrwalsh]

One of the modest benefits of my neck of the woods. It gets cool here in the winter but very seldom frigid. The trolls do wear more clothing in the winter but it is not really cold enough to bother ammo performance, nor for that matter weapons performance (frozen lube and such).

 

[zeke]

Some of the things i have learned living in the winter cold and always carrying concealed since legal, although others experiences may differ.

1-There's cold and then there's cold. It is quite common up here to go a week or more where the temps don't get above zero in the day, and minus 20's (f).
2-A pistol buried under multiple layers of winter clothing is very slow to get to. Especially sitting down.
3-Pistols carried in coat pockets are great, till you go inside some where/some place where it's too warm to wear your coat. Or you get older and more forgetful.
4-Some are endeared to 38 sp with good reason. Up here, have a preference for something that starts with a 4 and has enough umph to defeat multiple layers of winter clothes and big people. This is reality up here.
5-wether advisable or not, pistols get left in vehicles overnight. Have done this myself after medical visits in the winter.

Of course people's situations/opinions differ. If i lived in the hot area, would want to know how my preferred methods worked after sitting in a hot car all day in peak of summer. Especially if my preference was loaded with hotter rounds.

 

[cd228]

I'd look at the locals and/or the PD.

Most Police Agencies that I've seen carry the same round and weapon year round. Your common duty rounds Speer Gold Dot, Federal HST, Hornady Critical duty pass tests designed to simulate heavy clothing, which IMHO is more common in cold weather. For example NYPD used to carry 124gr Speer Gold dot +p+ year round to include winter foot beats. I don't know what they currently do, I stay out of the city as of late.

I also like to look at what the local outdoorsman carries into the woods. If everyone going hunting starts packing a .44, I would too.

We've also seen DoD putting money into temperature insensative propelents. Some of the requirements for the newer sniper rounds reflect that. NDIA had some slides on it a while back. Older powders were found to have significant changes in pressure/velocity due to temperature. As mentioned above your carry pistol will probably be significantly warmer than ambient temperature. if you are concerned, chrono some rounds to see if there is a difference.

On the flip side, if you wear gloves, do some drills in glove and see how that impacts your performance.

 

[BB57]

I generally switch to a .357 Mag revolver in the winter, usually a Model 66 or 686+, sometimes an SP101 of Taurus 605. And it may be either IWB or OWB depending on the situation.

Partly it’s due to wanting something with a bit more poke in the winter due to potential assailants with heavier clothing.

Partly it’s due to me being more likely yo be out and about in the woods.

Partly it’s due to having grown up and spent 45 years in the severely cold frozen north, where a cold soaked semi auto can be a bit less reliable, even with due regard for and proper attention to extreme cold weather lubricants and lubrication.

But mostly here in eastern NC where winters are mild and a vest suffices most of the time, the cover garment allows for some different and larger carry options.

 

[diyj98]

I am in the "boring club" that carries the same gun 365 days a year. I see no real reason to "rotate" guns. IMHO that can lead to confusion, unfamiliarity and delays in deploying a firearm in a stressful and important time of need.

I think that's a very good point. I posted something similar on another forum a few years ago, and received several lectures about how proper training would eliminate all my imagined problems. I can very well see how a no safety handgun one day, then a safety down for off (1911 and others), then a safety up for off (third gen S&W and others), could cause muscle memory confusion in a life threatening situation.

 

[Doug M.]

Listen, this is Western NY here. The way we dress in the winter we can conceal an AR with 30 rd mag. We don’t need no stinking reloads.

**
Do your politicians allow such a platform?
The worsening gun laws is one of the main reasons I may never go home again. Washington has become bad enough.

 

[WardenRoss]

Back in the day I used to practice outside in the winter. I tried to practice with my guns as I would normally carry them. Not extended sessions, but usually with whatever loadout for that particular weapon. I wanted to check my abilities when my hands were cold or I was cold. Under those conditions running an airweight 38 snubby could be a challenge. Reloading with loose rounds with frozen hands was much slower. Speedloaders were a great help. Recoil was felt more. I also found I was more likely to fumble with reloads, dropping ammo in the snow on occasion. Because of that, I tended to carry more ammo in the winter time. I still do to this day. It is the first reason I offer to those that "script" their self defense shootings, saying "you don't need more than X amount of shots." I don't carry extra ammo generally because I expect to shoot a lot. I carry it for malfunctions and for the times under stress where I may drop ammo in the snow, or at a dead run.
I also discovered that it was a lot easier to shoot a semi auto with cold hands. Especially the Glock. Easier to reload and to keep running at speed. They were less cold to the touch than the aluminum frame guns. I also favor the NY1 trigger for its feel and heavier pull. I shoot it as well as a standard trigger. I feel I have more of a margin of safety with the heavier pull with cold and numb hands. My snubs are 95% of the time used as back up guns, if and when needed as such. In the winter they usually are in an outer coat pocket.
I was and am fortunate that I have a place to shoot outside year round. Shooting under all weather conditions can give one a better insight as to what works and doesn't work. If you live or operate in places where it can get brutally cold, I highly suggest you practice under those conditions. Even if you can only do it a few times.
Just my observations, FWIW.

Great post!

I would add that going to the range and practicing in the pouring rain should be experienced.


,

 

[cracker57]

OP, thats me,
lots of good points given, I also don't believe in EDC rotation and I don't think having a summer gun and a winter gun is rotating.
Also both guns are draw and shoot guns no safety. both are carried the same way IWB at 3:30 4 oclock. This is a challenge to draw sometimes depending on the clothing, thats why we practice.
The range I use is semi outdoor, 3 walls and a roof, there are heaters aimed at the shooter but I never turn them on.
as mentioned I don't worry about my gun catching a cold as its being hugged next to my body, I believe as with all relationships if I take care of it, it will take care of me!

 

[Oldsalt66]

Wearing socks with sandals?

Yes, white socks and sandals.

We call that wearing "our winter boots" and they are properly worn with a tee shirt and shorts.

Gotta stay warm when the temperatures plummet to below 70 degrees for a few days each year.

 

[chief38]

The only thing I want to add here is that I will state the age old saying......

"Beware of the man who only has one gun". Yes, I have more than one, however I only CCW one.

 

[BB57]

I think that's a very good point. I posted something similar on another forum a few years ago, and received several lectures about how proper training would eliminate all my imagined problems. I can very well see how a no safety handgun one day, then a safety down for off (1911 and others), then a safety up for off (third gen S&W and others), could cause muscle memory confusion in a life threatening situation.

It’s a valid point - especially for people who don’t shoot the, often enough to get and stay proficient.

It’s one of the reasons I switched mostly to DA/SA pistols when I started carrying a .357 Mag in the woods and in the winter.

After shooting and carrying 1911s and Hi Powers for decades, when shooting under time pressure, I’m far more likely to find my thumb on top of the safety on my C75D PCR, Beretta 84BB, 80X etc. but it doesn’t hurt anything or slow it down.