Kel Tek p11 or Taurus pt111. The look and feel the same not much difference in price. Thanks
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Kel Tek p11 or Taurus pt111. The look and feel the same not much difference in price. Thanks
flop-shank
US Veteran
I'll bite. As you decide you can keep this one man's experience in the back of your mind. Kel-tec has excellent customer service/warranty work. Taurus is, in my experience, beyond incompetent. I will never buy another Taurus.
38-44HD45
Absent Comrade
Flop is right. Besides that, based on what I've seen locally, you're much less likely to need warranty service on the Kel-Tec than on the Taurus.
HOUSTON RICK
Member
Friends do not let friends buy Taurus, I respect those who disagree.
GatorFarmer
Member
Honestly? I'd hate to rely on either as my first choice. Of the two, I did own a Kel Tec P11. It was a functional handgun, and Kel Tec does a good job at satisfying a customer and sending out parts.
However, there are so many people who've experience with their customer service department owing to them apparently turning out a fair percentage of guns in need of service.
A Glock 26 or 27 is about the same size as a P11, and while heavier, is a much better made gun.
I simply don't trust Taurus' QC, and I further distrust their service department. In this case two strikes and they're out.
If you need the relatively light weight of the Kel Tec, I'd suggest an alloy J frame. You have fewer rounds on board, but a much higher chance of them all going bang.
However, there are so many people who've experience with their customer service department owing to them apparently turning out a fair percentage of guns in need of service.
A Glock 26 or 27 is about the same size as a P11, and while heavier, is a much better made gun.
I simply don't trust Taurus' QC, and I further distrust their service department. In this case two strikes and they're out.
If you need the relatively light weight of the Kel Tec, I'd suggest an alloy J frame. You have fewer rounds on board, but a much higher chance of them all going bang.
SineMetu82
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I've never owned a Kel-tec but I can tell you stay away from the Taurus. Horrible quality and horrible service.
Srigs
Member
I have a P11 and Taurus PT140 and I would carry the P11 any day.
LoboGunLeather
US Veteran
For what it is worth, I discovered the fine little Kahr pistols a few years back. I have used the K9 (steel-framed 9X19) and the P40 (poly-framed .40 S&W). Excellent quality and very easy to shoot well (once we get used to the trigger which, like the Glock, actuates the striker mechanism).
With either pistol I have never experienced a problem with feeding, extraction, ejection or any other function with several types and brands of ammunition. Both of mine are superbly accurate. And they can disappear under a golf shirt in the summertime.
For those needing a good quality concealable handgun at a reasonable price, I recommend the Kahr products. (Yes, I know this is the Smith & Wesson forum! No, I'm not a shill for Kahr.)
As always, my opinions are free and worth every penny of the price.
With either pistol I have never experienced a problem with feeding, extraction, ejection or any other function with several types and brands of ammunition. Both of mine are superbly accurate. And they can disappear under a golf shirt in the summertime.
For those needing a good quality concealable handgun at a reasonable price, I recommend the Kahr products. (Yes, I know this is the Smith & Wesson forum! No, I'm not a shill for Kahr.)
As always, my opinions are free and worth every penny of the price.
BarbC
Member
Although I only have the KelTec P32 and 3AT, I have had nothing but excellent service from KelTec. I had to ship back the P32 because the retaining pin kept falling out and they replaced the entire gun for me.
When I visit my parents in Melbourne, we have dropped by the KelTec facility a couple of times so they can give the KelTecs a quick tune-up if they need one. They're great people!
When I visit my parents in Melbourne, we have dropped by the KelTec facility a couple of times so they can give the KelTecs a quick tune-up if they need one. They're great people!
Pioneer461
US Veteran
Neither, how about a Smith & Wesson?
I've never shot a Kel-Tek, but I must comment that I own two Taurus revolvers, one .38 and one .357. I find the quality on both of them excellent. I've never had to deal with Taurus customer service, because I've never had a problem with the guns.
To those who have negative comments about Taurus, can you enlighten us as to the problems? Were they your problems, or some you heard about. Old guns, new guns?
I've never shot a Kel-Tek, but I must comment that I own two Taurus revolvers, one .38 and one .357. I find the quality on both of them excellent. I've never had to deal with Taurus customer service, because I've never had a problem with the guns.
To those who have negative comments about Taurus, can you enlighten us as to the problems? Were they your problems, or some you heard about. Old guns, new guns?
GatorFarmer
Member
A friend and I purchased brand new Taurus 85s on the same day. His lasted around 500 rounds before the timing went off and it started locking up. Mine lasted less than 100 rounds. If I remember correctly 35 rds of +P and 50 rds of UMC LRN. After that the cylinder locked up and would not open. I gave it away to a friend, he sent it in, and after two trips back with an arguement with whatever passed for their customer rep the second time around, it eventually seemed to work. These were circa 1996 guns, purchased brand new from a shop, and made at a time when many gunwriters (I'm talking about you Jan Libourel) were singing the praises of the Tauri.
The 686 that I bought around that time strangely kept working for 10 years until I sold it in 2006.
More recently I witnessed one of their polymer autos - sorry, I don't keep track of their model numbers but it was a 9mm - having issues with light primer strikes and FTF on a range. Making idle conversation with the owner, he claimed that the gun was doing this when he got it and that he was going to send it back again. Not as dramatic as the nickel Bryco that I saw lock up the first time that it was fired, but still interesting albeit anecdotal.
Still more recently, I was shopping around for an extra revolver - this would have been summer before last. While "Judges" were in short supply, I had a chance to look at two of them in the case. Both seemed to have various issues in regard to fit and finish (though to be fair, maybe these were rushed out).
I'm sure that Taurus is able to run out guns that work, probably the majority of such that leave their factory. However, the percentage of guns that seem to fail makes it seem - to me at least - that it simply isn't worth taking the gamble in order to take advantage of the slightly reduced price point.
flop-shank
US Veteran
My Taurus 605 was shot loose after several hundred .357 magnums. Part of the problem was the crane peening it's retaining screw within the first few cylinders fired after I bought the gun new. The retaining screw came from the factory loose and was backing out. That reduced the screw's bearing surface on the crane which led to damage to the crane. When I sent it in for work, the crane was fitted to the frame poorly, it had endshake with the front of the cylinder dragging on the forcing cone, the locking bolt no longer worked and it was out of time. The cylinder also came unlocked when firing full power .357s and counterrotated the wrong way sometimes so a subsequent trigger pull would drop the hammer on the round that had just been fired. After two trips to the aces in Miami (each time with a detailed letter explaining my problems, the second time I had circled the problem areas on the gun itself with red permanent marker) the gun was still wrong. Everything was fixed except the hand was too long, so the trigger got super heavy and "stacked" before the hammer would fall in DA fire. Of course the severity varied from charge hole to charge hole. In the end I stoned the hand until it was the right length. As the gun gets loose again, I intend to do what I should have done in the first place, get an SP-101. The early 2 1/4" 605s, which is what I have, are almost identical in weight, size and feel to a Ruger. Like Gator, I believed the lies of the gun whores and got burned. Buy quality and only cry once. Don't buy Taurus. The revolversmith Grant Cunningham refuses to work on the things and cites the inferior quality/fit and finish as the reason why.
I can't speak to the Taurus, but I have the Kel Tek P11. I find it very easy to conceal and very reliable. Had a problem getting used to the trigger pull at first, but I did eventually adjust to it. Nice little 9mm.
You are lucky! My daughter had a Taurus 65 blow the cylinder off the gun. Returned to Taurus and they replaced the gun. Guess what? The same dam thing shooting wad cutters out of fear. I gave her a model 64, and she has shot it I don't know how many hundreds of times. It shoots better than when I gave it to her, and no, she wouldn't sell it to me....=:-(
f150guy
Member
I read somewhere that Keltecs were good for about 2000 rounds. The Ass hat at Gander Mountain told me that If I bought Kel-tec, they would not take it in on trade, even though they sell them new. According to him, they are junk. He was also all of 17 years old...
Lots of Keltecs being sold, and though I don't have one, know many leo's carrying off-duty.
I have shot a Kel-Tec P11, and find it difficult to shoot well due to the REALLY STIFF trigger. I bought a Kel-Tec PF9 which is the single stack version. It sort of resembles a P3AT on steroids. The trigger is much, much better. Holds a couple of less rounds, but it is more easily concealed and much easier to shoot accurately. Has decent sights, unlike the .380.
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