Would you draw your weapon?

[Muss Muggins]

I find it interesting that people are always trying to lengthen or complicate the simple list. No, this is covered by #3.

Well, it is if you count just laying around on a counter or table as "putting away . . . "

 

[InsideWaist]

I find it interesting that people are always trying to lengthen or complicate the simple list. No, this is covered by #3.

I disagree.

To "put away" means (IMHO) to store it for non-instant access or for permanent storage, either short (overnight) or long term.

Therefore, #4 is—indeed— appropriate for those of us that either (have no children at home, live only with responsible gun owners, live alone, etc).

 

[Irn-Bru]

We didn't have to deal with this 20-30 years ago. Today's society is gone to the dogs. Morons all over the place.

 

[okiegtrider]

Another tic mark here for no guns required in this situation. No matter how much public service might be done by removing someone this stupid from the gene pool.

 

[Rastoff]

We didn't have to deal with this 20-30 years ago.

There were no criminals or grand-standing people back then? What planet are you from?

Don't you remember the streaking craze?

 

[jlrhiner]

Now wait a minute. An individual enters an establishment dressed in jail garb, handcuffed, and trying to get a ride and most of you consider him to not be a threat?!?

Handgun aimed squarely at his thoracic triangle and ordered to hit the ground. Failure to instantly comply, BANG. I don't care if he was scotch-hobbled.

Let his next of kin explain the joke to the authorities. If I took the attitude that it wasn't my business because he didn't act bad with me, and I later found out he murdered/raped someone, then I wouldn't be able to forgive myself.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

 

[Buford57]

There were no criminals or grand-standing people back then? What planet are you from?

Don't you remember the streaking craze?

Streaking and Candid Camera. Where's Allen Funt?

Staff and patrons behaved responsibly despite the provocations of an idiot. Go thou and do likewise. Move along, nothing to see here.

 

[Mule Packer]

You have got to be kidding me!!!

This bozo is a 24-karat doo-dah! Not a threat?? Not a threat?? You might want to rethink that.

31FordA, jlrhiner, and others have explained that just because this idiot is handcuffed, sure as heck does not mean he doesn't present a danger to people. Also, just for clarification...his jumpsuit said "Inmate" and "State Penitentiary." We aren't talking county jail here, folks. He's not in for loitering, drunk driving or shoplifting.

How the heck are we to know that a guy in state penitentiary garb and handcuffs is doing it just for chuckles? I can see it now..."Golly, officer, I thought it was just a YouTube prank until he grabbed that little girl standing over by the doughnut rack and slit her throat."

He claims that he does these stunts "to shed light" on things that need to be changed. WHAT???!!! Baloney!! He's doing it for one reason and one reason only...to get money. He's had over 25,000 hits on his YouTube video already. Ka-ching!

He's also in the process of doing another so-called "prank video" where he pretends to steal somebody's car. Tell me now, what sociological response that supposedly needs changing will he be "shedding light" upon by doing this? If you actually believe that line of bull....aw, forget it.

I know some folks say that if they saw an escaped con running around like that, begging people for a ride, they'd quietly back off and call 911 because they aren't law enforcement and that's not their job. Besides, he might not be in prison for murder, or rape, or assault, or killing his girlfriend's baby. Maybe he's only in for drug-related charges. Perfectly harmless. Right?

Yep, and we'd probably sit back in our seats on an airliner, too, if some nut job tried to take over the plane, because we aren't air marshals. Besides, who knows?...it could just be this idiot doing another YouTube prank.

All I can say is, I sure hope he doesn't pick my truck to "pretend" to steal as his next prank. Utah laws state that a personal vehicle has the same status as one's home and if someone tries to carjack it, you can react with deadly force. That's why the state passed a law that says you can carry a fully-loaded weapon in your vehicle, concealed or not, at all times without a permit.

You can bet the ranch that one would get tons of hits on YouTube, but sadly, he would no longer be around to collect his money. What a shame.

Okay, okay. Rant over. I'm gonna go pop up a batch of popcorn, heavy on the butter, sit in my rocking chair and watch a John Wayne movie.

 

[Muss Muggins]

Pretty sure there's not a jurisdiction in the country where the circumstances you describe before you would pull the trigger constitute authorization to use deadly force on an unarmed, restrained individual without prior knowledge of the exact circumstances (news release, Amber alert, etc. ). . .

Now wait a minute. An individual enters an establishment dressed in jail garb, handcuffed, and trying to get a ride and most of you consider him to not be a threat?!?

Handgun aimed squarely at his thoracic triangle and ordered to hit the ground. Failure to instantly comply, BANG. I don't care if he was scotch-hobbled.

Let his next of kin explain the joke to the authorities. If I took the attitude that it wasn't my business because he didn't act bad with me, and I later found out he murdered/raped someone, then I wouldn't be able to forgive myself.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

 

[Kanewpadle]

Pretty sure there's not a jurisdiction in the country where the circumstances you describe before you would pull the trigger constitute authorization to use deadly force on an unarmed, restrained individual without prior knowledge of the exact circumstances (news release, Amber alert, etc. ). . .

I agree. I'm not a cop. I have no business ordering anyone to do anything that isn't a direct threat to me. I would be cautious but I would not overreact. If he focused his attention on me then it might be a different story.

This a prime example of people that are so focused on their perceived threat that they don't realize that there may be an accomplice nearby in the store or outside.

Keep calm. Use common sense.

 

[jlrhiner]

Being an "inmate" from a "state prison" takes him out of any reasonable protection guaranteed by law. He doesn't get the benefit of the doubt. As a reasonable person, I believe that others may be in danger if he is allowed to leave. He has already forfeited his rights. He gets no break.

 

[Muss Muggins]

Being an "inmate" from a "state prison" takes him out of any reasonable protection guaranteed by law. He doesn't get the benefit of the doubt. As a reasonable person, I believe that others may be in danger if he is allowed to leave. He has already forfeited his rights. He gets no break.

Pretty sure you'd lose that battle in court absent some prior knowledge . . .

 

[okiegtrider]

Being an "inmate" from a "state prison" takes him out of any reasonable protection guaranteed by law. He doesn't get the benefit of the doubt. As a reasonable person, I believe that others may be in danger if he is allowed to leave. He has already forfeited his rights. He gets no break.

Oh if it were just that simple.

 

[Walkingwolf]

Now wait a minute. An individual enters an establishment dressed in jail garb, handcuffed, and trying to get a ride and most of you consider him to not be a threat?!?

Handgun aimed squarely at his thoracic triangle and ordered to hit the ground. Failure to instantly comply, BANG. I don't care if he was scotch-hobbled.

Let his next of kin explain the joke to the authorities. If I took the attitude that it wasn't my business because he didn't act bad with me, and I later found out he murdered/raped someone, then I wouldn't be able to forgive myself.

Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

I would rethink that unless you find a vacation staying the grey bar hotel a vacation.

 

[Kanewpadle]

Being an "inmate" from a "state prison" takes him out of any reasonable protection guaranteed by law. He doesn't get the benefit of the doubt. As a reasonable person, I believe that others may be in danger if he is allowed to leave. He has already forfeited his rights. He gets no break.

Good luck with that. You are NOT judge and jury. The only time you get to decide if deadly force is necessary is if YOU are in IMMEDIATE danger of bodily harm or you WITNESS harm being done to someone who can't defend themselves.

An "inmate" in orange jump suit and handcuffs is not an immediate threat. Could he be dangerous? Yes. But no more or less than anyone else.

I suggest you leave emotion out of this and use some common sense. People don't need to be shot just because they act stupid and pull a juvenile prank. If that were the case, every one of us should have been shot for the stupid things we did when we were young.

 

[jlrhiner]

Pretty sure you'd lose that battle in court absent some prior knowledge . . .

How? I'm analyzing the facts as they're presented to me. The only knowledge I have is standing right in front of me. I have no reason to believe any other scenario exists. There is an escaped felon attempting to flee right in front of me.

We can make a citizens arrest. We can use deadly force to prevent someone from harming someone else. Do you disagree with either of these statements?

 

[Kanewpadle]

How? I'm analyzing the facts as they're presented to me. The only knowledge I have is standing right in front of me. I have no reason to believe any other scenario exists. There is an escaped felon attempting to flee right in front of me.

We can make a citizens arrest. We can use deadly force to prevent someone from harming someone else. Do you disagree with either of these statements?

Facts? What facts? The facts you perceive that may just be wrong? Are you willing to take that chance?

Be a good witness and call the police.

 

[jlrhiner]

Good luck with that. You are NOT judge and jury. The only time you get to decide if deadly force is necessary is if YOU are in IMMEDIATE danger of bodily harm or you WITNESS harm being done to someone who can't defend themselves.

An "inmate" in orange jump suit and handcuffs is not an immediate threat. Could he be dangerous? Yes. But no more or less than anyone else.

I suggest you leave emotion out of this and use some common sense. People don't need to be shot just because they act stupid and pull a juvenile prank. If that were the case, every one of us should have been shot for the stupid things we did when we were young.

No emotion. I am not aware of a juvenile prank. I am aware of an escaped felon attempting to flee right in front of me. He doesn't have to get shot, but thats entirely up to him.

I suggest some of you re-evaluate your testosterone out put. Society is screwed up because the majority won't take a stand for what is right for fear of "retribution", wether legal or otherwise.

I will NOT stand idly by while evil rampages in my presence. Never have, never will.

 

[jlrhiner]

Facts? What facts? The facts you perceive that may just be wrong? Are you willing to take that chance?

Be a good witness and call the police.

My perception of the situation is all that matters.

 

[InsideWaist]

We can use deadly force to prevent someone from harming someone else.

You answered your own question with that statement. The "escaped prisoner" has not harmed anyone in that store. So, based on your statement, no...you can't use deadly force.