WWB Issue or something else?

[kf4jzy]

Hey guys and gals,
I previously started a thread (http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p-pistols/277859-new-shield-9-problem-maybe.html) where my first time to the range with my Shield 9 had 2 fail to fires using WWB, but I think this was due to user error (babying it). The next trip to the range I used Federal champion with no problems. Well, I bought 200 rounds of WWB again and went to the range.

After around 170 rounds, I had another fail to fire. This time, the round was not the first shot from the magazine, so this was not due to me babying the slide; I'm now used to treating it as it should. I examined the round and noticed that it did have a striker hit that appeared to be lite, but the odd thing I noticed is that it was not centered. It was near the rim of the primer.

I went ahead and placed the round back in the magazine and it fired. I did not have any other issues with the remaining ammunition. I took a photo of the primer so you can see what I'm talking about. Unfortunately, I neglected to take a photo after the lite strike, so you will see both the lite and normal strike in the photo. You will see the lite strike near the primer rim at the 6 o' clock position.

Other than this, the gun has been performing great during its break-in period, and I'm getting better shooting it as well.

Does this seem to be an ammo issue?
Why would the strike hit off-center?

Since I will be using this as my CCW eventually, I may be being a little extra picky about this, but I'm sure you understand. Also, I now have 425 rounds through this gun.

Thanks in advance!

 

[robkarrob]

Since you only had one issue, likely is ammo related. As far a centered primer hits, have you checked the others. It is not unusual to see slightly off-centered primer hits. As you stated, it did fire the second time around.

Bob

 

[Shielded]

Yes it's off a tad, but nothing I myself would be overly concerned about. The firing pin channel might need to be cleaned. I would do that & go from there. It might also have been just a bit out of battery. That's also been a thread of discussion, and has been noted as beating a dead horse too, but that's another story. Clean & shoot & see how it goes

 

[kf4jzy]

Since you only had one issue, likely is ammo related. As far a centered primer hits, have you checked the others. It is not unusual to see slightly off-centered primer hits. As you stated, it did fire the second time around.

Bob

I am collecting my brass in case I want to reload, and when I checked they all looked centered. The location of this one though seemed pretty off. But, like you said, it did only happen once. Since this is a new gun, I'm pretty (perhaps overly) picky

Thanks

 

[kf4jzy]

Yes it's off a tad, but nothing I myself would be overly concerned about. The firing pin channel might need to be cleaned. I would do that & go from there. It might also have been just a bit out of battery. That's also been a thread of discussion, and has been noted as beating a dead horse too, but that's another story. Clean & shoot & see how it goes

I've just been doing the regular cleaning since I've owned it. I'll check around to see how to clean the firing pin channel. I think I watched a YouTube video showing a guy tearing apart the slide....it was beyond my comfort level. But I'm not sure if that would be necessary to do what you've mentioned.

Thanks

 

[Shielded]

I've just been doing the regular cleaning since I've owned it. I'll check around to see how to clean the firing pin channel. I think I watched a YouTube video showing a guy tearing apart the slide....it was beyond my comfort level. But I'm not sure if that would be necessary to do what you've mentioned.

Thanks

No prob,
I wouldn't want to go beyond normal field striping myself either. You might just clean it out with Break Free CLP or something similar. Good Luck & keep us posted

 

[vista461]

The only failure I've had with my 4003 was with WWB.

 

[kf4jzy]

The only failure I've had with my 4003 was with WWB.

I've heard others say the same thing. I am going to stay away from WWB and see what happens.

Thanks

 

[Doug M.]

There have been regular reports of bad QC with WWB. You get what you pay for. On the other hand, at least you get some free malfunction clearance training.

 

[robkarrob]

kf4jzy


I would still think it was ammo related for the FTF and not caused by anything in the striker channel. This can easily be checked as the striker can be easily removed and reinstalled. Watch this video I posted on YouTube, which shows removal and install of the striker: http://youtu.be/6vJQuxBVplY

The offset striker hit on the primer was not a defect in the gun. There is very little clearance between the striker tip (end that contacts the primer) and the firing pin hole in the bolt face, that the tip passes through. The clearance is so little that you could not see the differences by eye.

The offset primer mark was caused by: a not fully seated breech or a slightly out of concentric primer. Another cause of off center hits is called firing pin drag, primer smear, or primer wipe. What this refers to is when the cartridge case begins extracting from the chamber, the barrel drops down but the firing pin tip is still 'inserted' into the primer, which causes the teardrop shape on the primer. This can happen with all locked breech/recoil operated pistols. Not as likely in the M&P line as the tip does not extend very far past the bolt face, but it is still a possibility.

As others have said, I've had FTF with white box with my Rugers. I've been using the cheap Federal Champion ammo from Walmart. I have shot over 1000 rounds of 45, 40, and 9mm without a single FTF, yet. If you can find it in the 100 count boxes, it is about as low priced target ammo as you can find. Low price does not mean low quality. It is good target ammo.

Bob

 

[MichiganScott]

I don't know if it is ammo related or not, but the off center strike was caused by the striker going forward before the barrel was completely into battery.

After verifying the pistol is empty, you can duplicate it by cocking the pistol and pressing backwards on the front of the slide to drop the barrel hood down a bit (maybe about 0.02-0.03") and pulling the trigger. The striker going forward will force the barrel back into battery. If the front is pushed back too much the disconnector prevents the striker from releasing.

The cartridge has to be smaller in diameter than the chamber to feed. It will sit in the bottom of the chamber. That, and the barrel not being fully in battery with the rear pointing downward, is why the oringinal strike was off center and the primer did not ignite.

 

[JFerg]

I can honestly say I've never had an issue with WWB till my M&P. No, it isn't my first striker fired gun, my XD seemed to work fine with em.
I'd stay away from WWB for awhile and see how it does or you can get an extra power striker spring for peace of mind.

 

[kf4jzy]

@robkarrob - Thanks a bunch for that video!! That is something I can do. I watched a video where a guy took apart his slide and it was way beyond anything I am going to try. It's nice to know I don't have to do all that mess just to clean out the striker channel if I want to. Also, thanks for the other information about the off-center hits and the primer wipes.

I think I normally get primer wipes; I usually see a tear-dropped indention on the primer instead of a perfect circle. I always thought that was normal.

@MichiganScott - Thanks for the info!! I will give a try what you mentioned to test the striker causing the barrel to go back into battery. What would cause the barrel to not go fully into battery under normal firing though?

I'm learning a lot on here from you guys...thanks a bunch!

 

[petepeterson]

I posted on your other thread...

A friend of mine has the same issue. Happens about once every 25 rds or so. All types of ammo. It went back to S&W, and they said it was within spec. Did the same thing when it came back. It appears that it goes into battery far enough to allow the pin to come forward, but not far enough to hit the primer with enough force.

 

[kf4jzy]

I posted on your other thread...

A friend of mine has the same issue. Happens about once every 25 rds or so. All types of ammo. It went back to S&W, and they said it was within spec. Did the same thing when it came back. It appears that it goes into battery far enough to allow the pin to come forward, but not far enough to hit the primer with enough force.

That stinks for your friend. Mine is not experiencing that severe of a problem. Besides the user errors, its only did it once out of 425 rounds.

I'm just curious because I'm really starting to get interested in the internal functioning of pistols as well.

 

[konertjm]

The ONLY FTF's I have had with my Shield .40 were WWB bulk (100 rnds).
I switched to Federal bulk (100 rnds), and after approximately 500 rnds have not had a single FTF.
Besides the Federal bulk is $.08 a round cheaper than the WWB bulk at Wally World.

 

[sharpshooterassassin]

In my M&P 9mm Shield, I've shot WWB, Independence, Federal, Blazer, Remington, and Silver Bear. The only problem that I've had is a few FTE from the Bi-Metal casings from the Silver Bear so I now only shoot brass casings and haven't had any other problems whatsoever.

 

[mr2r6]

The only issue I've ever had in my shield with 2000 rounds was WWB. I would say 2-3 failed primers strike per 100 rounds. Ive shot maybe 400 rounds of WWB. The rest have been Federal and Atlanta Arms with no issues what so ever. I quit buying WWB and recently stocked back up with 500 rounds of federal and found a deal on 500 rounds Blazer Brass so we will see how those shoot and how the Shield hold up into 3000 rounds.