"We Have Met the Enemy and He is Us"

vigil617 · Jul 3, 2014

Honestly, sometimes I wonder if we aren't our own worst enemies. I feel sure none of us on this Forum would have done what the CCL holder did in this case, but just seeing what is going on out there makes one wonder about some of the folks with permits....

Guy With Gun Demands To See Permit Of Another Guy With Gun - Police & Fire - Loganville-Grayson, GA Patch

ISCS Yoda · Jul 3, 2014

There are idiots in every crowd. We can sit here all day and argue our own concepts or what the laws do or do not mean, etc., but that's a reasonable thing to do. Pulling a gun in a store for no reason, never mind demanding a CCW, is unreasonable and idiotic. No good can come of it or, as we all like to say, this will end badly. They confiscated the idiot's gun - so it didn't end TOO badly!

***GRJ***

THE PILGRIM · Jul 3, 2014

Standing by for Clarification.
In Georgia, do you need a CCL to legally carry unconcealed?

427mach1 · Jul 3, 2014

THE PILGRIM said:
Standing by for Clarification.
In Georgia, do you need a CCL to legally carry unconcealed?

Yes, you can open carry handguns in Georgia only if you have a concealed permit.

cyphertext · Jul 3, 2014

Good thing one of them was able to stay calm. The article states that no one, including police can request to see a permit... did I read that right?

ETA - I'm guessing that LEO can not stop you and ask for license simply because you are openly carrying, correct?

shawn mccarver · Jul 3, 2014

There are two nitwits here. One is the nitwit who thought he had some right to demand to see the other guy's permit. (The appropriate response is "go jump off a bridge.") The other nitwit is the Police Chief of Valdosta, one Childress, who blamed the incident on the new concealed weapons law. So, instead of blaming the first nitwit, the second nitwit blamed a law written on paper. Now, it is embarrassing enough when a public official blames an inanimate object, but to blame a printed page - this represents exactly what many of us have come to expect from one with years of government training and service.

Shorty 45 MK2 · Jul 3, 2014

Man, never thought that would a reason not to open carry.

Glad the one guy stayed calm kept his head.

snubbyfan · Jul 3, 2014

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hxGgnI6kCrs
I bet he's got one of these;

bhayles · Jul 3, 2014

cyphertext said:
Good thing one of them was able to stay calm. The article states that no one, including police can request to see a permit... did I read that right?

ETA - I'm guessing that LEO can not stop you and ask for license simply because you are openly carrying, correct?

Correct. In Georgia no one...not even law enforcement, can ask to see a permit if you are carrying a gun...open or concealed...unless asking is incidental to questioning the subject for something entirely unrelated.

THE PILGRIM · Jul 3, 2014

427mach1 said:
Yes, you can open carry handguns in Georgia only if you have a concealed permit.

Got it! I thought you Georgia folks were bragging about passing the best Gun laws since sliced bread. You should've passed some laws similar to those we have here.
You only need a concealed hand gun license to carry a loaded concealed weapon.
Open carry is legal statewide with a number of exceptions- schools, courts, liquor selling places, etc. And private establishments with notification signs- Target. Those restrictions apply to open and concealed carry, none LEO.
Vehicles are considered to be an extension of your private residence.
You can carry open, concealed, loaded or unloaded anywhere in your vehicle.

andyo5 · Jul 3, 2014

This is one reason why I do not open carry in public places. Some folks just don't know what to make of a guy carrying a gun. They may assume he is a criminal. Others may scheme to see if they can get their hands on the gun. Others may just be so frightened they will leave the area. I only carry open in places like the woods or in the desert where I will not be in close contact with strangers.
And by the way, pulling a gun and demanding to see someone else's permit is really stupid and is a good way to start an unnecessay gunfight. What a dufus!

Stevens · Jul 3, 2014

Sounds like that guy must have been buying his third sixpack of the day.
Steve W

shouldazagged · Jul 3, 2014

Looks like a case of delusions of law enforcement. Or just idiocy complicated by one hell of a sense of entitlement.

My hat's off to the other guy, who stayed cool and didn't overreact. It could have gone tragically sideways.

Lycan · Jul 3, 2014

There's idiots everywhere.

snubbyfan · Jul 3, 2014

I probably would have said something like, "I'll show you mine, if you show me yours."
I always carry concealed, it just reduces the risk of a hassle.

hatt · Jul 3, 2014

I wonder what forum that guy is on. I can guarantee he's an anti OCer out protecting good folks from those evil doing OCers.

federali · Jul 3, 2014

Unintended Consequences

Even the most well-meaning laws have unintended consequences or the law can be twisted to cover situations not intended by the law's author.

This idiot had no business challenging another CCW. In my life, I've seen hundreds of gun bulges, holster bottoms, guns themselves when winds are present, etc. I was a federal agent, not a cop, and probably all of those exposures were with careless or thoughtless LEOs. Nevertheless, we were instructed not to get involved in local situations except for CRIMES committed in our presence.

Unfortunately, a very small percentage of CCWs are really cop wannabes. These are the types who will eventually get into an unjustified use of force with substantial civil and criminal penalties.

Nope, mankind is far from perfect.

catach22 · Jul 3, 2014

427mach1 said:
Yes, you can open carry handguns in Georgia only if you have a concealed permit.

lets call it what it is.....Georgia does not have a concealed permit.....we have the "Georgia weapons carry license" it does not say how we must carry but that we are licensed to do so........I live georgia and carry every day concealed.... i see guys that open carry it is common where i live, most people never even notice......i choose to conceal and not give up the tactical advantage...... to be honest i am not bothered when i see some one walk in my store with a gun on there hip.....it's been my experience that criminals do not open carry...now about this you can not be asked for your license stuff.... that is true unless they have reasonable suspicion you do not or are conducting an investigation.......sounds like they left some grey area they need to ask if they really want to.....

hotrod150 · Jul 4, 2014

andyo5 said:
This is one reason why I do not open carry in public places. Some folks just don't know what to make of a guy carrying a gun. They may assume he is a criminal. Others may scheme to see if they can get their hands on the gun. Others may just be so frightened they will leave the area. I only carry open in places like the woods or in the desert where I will not be in close contact with strangers. ........

This is my position too. Just because you CAN do something doesn't mean you SHOULD do it. Sometimes the negative aspects outweigh the positive ones.

427mach1 · Jul 4, 2014

catach22 said:
lets call it what it is.....Georgia does not have a concealed permit.....we have the "Georgia weapons carry license"

They may have changed the wording on the current license/permit but mine says GEORGIA FIREARMS LICENSE.

"We Have Met the Enemy and He is Us"

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