"SHALL ISSUE" DEFINITION

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I had a misunderstanding of the definition of a "shall issue" state. Apparently, this term is applied whenever the state requires a license issue after an applicant meets whatever statutory requirements the state chooses. I have had experience with two states in this area. Pennsylvania and SouthCarolina. In Pennsylvania, you go to the county Sherrif's office and fill out a request and pay a fee. The Sherrif runs a background check, and if you pass, issues a license. in South Carolina, you were required to take an eight-hour class, pass a written test, pass a gun handling and shooting test, and then pay a fee and the state would do a background check and issue. I think lumping these two types of states into one category is an effort by sites, like Wikipedia, to show how easy it is to get a CCW permit.
Regardless of how you feel about concealed carry, I think we should be on guard for terms that the anti-gun folk can use to create an impression that lumps states together, without respect to their training and competence requirements to imply "Shall issue" a permit to anybody if they just want to get a permit.
 
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I think sites like Hangunlaw do a reasonable job of classification and they also give each states basic requirements. But, although some states require more training, different ages etc to qualify the main separation between may issue and shall issue is a may issue state requires you to give them a reason a reason for wanting the permit and they they MAY ISSUE, if they feel your need meets their level. A Shall issue state, does not require this and SHALL ISSUE if you meet a level of training or what ever. No NEED level required.

One could say Montana isn't a shall issue state if you nit pick. You have to have a clean record, have a level of training and the sheriff can set that up to a point, but only to a certain degree. Some sheriffs require, either a NRA course, demonstrated handling, hunter safety, military handgun training, a military discharge or some basically nothing. But, I think an NRA handgun course if the max they can ask for. Now of course if you are not a prohibited person and over 18 you do not need a permit, to carry concealed in town. No permit was needed open carry or concealed on your property, in vehicles or out of town.

While I agree with you about some terms the antis will use against us, I think that is near impossible to speak of guns and not have your words twisted. Failure to use the word semi when speaking of self loaded doesn't help because the drop the semi if you do use it. I watched a clip of an anti congressmen and he had everything so screwed up talking about a semi auto that he could have made a bolt action 22 operating like a field howitzer. Actual correct, terminology and language didn't stand in his way of distorting every fact possible. I could have gave a speech about aliens and the psychics of faster than light travel and been much closer to known reality than he was.
 
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In the late 1980s, when Florida passed what I believe is the first "Shall Issue" legislation on carry permits, the law said that once 90 days had passed with out turning up any negative issues, the State SHALL Issue the permit

Obviously with 50 states there will be 49 other definitions of Shall Issue. I have not read your State's statute on this issue
 
"Shall issue" simply means the Sheriff, Police Chief, etc., does not get to add his personal judgment on the worthiness of the person requesting the license nor his individual judgment on whether the person "needs" to carry a firearm.

Once the statutory requirements are met, the Sheriff (etc.) shall issue the license.

I have no issue with the use of the term.
 
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SchemaEnigma said:
"Shall issue" simply means the Sheriff, Police Chief, etc., does not get to add his personal judgment on the worthiness of the person requesting the license nor his individual judgment on whether the person "needs" to carry a firearm.

Once the statutory requirements are met, the Sheriff (etc.) shall issue the license.

I have no issue with the use of the term.
Click to expand...

^^^Well said

Shall Issue and May Issue are good terms to differentiate the overwhelming majority of states that must give you a carry permit if you jump through the statutory hoops from the states where ordinary citizens cannot obtain a permit.

As we speak the May Issue statutory scheme in New York State is being challenged at the United States Supreme Court and we will hopefully have a favorable decision by June 2022.

The fact that over 40 states are No Permit Needed or Shall Issue works in our favor to nudge the Supreme Court into declaring that May Issue violates the Second Amendment.
 
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colt_saa said:
In the late 1980s, when Florida passed what I believe is the first "Shall Issue" legislation on carry permits, the law said that once 90 days had passed with out turning up any negative issues, the State SHALL Issue the permit

Obviously with 50 states there will be 49 other definitions of Shall Issue. I have not read your State's statute on this issue
Click to expand...

An FYI

Actually, there were a few states that had 'shall issue' before Florida. New Hampshire, for one, passed its' law before the First World War; I believe Indiana already had such a law on the books and I know for a fact that Washington did, as I got my first CCW there in 1972.
 
A lot of may issue states are actually shall not issue states. I think Hawaii being the worst of the bunch. Apparently, not one license to carry has ever been issued there.
 
I was always under the impression that "shall issue" meant that the requirements were pretty much written in stone, and if you met those conditions the state will issue you a license or a permit.

With "may issue", there is a certain human factor involved - such as the local sheriff determining what he/she considers "adequately trained" means or "extenuating circumstances" are involved that are not clearly spelled out by the legislature where a permit could either be provided or withheld.

Usually, I am a "black or white" type of mentality where you either meet the qualifications or you don't. However, I'm also aware that in some cases a more human approach is warranted - especially when the rules aren't particularly clear. So either way, according to my wife I'm still wrong... :rolleyes:
 
I lived in Pennsylvania for 13 years. You are correct in that you go to the county sheriff's office and pay a fee, and then they do a background check. If no problem they shall issue. The sheriff has no discretion in the matter., but to take it a step further, the sheriff must issue within a time frame. I believe it is 14 or 19 days, or something like that. So if they drag their feet and do not get the back ground check done, they still must issue the permit. When I went, I got the 5 year permit, and the guy even told me the place around the corner that would laminate it for me.

In Connecticut, you co down to the town hall, and get a permit from the town counsel president on the spot, but it is only good for the town you live in. Then you send a copy to the state police headquarters, and they do a back ground check, and call you and tell you which office to go to and pick it up. No fee. At least that was the way it used to be.

Years ago in Vermont, you could walk into a gun store, buy a gun, load it, stick it in your pants, and walk out the door. The only law read something like" it is against the law to carry a firearm with the intent to do bodily harm to someone". Pretty relaxed
 
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PA is about the easiest to get a permit of those states requiring a permit, even for non residents.

No training, $20 for 5 years.

Two of us went to Scranton years ago and were out in 20 minutes total after providing our NY permits.

The Sheriff even came out of his office and encouraged us to tell everyone to come there.

I let mine lapse.
I don’t need one now as PA recognizes NC.
 
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