WHAT IS THE BEST .22 LR AMMUNITION FOR SELF DEFENSE?

Ultraman · Mar 11, 2009

WHAT IS THE BEST .22 LR AMMUNITION FOR SELF DEFENSE?

For a plethora of reasons which I don't care to debate, I now carry a S&W Model 317
as my Primary Personal Carry Weapon. Fully aware that a .22 LR is not the caliber
or choice for this purpose I at least want to have it loaded with the 8 rounds that will
do the most damage. I have read pro's and con's on hollow point verses round nose.
What I think I want is the heaviest & fastest round nose round available but don't
know what it would be. I would love your input. Please...no flaming me over my personal
decision to carry this weapon / caliber, as I said I have many reasons.

Ultraman · Mar 11, 2009

WHAT IS THE BEST .22 LR AMMUNITION FOR SELF DEFENSE?

For a plethora of reasons which I don't care to debate, I now carry a S&W Model 317
as my Primary Personal Carry Weapon. Fully aware that a .22 LR is not the caliber
or choice for this purpose I at least want to have it loaded with the 8 rounds that will
do the most damage. I have read pro's and con's on hollow point verses round nose.
What I think I want is the heaviest & fastest round nose round available but don't
know what it would be. I would love your input. Please...no flaming me over my personal
decision to carry this weapon / caliber, as I said I have many reasons.

Erich · Mar 11, 2009

I've worked on a number of killings with .22 LR ammo, and a number of shootings that did not result in deaths. Immediate stops are possible, and are attributable to the same things that work with other calibers: shot placement and adequate penetration.

Adequate penetration is a real issue with .22 LRs. I'd go with hi-speed 40-grainers. Chrono a mess through YOUR gun and see what comes out fastest.

Going with lighter weight or hollowpoint bullets seems like an invitation to have even more problems with penetration than a .22 LR has inherent to its slow (particularly out of a handgun), light bullets.

FWIW, I'd use CCI Velocitors - they consistently chrono the fastest average (tho with high deviations) of .22 LRs from handguns for me, and they're 40-grain solids.

Titan · Mar 11, 2009

Jim Scouten on Shooting Gallery recently featured a tour to CCI to analyze various types of .22LR ammo.

As I recall, they rated Velocitors best for penetration, but they also showed a 'Segmented Hollowpoint' that was designed to fragment shortly after impact and, according to the ballistic gelatin tests, would indicate likely extensive damage to small game.

If cold weather and lots of layers of clothing aren't a factor, then the segmented hollowpoint round may be an option to evaluate.

Personally, I use CCI Mini-Mag Hollow points (36 grain) in the Walther P22 that my wife often carries.

The P22 is also fitted with a laser to aid with shot placement. I'd strongly recommend CT grips for your gun, if you can swing the cost.

As Erich pointed out shot placement is key in any shooting situation, but essential with a .22LR

Careby · Mar 11, 2009

I wonder if the 60-grain Aquila SSS might not be a good choice. It hits pretty hard.

Erich · Mar 11, 2009

The SSS 60-grain stuff is great stuff - very accurate and pleasant to shoot, as well as consistent in velocity. Problem is that velocities are really low.

Really low from a short-barreled handgun of the type Ultraman has displayed in his (very nice) photo above.

I'd be concerned that, even with the amazing sectional density these have, they just wouldn't penetrate a skull if needed at the velocities delivered.

Certainly underscores the importance of chrono'ing ammo from your gun.

Erich · Mar 11, 2009

Just as an illustration, here are some velocities I chron'd from a 2 3/4" Beretta 21A last year:

Okay, here are a big bunch of data for different ammos from the 2 3/8" pop-up barrel.

Winchester Super X Super Speed RN 40-gr plated round nose
M 811.3/ES 46.8/SD 20.89

CCI SGB (Small Game Bullet) 40-gr LFP
M 841.2/ES 67.1/SD 22.79

CCI Blazer 40-gr RNL
M 830.1/ES 143.7/SD 51.41

PMC Zapper 40-gr PRNL (red box)
M 797.5/ES 101.2/SD 52.84

PMC Zapper 40-gr PRNL (orange box)
M 847.7/ES 98.76/SD 38.74

CCI Velocitor (new) 40-gr PHP
M 852.2/ES 71.41/SD 28.14

Aguila SSS 60-gr RNL
M 606.0/ES 47.34/SD 21.07

Aguila Super Colibri 20-gr lead truncated cone
M 494.4/ES 19.74/SD 8.18

CCI Stinger 32-gr PHP
M 1004/ES 86.16/SD 38.45

Aguila Interceptor 40-gr PFP
M 931.8/ES 155.2/SD 55.79

CCI Mini-Mag 40-gr PRN
M 879.9/ES 16.60/SD 7.07

Federal Champion bulk 36-gr PHP
M 928.1/ES 105.9/SD 38.96

CCI Mini-Mag 36-gr PHP
M 848.1/ES 71.00/SD 27.87

Aguila .22 Super Extra 40-gr PRN
M 836.1/ES 68.87/SD 29.42

Federal Automatch bulk 40-gr RNL
average 849.3 fps/ES 29.58 fp/SD 11.40

safearm · Mar 11, 2009

+1 on the CCI Velocitors. While not much of an issue in a revolver, the increased energy of this ammunition virtually guarantees cycling of a semi-auto, even if extremely dirty. I use it exclusively in a Browning Buckmark (fitted with a Red Dot sight)and have never had a problem, either with function or accuracy.

crofoot629 · Mar 11, 2009

I’d like a 317, oddly with a lock, for my wife.
I too think I’d choose a 40 grn solid.

Erich, from your data, aren’t the plain old Mini Mags quicker than the Velocitor’s?
(CCI Mini-Mag 40-gr PRN
M 879.9/ES 16.60/SD 7.07)

Emory

Erich · Mar 11, 2009

Crofoot, in THAT gun, yes. As I said, though, one needs to shoot a variety of ammo from one's own specific gun - this is particularly true with .22 LR ammo, I've found.

I've found that Velocitors tend to give the better velocities across the board - I was just giving that suggestion to Ultraman in the event that he didn't have a chrono. Truth is, I carry the Federal Automatch round in the 21A, for a variety of other reasons.

flop-shank · Mar 11, 2009

You will need to do a search, but I tested various .22 lr. from a 2" NAA Black Widow into Perma-Gel. The results are, I think in the the "North American Arms, much meaner than I thought" thread in the CCW forum, or the "Perma-Gel test results" thread in the ammunition forum. IIRC CCI Stingers gave the best performance. As I remember, I got about 13" penetration from the Stingers, with or without heavy clothing.

GatorFarmer · Mar 11, 2009

I used to have one of those 317s as an understudy to the 337 that I had at the time.

I'd look for CCI's "SGB" -small game bullet. Flat point so at least it would cut a nice wound.

I used Quick Shok at the time when I had mine. Might still be worth dutch loading a 1:1 mix of that.

MTKTM · Mar 11, 2009

On the few occasions where I've carried a 22 for defensive purposes I loaded it up with Stingers. That appears to be the fastest load out of a short-barrel according to Erich's chrono figures (thanks for that, Erich!!). I think if I were going to load up a 317 for defense, however, I'd be tempted to alternate Stingers and Aguila SSS in that 10-shot wheel-gun.

The Shottist · Mar 11, 2009

Originally posted by Careby:
I wonder if the 60-grain Aquila SSS might not be a good choice. It hits pretty hard.

I was thinking the same thing. More mass + better sectional density = better terminal performance.

The Shottist · Mar 11, 2009

Originally posted by Erich:
The SSS 60-grain stuff is great stuff - very accurate ... I'd be concerned that, even with the amazing sectional density these have, they just wouldn't penetrate a skull if needed at the velocities delivered.

Do not base your selection of ammo on skull penetration. Human skulls are extremely difficult to penetrate. There are hundreds of documented cases of .45's and 9mm's and.38's hitting the skull and not penetrating it. COM is the place to aim, not between the eyes.

Erich · Mar 11, 2009

Shottist, thanks, but I've worked on now over 200 handgun killings so I have an idea where to put them.

Nothing really vital near the center-of-mass, BTW - I'd advise spending time with Gray's Anatomy and targeting specific anatomical vitals. While you're in there, look at where to shoot the skull to best effect penetration.

kennyb · Mar 11, 2009

several years ago,before i retired,we had a guy here that was in his motel room drinking...he picked up his beretta 22cal.md.21a and shot himself in the head four times...left his room,walked to the 7-11 store and was calmly sipping coffee when finally the clerk took notice of lots of blood....yep,hard head and made a full recovery

Erich · Mar 12, 2009

Evidently not adequate penetration.

I worked peripherally on a case in which a guy shot two guys from a different social club with a 21a. Both DRT, dropped like rocks.

We could do this all day.

You need to hit the vitals to effect a stop with a handgun, which requires shot placement and adequate penetration. Choose your ammo to best be able to get this done, practice, and study up on where you need to shoot. Ultraman specifically requested that we avoid comment on his caliber choice - presumably he's aware of its limitations.

Ultraman · Mar 12, 2009

Yes, I'm very aware. I'm also aware of all the negative opinions about choosing this caliber for self-defense.

However like I said I have many reasons for my choice... many.

I will say that it is for canceled carry and I'm a civilian not a police officer. I don't carry a back up or
speed loaders... I'll shoot-shoot and maybe shoot and try to break contact and get away ASAP!
You won't see me going toe to toe like an officer has too.

Now for my home... I have a S&W
model 65 loaded with .38 +P's.

Thanks everyone for the input thus far! Bill

bummer · Mar 12, 2009

I may be in the minority,but I have never had a full box of 22 rimfire the performed on the 1st try.

WHAT IS THE BEST .22 LR AMMUNITION FOR SELF DEFENSE?

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