Cap and Ball Revolvers

Shaniko Sam · Jul 17, 2015

58 Remington conversion to 45 Schofield

I have a 58 Remington Cattleman's Carbine in .44 C&B. I've been looking for load data for 45 Schofield. I've got new Starline brass, large pistol primers,160gr FP bullets,RCBS 45 dies and intend to use FFFg powder. The closest numbers I can find are for 200gr RN bullets. In C&B I use 30gr FFFg with a 136 gr ball which is a tack driver all day. I have not purchased a conversion cylinder yet. Any help out there? Thanks...

S.B. · Jul 17, 2015

You have to remember originally C&B guns came with a mold that would work with individual guns. Not true today.
Steve

CTI1USNRET · Jul 17, 2015

When using a 45 Colt conversion cylinder put as much FFFg BP behind the 200 gr lead bullet as you want. Slight compression is ok. It will RECOIL! It's a safe load, and good for hunting deer. For plinking, 25 to 30 gr FFFg will be fun.

With smokeless powder, standard loads from reloading manuals are fine. Stay away from the 'Ruger level' loads.

Muley Gil · Jul 17, 2015

Welcome to the Forum, ThunderGuy.

" While they are smooth bore barrels, they are still accurate to modern self-defense distances and beyond."

I've been shooting black powder revolvers for 45 years and have never seen one that was a smoothbore. They have all been rifled, as were the originals.

5906fan · Jul 18, 2015

yeah I've got an ROA and a '58 remmy. lots of fun and I've killed 2 feral swine with 3 shots out of 'em
ground blind near bait. the big 'un took the 2 slugs. had to track it and give it another.
nephew was in the blind w/me with his h&r 20ga mag #2 buck. just in case.
small one we skinned and tossed it on the grate of a split barrel to roast.
big un went to game butcher shop.

BearBio · Jul 18, 2015

Muley Gil said:
Welcome to the Forum, ThunderGuy.

" While they are smooth bore barrels, they are still accurate to modern self-defense distances and beyond."

I've been shooting black powder revolvers for 45 years and have never seen one that was a smoothbore. They have all been rifled, as were the originals.

Except for the LeMats. If you go through Flayderman's, You can probably find anything if you look hard enough.

Alpo · Jul 18, 2015

ThunderGuy said:
It is interesting to note that these guns are generally exempt from FFL requirements - this can be shipped straight to your door, and while it's not the ideal weapon for self--defense, it will do the trick.

Though the sale of these guns is exempt from FFL requirements, you still cannot CCW such a firearm; that would still be a violation of Federal Law unless you have the proper permits for your state.

I agree with a lot of stuff said in this thread, but this statement just blew my mind.

WHAT Federal law covers concealed carry?

Shaniko Sam · Jul 18, 2015

To: CTI1USNRET

Thank you for the info on 45 Schofield. I was estimating 28gr FFFg behind the 160gr FP because I was thinking this would be enough seeing as how pressures might rise in a cartridge case. As soon as I get a cylinder,I'll whip up a few loads and get back to you... Shaniko Sam

boykinlp · Jul 18, 2015

Another thing that I have noticed from researching these is that it must be a requirement that owners have a pickup truck. There is a lot of accessories, some needed, others seem to make things easier. When just looking at the price of the gun, it is not terribly expensive, but when you include the accessories, it starts to add up fast.

What do you use to carry all the "stuff" at the range? A wheelbarrow.

Muley Gil · Jul 19, 2015

BearBio said:
Except for the LeMats. If you go through Flayderman's, You can probably find anything if you look hard enough.

Just the arbor/under 20 gauge barrel. The main barrel is rifled. Originals were .42 caliber. The Navy Arms replicas are .44 caliber.

BB57 · Jul 20, 2015

boykinlp said:
Another thing that I have noticed from researching these is that it must be a requirement that owners have a pickup truck. There is a lot of accessories, some needed, others seem to make things easier. When just looking at the price of the gun, it is not terribly expensive, but when you include the accessories, it starts to add up fast.

What do you use to carry all the "stuff" at the range? A wheelbarrow.:roll eyes:

At a minimum you need:

1. FFFg or an equivalent substitute;

2. Ball or conical projectiles of the appropriate diameter;

3. a powder flask - they have a built in measure based on the length and diameter of the tube, or you can eyeball calibrate the load in a cap and ball revolver based on him much of the chamber you fill.

3. No. 10 or 11 caps; and

4. Some shortening - generic brands work fine.

If you want to get fancy, you can add:

5. An adjustable powder measure (or a flask with a built in adjustable measure);

6. A capper - tool to both hold the caps and place them on the nipples (available in both straight line and snail styles);

7. A small cloth or leather bag to carry balls;

8. Felt wads and/or a made for cap and ball revolver lube, like spit ball; and/or

9. A cylinder loader that allows you to load the cylinder outside the frame of the pistol itself.

With the exception of the cylinder loader (from $24 to $75) none of the tools are particularly expensive and you can get the basics on a starter kit for under $75.

----

As for carrying it all, Tandy leather used to make a nice full grain possibles bag kit that you could assemble with or without a fringe. It works great for both cap and ball revolvers as well as rifles. They still make one in suede leather, which is fun keeping clean - but on the other hand it still sells for about $25.

You can still get a decent full grain leather bag for around $60.

tops · Jul 20, 2015

Pietta .36 reproduction and long knife

BearBio · Jul 20, 2015

I have a dedicated pistol case for my Old Army. Pluck-out foam. Holds pistol, conversion cylinder, tin of balls, couple of tins of caps, Bore Butter, and a tin of Pyrodex pellets. A wooden cleaning kit box/tool box/small tackle box will carry everything.

Muddyboot · Jul 20, 2015

My three angels

Hellraiser · Jul 20, 2015

BearBio said:
I have a dedicated pistol case for my Old Army. Pluck-out foam. Holds pistol, conversion cylinder, tin of balls, couple of tins of caps, Bore Butter, and a tin of Pyrodex pellets. A wooden cleaning kit box/tool box/small tackle box will carry everything.

I got some cased sets...

Two 2nd Generation Colt 1860 Army's... for some reason... my picture was cut-off on the side... includes bullet mold, two tins of caps, some lead balls, and a powder flask...

My cased 2nd Generation Colt 1851 Navy, for the yankee general, a comemorative for General Ulysses S. Grant...

A cased 2nd Generation Colt 1851 Navy for the great commander of the Army of the South, General Robert E. Lee... (It is sittin' beside a bronze statue of Hickok... that is the bronze hand. Also, there is a Confederate $100 bill.)

Wyo · Jul 20, 2015

boykinlp said:
Another thing that I have noticed from researching these is that it must be a requirement that owners have a pickup truck. There is a lot of accessories, some needed, others seem to make things easier. When just looking at the price of the gun, it is not terribly expensive, but when you include the accessories, it starts to add up fast.

What do you use to carry all the "stuff" at the range? A wheelbarrow.

I carry a small powder flask, a tin of caps, and a small leather bag with some balls and wads all together. The whole assembly fits in a coat pocket. You can collect lots of stuff if you want to, but most of it really isn't necessary.

boykinlp · Jul 25, 2015

boykinlp said:
I also saw where alot of people wrote about sales at Cabela's being good. Anybody bought one on sale from Cabela's LATELY? If so, how much was it? Just wondering how good the sale really is and I also wonder how often they go on sale. Right now the Pietta 1860 Army Engraved with extra cylinder is on sale. It is regularly priced at $470 and is on sale for $320.

I just looked at Cabelas again and this Pietta package is now $299.88. I wish they would put the non-engraved one with spare cylinder on this kind of sale.

Maybe they will keep lowering the price on this one and I will change my mind on it.

Erich · Jul 25, 2015

Wait until between Thanksgiving and Christmas. Mine was a bit under $175 delivered (but w/o the spare cylinder). You'll want to do a trigger job (Cumpston and Bates' book on percussion revolvers tells you all you need to know about disassembly) but you'll be surprised at the value.

CTI1USNRET · Jul 25, 2015

Other places to watch for sales:

Black Powder Muzzleloading Revolvers | Shop Muzzleloading Revolvers at Buffalo Arms

Dixie Gun Works muzzleloading, blackpowder and rare antique gun supplies.

boykinlp · Aug 11, 2015

boykinlp said:
I just looked at Cabelas again and this Pietta package is now $299.88. I wish they would put the non-engraved one with spare cylinder on this kind of sale. Maybe they will keep lowering the price on this one and I will change my mind on it.

Well my wish came true.

GatorFarmer alerted me to the Cabelas sale. I have a Pietta 1860 Army with spare cylinder coming my way. Gonna pick up a few accessories today. Seems like Pyrodex "P" powder is readily available. Is it OK?

I have time to do some more studying on them since my shooting partner won't be ready to go for a while. I'll post pictures when I get it.

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