Pisgah
Member
If I am buying, mint is whatever I say it is. If it doesn't meet my standards, I don't buy, no matter how the seller is describing it. You? Decide for yourself.
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What does "mint" actually mean?
- Thread starter lihpster
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rchall
Member
The buyer of on-line guns should look over the pictures carefully and ask for more if not satisfied. It’s a gamble buying online guns, but I have bought a couple nice ones that way. Just beware of sellers who do not specify an inspection and return period if the weapon has been misrepresented. I never had to return one before, but I ask a lot of questions before I make a decision to buy.
robvious
Member
Caveat emptor...
DWalt
Member
In the world of comic books, stamps, baseball cards, and a few other collectibles, there are professional grading organizations which, for a (sometimes substantial) fee, will do an assessment of an item to determine its numerical condition according to widely accepted and very precise grading standards, for example, if a baseball card is printed slightly off center or there is slight damage to one corner of the card, its condition rating will be quantitatively decreased. So far as I know, there are no professional gun grading organizations which perform a similar function for firearms. Maybe there is a market for one.
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Arisin Wind
Member
According to the NRA "Mint" is not a firearms grading term.
NRA Conditions Grading Standards | armsbid.com
NRA Modern Gun Condition Standards
NEW: Not previously sold at retail, in same condition as current factory production.
PERFECT: In New condition in every respect. (Many collectors & dealers use "As New" to describe this condition).
EXCELLENT: New condition, used but little, no noticeable marring of wood or metal, bluing perfect, (except at muzzle or sharp edges).
VERY GOOD: In perfect working condition, no appreciable wear on working surfaces, no corrosion or pitting, only minor surface dents or scratches.
GOOD: In safe working condition, minor wear on working surfaces, no broken parts, no corrosion or pitting that will interfere with proper functioning.
FAIR: In safe working condition but well worn, perhaps requiring replacement of minor parts or adjustments which should be indicated in advertisement, no rust, but may have corrosion pits which do not render article unsafe or inoperable.
NRA Conditions Grading Standards | armsbid.com
NRA Modern Gun Condition Standards
NEW: Not previously sold at retail, in same condition as current factory production.
PERFECT: In New condition in every respect. (Many collectors & dealers use "As New" to describe this condition).
EXCELLENT: New condition, used but little, no noticeable marring of wood or metal, bluing perfect, (except at muzzle or sharp edges).
VERY GOOD: In perfect working condition, no appreciable wear on working surfaces, no corrosion or pitting, only minor surface dents or scratches.
GOOD: In safe working condition, minor wear on working surfaces, no broken parts, no corrosion or pitting that will interfere with proper functioning.
FAIR: In safe working condition but well worn, perhaps requiring replacement of minor parts or adjustments which should be indicated in advertisement, no rust, but may have corrosion pits which do not render article unsafe or inoperable.
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Had to dig this out, IIRC from the early 90’s.
Outside of the gun world that's what it meant for a long time. There can be an unfired gun that was not finished very good from the factory that I wouldn't call a mint example of that model.
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Baltimoreed11754
Member
I can’t afford ‘mint’ guns so I’ve always looked for what i call honest guns. Guns that are not neglected, abused or refinished but show their age through the patina of the blueing and wood. Nice shooters I guess.
lihpster,
Not meaning any disrespect to your friend
What any description of the item means to the buyer is total irrelevant.
All that matters is what those terms mean to the seller, you know the guy that used the word to describe the product.
As the buyer, I always send a message to the seller saying something like . . . . You called the item ???? are you telling me that this item has never been fired since leaving the factory and the finish is without blemish, it belonged to the King? Or whatever information is being conveyed
That lets the seller refine their description
To ME, there is no such thing as NIB if it is being sold 2nd hand. NEW only occurs once and only from the retailer to the original buyer
An item that is EXACTLY like a New item from the retailer but 2nd hand is LNIB
I am real picky about those two. Yet we all have seen the add . . . LNIB Model 27 only fired 100 rounds of 38 Special. . . . To me that could not possibly be better than Excellent + condition. After all it has been fired since leaving the factory
Likewise something that is NIB from the dealer is not necessarily cosmetically perfect. It is simply the first sale at retail. A description of cosmetic condition must also be included
Mint, to me Mint is what you have after your meal, it is not a description of s firearm's condition and I would ask for clarification of what the seller meant by Mint
The one absolute fact about buying 2nd hand firearms is that seldom will the buyer and seller describe the item in the same fashion
If you have made a purchase and are displeased with the item as described by the seller, then you need to not fill out the 4473 and should be returning the item to the seller.
If you have signed the 4473, then you have accepted the item and it's description
If this story is about an auction house or online auction member and their descriptions, then that Auction House' or Member's Name NEEDS to be made public so that the rest of your Forum Brothers and Sisters can interact with them appropriately as we all move forward.
If you are purchasing a GRAIL Gun without having it in your hand, the terms of the deal MUST include what happens if the firearm arrives and it is not in the described condition.
Buyers are going to be much more picky about inspecting their newly acquired Grail Gun than they will be about the Glock they just bought to keep in the glove box/tool box/tackle box
Not meaning any disrespect to your friend
What any description of the item means to the buyer is total irrelevant.
All that matters is what those terms mean to the seller, you know the guy that used the word to describe the product.
As the buyer, I always send a message to the seller saying something like . . . . You called the item ???? are you telling me that this item has never been fired since leaving the factory and the finish is without blemish, it belonged to the King? Or whatever information is being conveyed
That lets the seller refine their description
To ME, there is no such thing as NIB if it is being sold 2nd hand. NEW only occurs once and only from the retailer to the original buyer
An item that is EXACTLY like a New item from the retailer but 2nd hand is LNIB
I am real picky about those two. Yet we all have seen the add . . . LNIB Model 27 only fired 100 rounds of 38 Special. . . . To me that could not possibly be better than Excellent + condition. After all it has been fired since leaving the factory
Likewise something that is NIB from the dealer is not necessarily cosmetically perfect. It is simply the first sale at retail. A description of cosmetic condition must also be included
Mint, to me Mint is what you have after your meal, it is not a description of s firearm's condition and I would ask for clarification of what the seller meant by Mint
The one absolute fact about buying 2nd hand firearms is that seldom will the buyer and seller describe the item in the same fashion
If you have made a purchase and are displeased with the item as described by the seller, then you need to not fill out the 4473 and should be returning the item to the seller.
If you have signed the 4473, then you have accepted the item and it's description
If this story is about an auction house or online auction member and their descriptions, then that Auction House' or Member's Name NEEDS to be made public so that the rest of your Forum Brothers and Sisters can interact with them appropriately as we all move forward.
If you are purchasing a GRAIL Gun without having it in your hand, the terms of the deal MUST include what happens if the firearm arrives and it is not in the described condition.
Buyers are going to be much more picky about inspecting their newly acquired Grail Gun than they will be about the Glock they just bought to keep in the glove box/tool box/tackle box
DWalt
Member
In order to assess condition, the rating factors must be standardized, uniform, precise, and unambiguous. I don't think gun condition rating has reached that point, and may never.
Remember the older gun price guides which used to have color pictures of guns in various conditions in the front illustrating how they should be rated. That never helped me very much.
Remember the older gun price guides which used to have color pictures of guns in various conditions in the front illustrating how they should be rated. That never helped me very much.
Jack Flash
SWCA Member
The people who say "It means this to me" are falling into a trap set by the seller, who will always say after the sale "Oh no, that's not what it means to me!" That's why they will not use the NRA grading terms, because those are defined.
Mint means like new, not new or unfired. All single-word descriptions are wide open to interpretation. Seller and buyer opinions also vary widely.
Mint condition Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster.
Mint condition Definition & Meaning - Merriam-Webster.
And the question is really it they are defined by an enthusiastic seller or by the extremely critical buyer?
HOUSTON RICK
Member
Spanking brand new, mark free and CLEAN.
THE PILGRIM
Member
I’m holding a 2022 Canadian Maple Leaf.
Using my recently cataract corrected eyes with no additional magnification,
I’m not seeing any marks or dings.
It could be ‘Mint’.
But it’s not a Proof coin.
A magnified inspection by a coin expert would probably disclose flaws.
So I’ll back off to - its Uncirculated!
Using my recently cataract corrected eyes with no additional magnification,
I’m not seeing any marks or dings.
It could be ‘Mint’.
But it’s not a Proof coin.
A magnified inspection by a coin expert would probably disclose flaws.
So I’ll back off to - its Uncirculated!
DWalt
Member
Uncirculated generally means that it is a coin that was shipped from the mint but was never placed into circulation for some reason after it reached its destination. However, if it was placed in to circulation, say from a bank (assuming you know that), technically it cannot be called uncirculated. At one time, and maybe still, the U. S. Mints shipped out bags of loose coins. During shipment coins often got what are called bag marks (small surface scratches and dents) due to rough handling causing the coins to be jostled around. At one time, and maybe still, the U. S. Mint would sell sets of uncirculated coins in cellophane packaging to collectors. Those are actually different from proof sets, as no special care was taken during their manufacture to produce a flawless surface.
Mint or Minty, as in unfired and perfect in every way or possibly a lightly used gem, was 180 degrees opposite of what I received not long ago.
Maybe that worn out Pony, after eating a freight car load of ammo and oats, had an after dinner mint prior to trotting over to the post office, and that was why it was advertised as Minty?.
Maybe that worn out Pony, after eating a freight car load of ammo and oats, had an after dinner mint prior to trotting over to the post office, and that was why it was advertised as Minty?.
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pantannojack
US Veteran
I thought Certs was a candy mint. My wife says Certs is a breath mint. She still does not know I break wind sometimes.
YeshuaIsa53
SWCA Member
I might add, if there were only three, or every other cylinder, slight burn rings
it could be a gem.
it could be a gem.
If it was on GB this would not surprise me. GB is the home to the world’s most generous thesaurus.
How many times have we all seen a relatively high demand Smith (19, 27, 28…..) listed as rare despite the fact there are 10-40 just like it listed at the same time. Mint condition could describe factory original, never been cycled with zero detractions in the finish, OR, it could mean the condition of mint in a field or recently harvested mint or they were chewing mint gun when they rated the condition and all are applicable because nobody will enforce honesty in the descriptions.
We allow politicians of every stripe and side of the aisle to lie and just accept it is normal behavior from that segment of society. Apparently the on line sellers have been paying attention.
How many times have we all seen a relatively high demand Smith (19, 27, 28…..) listed as rare despite the fact there are 10-40 just like it listed at the same time. Mint condition could describe factory original, never been cycled with zero detractions in the finish, OR, it could mean the condition of mint in a field or recently harvested mint or they were chewing mint gun when they rated the condition and all are applicable because nobody will enforce honesty in the descriptions.
We allow politicians of every stripe and side of the aisle to lie and just accept it is normal behavior from that segment of society. Apparently the on line sellers have been paying attention.
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