Wife's military brother dogged my AR Sport

[jgos929]

He basically said it was **** pretty much. He was in town for the weekend, he had a break from some special weapons school he's in for the military. He's in training to become an instructor to teach "special weapons tactics" to other servicemen. He's done two tours in Iraq etc etc. Basically he knows his stuff when it comes to the AR and plenty of other firearms. But IMO since he's military and only used Mil-Spec weapons he's of the belief if it doesn't cost $1500+ it's junk.

I have a quad rail with a bipod & foregrip on it. The bipod is primarily there because the range I go to doesn't have sand bags. I also have an NcStar Mark III scope. Anyways as soon as I pull it out he goes "woah!!! you got a lot going on there". Instantly I knew it was only gonna get worse. He said he's never seen a 1:8 barrel twist before and if it isn't 1:7 or 1:9 it's probably no good. My response was I look at it like I have the best of both worlds since mine was between the two

He then commented on the no forward assist or dust cover. My response to that was I didn't feel I needed them as my intentions for the weapon didn't warrant me spending extra money on a gun with a FA and dust cover. He then laughed and responded with the FA and DC were put on the rifle because someones life was lost in battle because the earlier versions didn't have them. After that he handed it back to me and said he wouldn't bet his life on that gun.

So I took my AR back and proceeded to leave about an hour later for my scheduled range trip where I went about my business putting 150 problem free rounds down range and loving every second of it.

 

[MPDC]

Man, he'd really hate my 10/22!

 

[Smith357]

But IMO since he's military and only used Mil-Spec weapons he's of the belief if it doesn't cost $1500+ it's junk.

A $1200 Milspec Colt is not junk, Neither is the S&W it is mil-spec save the the FA and dust cover. I hope he's not the guy buying $800 hammers.

He then laughed and responded with the FA and DC were put on the rifle because someones life was lost in battle because the earlier versions didn't have them. After that he handed it back to me and said he wouldn't bet his life on that gun.

The FA was put on the rifle because some bean counters decided to use cheap powder that fouled up the rifle in combat back in the 60s, that issue has long been fixed. Any "Instructor" worth his salt would know that. A good instructor also would know never bet his life on a system, but on his training.

 

[jsimmons]

He basically said it was **** pretty much. He was in town for the weekend, he had a break from some special weapons school he's in for the military. He's in training to become an instructor to teach "special weapons tactics" to other servicemen. He's done two tours in Iraq etc etc. Basically he knows his stuff when it comes to the AR and plenty of other firearms. But IMO since he's military and only used Mil-Spec weapons he's of the belief if it doesn't cost $1500+ it's junk.

I have a quad rail with a bipod & foregrip on it. The bipod is primarily there because the range I go to doesn't have sand bags. I also have an NcStar Mark III scope. Anyways as soon as I pull it out he goes "woah!!! you got a lot going on there". Instantly I knew it was only gonna get worse. He said he's never seen a 1:8 barrel twist before and if it isn't 1:7 or 1:9 it's probably no good. My response was I look at it like I have the best of both worlds since mine was between the two

He then commented on the no forward assist or dust cover. My response to that was I didn't feel I needed them as my intentions for the weapon didn't warrant me spending extra money on a gun with a FA and dust cover. He then laughed and responded with the FA and DC were put on the rifle because someones life was lost in battle because the earlier versions didn't have them. After that he handed it back to me and said he wouldn't bet his life on that gun.

So I took my AR back and proceeded to leave about an hour later for my scheduled range trip where I went about my business putting 150 problem free rounds down range and loving every second of it.

The Sport isn't intended to be a combat weapon (a fact with which you agree). It's similar to a combat weapon aimed at the civilian first-time AR buyer, and as a marketing decision, S&W pretty much nailed it. For the range, varminting, and tactical carbine matches, it'll do fine.

 

[Splittiebus66]

Wouldnt bet his life where? In sustained combat with a real enemy? I wouldnt want an M&P 15 sport either. I seriously freakin hope some of my Tax money goes to outfitting those brave Mofos who wear ACUs some serious hardware with 180 degree safeties.

Here as a civilian in PA far from the real battles though I'll bet my life on it. I'm going to be outgunning pretty much any thug that wants to try to take whats mine. I only need it to go off 3 or 4 times max. What crackhead can afford to kick down my door with a Daniel Defense? LOL

If it makes you feel better buy a $100 upper receiver with the F/A and D/C and swap it out. Next time you see him tell him under his advisment you traded the Sport for the $2300 BillyButtKicker model.........

 

[jgos929]

I hope he's not the guy buying $800 hammers.

Yes he's that guy

The Sport isn't intended to be a combat weapon (a fact with which you agree). It's similar to a combat weapon aimed at the civilian first-time AR buyer, and as a marketing decision, S&W pretty much nailed it. For the range, varminting, and tactical carbine matches, it'll do fine.

I completely agree and was the point I was trying to make with him.

Wouldnt bet his life where? In sustained combat with a real enemy? I wouldnt want an M&P 15 sport either. I seriously freakin hope some of my Tax money goes to outfitting those brave Mofos who wear ACUs some serious hardware with 180 degree safeties.

Here as a civilian in PA far from the real battles though I'll bet my life on it. I'm going to be outgunning pretty much any thug that wants to try to take whats mine. I only need it to go off 3 or 4 times max. What crackhead can afford to kick down my door with a Daniel Defense? LOL

If it makes you feel better buy a $100 upper receiver with the F/A and D/C and swap it out. Next time you see him tell him under his advisment you traded the Sport for the $2300 BillyButtKicker model.........

I agree in battle I would probably want something better than the Sport but the point of the story is he couldn't seem to realize where I and you guys are coming from when we made the decision to purchase the Sport.

But hey what can you do. The guy has only dealt with Military issue his entire career so I guess it's hard to convince them there are good economical civilian rifles out there.

He nearly passed out when I told him I wanted to pass down my Marlin model 75 .22 down to my son. He said it wasn't practical and I should get a Ruger 10/22 so I could get high capacity clips for it. My son is almost 2 he's not ready to shoot quite yet but even at say 4yrs+ how is a Marlin .22 not a practical rifle for a little kid. The more and more I think about it I'm starting to get a little offended by his comments now.

Anyways thanks for the comments guys

 

[Jayhawkhuntclub]

How much time did he spend shooting and evaluating the Sport?


The guy sounds like he takes himself too seriously. And that's the nice way to put it. The world is full of idiots. BTW, my experience has found brother in laws to sometimes dislike each other and act accordingly. I wouldn't take the clown too seriously.

The bottom line is if this clown had any maturity or class he would have just said, "Yeah that's nice. How's it shoot?" And then kept his critic to himself. He sounds like a typical hater.

 

[oneyeopn]

Your BIL must be in the Army...he is a moron!! He has no business teaching anyone anything. He doesnt know the history of the AR, you didnt happen to tell him that the barrel is a gain (progressive) twist, I have a nephew that teaches those guys and develops tactics and weapons, he has done 4 tours and his job doesnt require saluting or uniforms, he talks about the people that they send him. Something about not being smart enough to pour water out of a combat boot. He Has an M&P15 OR & a Sport, he does say he wouldnt take the sport down range but it is a far better weapon than what he gets from an army armory. He does prefer his OR to whatever they issue him. Yeah it doesnt have Full Auto or 3 round burst, it is still an outstanding weapon, send me his name in a Private Message and I can reach out and touch him from the forum, and not in a way he will like....I REALLY DISLIKE GUN SNOBS!!!!! Oh and the marlin 75 will outshoot a 10-22 anyday of the week, I can outshoot even the best upgraded 10-22's with my Marlin 60 tube feed with some reloading hoses that I make to reload faster.

Ok maybe I got a little overboard there but I really do dislike gun snobs......

 

[Capt Crunch]

There are plenty of ex and current mil/LEO that own M&P sports that would disagree with him. I've read their comments here, other forums and seen them on Youtube.

 

[wihunter]

I guess if it's not made by the lowest bidder it's junk. He must think the $3000 Wilson AR's are real junk LOL

 

[long colt frazier]

And you can't fix stupid

 

[JaPes]

As a 15-Sport owner, I have an observation based upon experiences at other forums.

While it is vexing that the 15-Sport is derided on many forums, in my opinion the often times heated (yet rational) contrasting position presented by 15-Sport owners can be misconstrued as being overly defensive reaction that indicates purchase regret denial.

In more succinct terms, we get butt hurt because other people don't share our opinion & experience. We then recreprocate in kind. It's human nature to want our viewpoint to be accepted by others.

Frankly, I could care less what some anonymous internet forum screen name thinks about my choice.

I evaluated my options, made my choice, and paid my hard earned money for a 15-Sport. My first hand experience with the 15-Sport is all I need to shrug off the "haters", "gun snobs", "Internet commandos" and the like.

I am 100% confident that my 15-Sport will perform when I need it to: from range use to the highly improbable "Red Dawn" type scenario.

Anyone who disagrees with my opinion is entitled to disagree. As far as I'm concerned, they can take a knee, pucker up, and kiss my wookie-esque tuckus.

 

[rojodiablo]

Just remind him that the KAC Mk 11 rifle that HE is using has no FA on it.


Maybe start by wooing him in with the talk of how bad- nassty it is, how much you admire it. Once he takes the bait, hook his lip and reel him in.

 

[Hobie1]

I'm even more happy

I didn't even read all the posts above and I'm absolutely pleased that I bought my Sport(er).
What a great first AR to own.
Am I going to drag it through the poo?No. Am I going to need a F/A to chamber a shioty round? No. What is has done for me is to get me interested in a new realm of shooting.
I really get annoyed reading all the "if you don't have this,your gun is junk" threads. Good grief, there's so many variations how in the hell can you know what's "best"??
Carry on you poor souls. I know that when you put your head down tonight, you'll still be right.
Hobie...out

 

[Splittiebus66]

As a 15-Sport owner, I have an
In more succinct terms, we get butt hurt because other people don't share our opinion & experience. We then recreprocate in kind. It's human nature to want our viewpoint to be accepted by others.

Frankly, I could care less what some anonymous internet forum screen name thinks about my choice.

I evaluated my options, made my choice, and paid my hard earned money for a 15-Sport. My first hand experience with the 15-Sport is all I need to shrug off the "haters", "gun snobs", "Internet commandos" and the like.

I am 100% confident that my 15-Sport will perform when I need it to: from range use to the highly improbable "Red Dawn" type scenario.

Anyone who disagrees with my opinion is entitled to disagree. As far as I'm concerned, they can take a knee, pucker up, and kiss my wookie-esque tuckus.

JaPes is like somekind of BBS yoda. ^^^^ this

 

[JaPes]

JaPes is like somekind of BBS yoda. ^^^^ this

Yoda's tuckus is less Wookie & more California raisin.

 

[TangoFoxtrot]

jgos929, No disrepect here to you or your brother-in-law, but after his statements he needs to find another profession. I spent 22 years in the military training some spec-op soldiers and I'm just floored with his statements. You can function and kill with any AR platform, if trained properly. DC and FA don't matter.

 

[oneyeopn]

As a 15-Sport owner, I have an observation based upon experiences at other forums.

While it is vexing that the 15-Sport is derided on many forums, in my opinion the often times heated (yet rational) contrasting position presented by 15-Sport owners can be misconstrued as being overly defensive reaction that indicates purchase regret denial.

In more succinct terms, we get butt hurt because other people don't share our opinion & experience. We then recreprocate in kind. It's human nature to want our viewpoint to be accepted by others.

Frankly, I could care less what some anonymous internet forum screen name thinks about my choice.

I evaluated my options, made my choice, and paid my hard earned money for a 15-Sport. My first hand experience with the 15-Sport is all I need to shrug off the "haters", "gun snobs", "Internet commandos" and the like.

I am 100% confident that my 15-Sport will perform when I need it to: from range use to the highly improbable "Red Dawn" type scenario.

Anyone who disagrees with my opinion is entitled to disagree. As far as I'm concerned, they can take a knee, pucker up, and kiss my wookie-esque tuckus.

You always seem to make me rethink my kneejerk reactions, thanks for the sanity you bring to me, cause I do go to extremes at times

 

[cyphertext]

You always seem to make me rethink my kneejerk reactions, thanks for the sanity you bring to me, cause I do go to extremes at times

You are a Marine, you don't know anything other than extremes, and we thank you for that and your service!

 

[SSgt M]

What's funny is the last stock listed order I placed on 60 M-4s was only 480 government dollars per unit. That was 4 or so yrs ago. Not sure how that is when a screw is 18$

The dust cover down range is a joke.
While on post, your weapon must be clear dust cover closed. Which leaves the 3x1 magazine well wide open. Also we were taught in a malfunction, slap n rack to clear the last round. I've never seen anyone push an FA. However all services incorporate there own doctorin.