I'm pretty new to revolvers, and am loving getting to know these great firearms. I'm trying to do some research on a .38 that my grandfather had. I called the S&W Customer support and was told this is a 1952 Pre-model 38. I know that the "pre" models are often modern names for guns that were called by another name "back in the day." If anyone can help me out with any further information on this revolver it would be greatly appreciated. It's a 5 shot, round grips, 2.5 in. barrel, nickel finish (or was...it's pretty worse for the wear). Thanks so much!
Pre Model 38?
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Ed45
SWCA Member, Absent Comrade
Serial number?
Jim Watson
Member
If the Digital Age clerk called it a Pre-Model 38 then it is really a Bodyguard Airweight.
Kind of a humpback appearance with all but the very tip of the hammer spur shrouded in, right?
Mine is a handy little thing, a good coat or cargo pocket pistol.
Kind of a humpback appearance with all but the very tip of the hammer spur shrouded in, right?
Mine is a handy little thing, a good coat or cargo pocket pistol.
Agree with you 100%. Mine is my summer "shorts and t-shirt" carry gun.
Eff868, if you decide to shoot it do NOT run +P or +P+ ammo through it. It is a lightweight frame and is not designed for souped up ammo.
Engine49guy
Member
Hello and welcome to the forum,
First, We love pictures and would love to see your early Bodyguard Pre Model 38.
The factory may have made a mistake if they told your your gun was made in 1952 ,
According to the Standard Catalog of S&W, the "Bodyguard Airweight" wasnt produced until 1955.
If you post the serial we can estimate its approximate DOB.
The "Pre" model 38 is unusual because it came out Prior to the all steel version ,
The all steel Model 49 was introduced 4 years later in 1959.
The stainless steel Model 649 was introduced in 1985.
The Model 38 is one of my favorite concealed carry weapons (CCW) because of its shrouded hammer
which helps prevent snagging when drawn.
I pasted some Humpback "Bodyguards" below for comparison.
Yours probably has the Flat style latch like the 2nd from the left,
(L to R) they are Models 49, (early) Model 38 blue, (later) Model 38 Nickel and Model 649 in stainless steel.
The current production S&W Model 638 Bodyguard Airweight has an internal lock and cast MIM hammer and trigger,
as well as some other changes and looks like this , (minus the CTC laser grips)
First, We love pictures and would love to see your early Bodyguard Pre Model 38.
The factory may have made a mistake if they told your your gun was made in 1952 ,
According to the Standard Catalog of S&W, the "Bodyguard Airweight" wasnt produced until 1955.
If you post the serial we can estimate its approximate DOB.
The "Pre" model 38 is unusual because it came out Prior to the all steel version ,
The all steel Model 49 was introduced 4 years later in 1959.
The stainless steel Model 649 was introduced in 1985.
The Model 38 is one of my favorite concealed carry weapons (CCW) because of its shrouded hammer
which helps prevent snagging when drawn.
I pasted some Humpback "Bodyguards" below for comparison.
Yours probably has the Flat style latch like the 2nd from the left,
(L to R) they are Models 49, (early) Model 38 blue, (later) Model 38 Nickel and Model 649 in stainless steel.
The current production S&W Model 638 Bodyguard Airweight has an internal lock and cast MIM hammer and trigger,
as well as some other changes and looks like this , (minus the CTC laser grips)
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Wow! Thank you all for the great info!!! As I said before, I'm loving learning all of this new knowledge. I thought the serial number was a bit unusual, but was the only number I found and was engraved under the grip. It is 133XX (no letters). Engine49guy, thanks to your detailed post and pictures, I am about 100% sure I was misinformed about what I have. What I have looks nothing like the Bodyguard Airweight. Unfortunately, I am out of town right now and won't be able to post a picture until at least tomorrow night, but as soon as I can get my hands on it I will definately put one up.
Also, as I said in my first post, the revolver is in pretty rough shape. From what I understand it has gone through several owners before my grandfather had it. It really needs to be broken down and cleaned inside and out. I found a resource that walked me through doing this with a 1980 model 10-7, but this revolver, I guess being as old as it is, doesn't have screws to disassemble it. Can anyone point me in a direction other than a gunsmith to help with this task? Thanks again for all the educating posts!
Also, as I said in my first post, the revolver is in pretty rough shape. From what I understand it has gone through several owners before my grandfather had it. It really needs to be broken down and cleaned inside and out. I found a resource that walked me through doing this with a 1980 model 10-7, but this revolver, I guess being as old as it is, doesn't have screws to disassemble it. Can anyone point me in a direction other than a gunsmith to help with this task? Thanks again for all the educating posts!
Jim Watson
Member
Forget all of the above.
You gave a Harrington and Richardson serial number to a Smith & Wesson employee.
I think you have a H&R Victor, made from 1910 - 1932 at the low end of even the H&R model lineup.
The only thing about it connected with Smith & Wesson is the caliber, .38 S&W.
You gave a Harrington and Richardson serial number to a Smith & Wesson employee.
I think you have a H&R Victor, made from 1910 - 1932 at the low end of even the H&R model lineup.
The only thing about it connected with Smith & Wesson is the caliber, .38 S&W.
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Malysh
Member
I knew something else was wrong when the S&W person told you you had a 1952 pre Bodyguard. Bodyguard Airweights (Mod 38 after 1957) weren't made until 1955. In 1959 the steel version, the Mod 49 started production.
Although you had the wrong brand of revolver it appears the employee doesn't know Bodyguard Airweights weren't made in 1952. I'd say you and he (or her) are even.
Although you had the wrong brand of revolver it appears the employee doesn't know Bodyguard Airweights weren't made in 1952. I'd say you and he (or her) are even.
I have a Model 649 stainless purchased used from a FBI agent in @1987. Serial number is 1587x. On the barrel's right side is stamped .38 S&W SPL.
So, my question is that my 649 being a stainless steel frame is it still considered an Airweight, which I assumed were only aluminum frames, and if mine is not an Airweight can it handle then +P .38 ammo?
I just purchased a Model 686+ (7 round) revolver, which takes both .357 Mag and .38spl +P and would like to limit my .38 ammo to just one type, but the more powerful load, if I can for both revolvers.
Thanks in advance for any feedback.
Russ311, welcome to the forum.
The stainless airweight version would be a model 638, so if yours is stamped MOD 649, it is the full-weight gun, not the airweight version.
I'm not sure about the serial number you report. The 649 was introduced in 1985, and they should all have serial numbers on the XYZ0123 pattern -- three alphabetic characters followed by four numerals.
I believe the 649 was intended from the outset to take +P ammunition, but I also think that is indicated on the revolver. If your barrel says simply ".38 S&W SPL", I'm not sure what is going on. Perhaps others here who know the early models of the 649 will be able to address the question. (I have a later Model 649-5, but the dimensions and specs are slightly different from the earliest 649s in order to accommodate the .357 Magnum cartridge.)
Twice in the last month friends asked about their S&W revolvers only to find H&R's in 38 S&W caliber. I hate to be the one to burst the bubble.
DCWilson,
Thanks very much for the reply.
Here is some verification of what I have. It is stamped Mod 649 inside the frame under the cylinder spindle:
photo 1
Under that stamped on the cylinder pivot is (I assume it to be) the serial number (?) 1587X and under that looks to be stamped in larger type a side-ways "S" followed by a 24.
photo 2 of serial number (?) (poor photography)
photo 3 of the Barrel caliber stamp
and left side of revolver showing the S&W Trade Mark stamp as well as name on barrel as well as right side photo.
Does this photo info lead you to any other thoughts?
Thanks very much again to both you and Retired W4,
Russ
Thanks very much for the reply.
Here is some verification of what I have. It is stamped Mod 649 inside the frame under the cylinder spindle:
photo 1
Under that stamped on the cylinder pivot is (I assume it to be) the serial number (?) 1587X and under that looks to be stamped in larger type a side-ways "S" followed by a 24.
photo 2 of serial number (?) (poor photography)
photo 3 of the Barrel caliber stamp
and left side of revolver showing the S&W Trade Mark stamp as well as name on barrel as well as right side photo.
Does this photo info lead you to any other thoughts?
Thanks very much again to both you and Retired W4,
Russ
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That would be a burst.
I believe the H&R model 649 was a .22 LR & .22 WMR six shot, double or single action revolver. Mine is definitely a .38 five shot. Although, I wish it were also a .357 Magnum.
Thanks for the reply.
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Pre-38 is Bodyguard Airweight, and Pre-49 is Bodyguard. The barrel length is called 2 inch, but probably actually measures at 1 7/8 inch. Barrel length is measured from the face of the cylinder to the muzzle (dangerous) end.
Russ, that's definitely an early Model 649 that would date between 1985 (when the model was introduced) and 1988 (when the Model 649-1, with some minor engineering changes, replaced it). There was subsequently a Model 649-2 and then eventualluy the 649-3, which utilized what is called the J-Magnum frame and chambered the .357 Magnum round in a gun that had a slightly longer cylinder and slightly longer barrel.
The numbers you see on the yoke are assembly numbers, not the serial number. If you pull the stocks, you should see on the butt a seven-character alphanumeric number as I described above. For a gun of your vintage, the serial number should probably begin with an alphabetic sequence beginning AH through AW.
Looks like I was wrong about the earliest 649s being rated for .38 Special +P; unless I am reading incorrect info, it looks as though the earliest +P-certified J-frames were produced shortly after 1990. I doubt your gun would come apart if you shot occasional +P rounds in it, but S&W would tell you to restrict yourself to standard .38 Special ammunition (some of which can get pretty hot, of course, without being classified as +P).
Nice specimen. Not everybody likes the humpback profile on these guns and some L-frame DA-only revolvers, but I do.
The numbers you see on the yoke are assembly numbers, not the serial number. If you pull the stocks, you should see on the butt a seven-character alphanumeric number as I described above. For a gun of your vintage, the serial number should probably begin with an alphabetic sequence beginning AH through AW.
Looks like I was wrong about the earliest 649s being rated for .38 Special +P; unless I am reading incorrect info, it looks as though the earliest +P-certified J-frames were produced shortly after 1990. I doubt your gun would come apart if you shot occasional +P rounds in it, but S&W would tell you to restrict yourself to standard .38 Special ammunition (some of which can get pretty hot, of course, without being classified as +P).
Nice specimen. Not everybody likes the humpback profile on these guns and some L-frame DA-only revolvers, but I do.
05CarbonDRZ
Member
Correction:There is no pre model 49,The model 49 came out in 1959 after they started the number stamping.The pre 38 is unique in that it was released as an Airweight first before the steel frame version(49).
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Great info, David. Really appreciate the input. Fortunately, I restocked a few hundred rounds of .38spl that is NOT +P last month before my dealer got ahold of the 4" Model 686P I've been hankering for. He got a few in on Monday and I snagged one right away when he called me. So, I will stick with the non +P for both models as well as the supply of .357 ammo I ordered today for the new revolver.
I have always greatly enjoyed this 649. I do not shoot it often, but it came in handy with some shot shells while out in the woods against a couple of aggressive snakes in the grass years ago.
I have always greatly enjoyed this 649. I do not shoot it often, but it came in handy with some shot shells while out in the woods against a couple of aggressive snakes in the grass years ago.
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That would be a burst.
I believe the H&R model 649 was a .22 LR & .22 WMR six shot, double or single action revolver. Mine is definitely a .38 five shot. Although, I wish it were also a .357 Magnum.
Thanks for the reply.
Hi Russ,
Welcome to the forum.
You responded to a post meant for the author of this thread which is about an H&R 38 mistaken for a Body Guard. You should start your own new thread to avoid confusion like that. You will also get much more responses and assistance.
You also posted in the wrong section of the forum; you should be posting a new thread in the "1980 to current Section" due to the vintage of your gun. You should still do that.
Hope that helps in the future,
