Recent 15-22 Owner - Looking for AR15 - Need Suggestions

[pgamboa]

Hey all,

Been a member here for a month or so now. Recently picked up an MP 15-22 MOE, FDE. LOVE IT!! This is my 1st AR.

So, I have an opportunity for an upcoming Hog Hunt in February. Besides indoor shooting range, 25yds max (most of the time), and once at a friends 80 acre place, I've never shot anywhere else.

I am REALLY looking forward to this Hog Hunt as I've never been.

So...I am looking for my next rifle and think I need something more powerful than my 15-22 LOL. I think 556/223 is what I want.

I see sales going on right now for a DPMS Oracle at Cabelas for $649 and some rebates for (4) mags and a cleaning kit. I was really going to jump on this offer as it seems like a great price point for someone starting off....

BUT... I REALLY like my 15-22 and it seems like S&W has great Customer Service and Warranty from what I have read. Reading the MP15 manual, it states a 1 year warranty and a lifetime service warranty. What are the differences??

I am really looking to save the extra $ and rather go with S&W than anyone else. Since I have the 15-22 MOE in FDE, I was looking at it's matching big brother. At Sportsmans Outdoor, the MP15 MOE FDE is $999. This is about my budget. The ship free and no tax. FFL Transfer is $10.

So...Here is my question: What are the main differences between all the various MP15s out there? I can see the "compliant" 10rd/fixed stocks are probably for those states like CA, but what are the major differences between the other 30rd versions? I can see some differences like the sights, forends, and barrel twists between them, but what makes them so much more?? I see that the Sport is the cheapest amongst them. Is there anything different in how the lower is made on the Sport?

The sales guy at Cabelas who was explaining the differences to my coworker between the $649 DPMS Oracle and the $899 DPMS. He said the cheaper model has a "synthetic" aluminum lower vs. the "better" lower on the more expensive model.

Anyway, my coworker did buy the $649 DPMS and screwed up the 4473 - LOL. He has to wait 30 days now. I was hoping he would go home with it so I can test fire it. So...I wanted to do some research on my purchase rather than jumping the gun like he did. Pun intended.

The FDE has grown on me now since the purchase of the 15-22.

Thanks for all the help everyone!!

 

[Hobie1]

Look into the Sport.















sport

 

[shawnfergie]

+1 Sport, I got my 15-22 back in 2009 and my Sport in 2012... You will love it and the price can't be beat BUT I see the Optic Ready and other MP15 variants are very closely priced.

 

[Vinney47]

The Sport is the entry M&P15, and is the most different, IMO. It lacks the forward assist and dust cover (the usefulness/need of them is questionable/debatable). Also, the trigger guard is built in to the lower. A lot of people leave that alone on a standard AR, but many also replace it with a more curved design as opposed to the mil-spec straight piece that also leaves a gap. The trigger guard of the Sport is already curved with no gap, so that a bonus not to have to upgrade to a curved piece, but it also can't be replaced or further customized so that's the downside.
Aside from that, the Sport will take any and all upgrades/additions/ad-ons that are for mil-spec AR15's.

With the rest of the M&P15's, the difference is twist rate and rifling pattern of the barrel, and what "furniture" it comes with (sights, stock, quad rail vs. hand guard, etc). If you really like the Magpul MOE stuff in FDE and will likely put those items on your M&P anyway, it will save you to buy that version to start with. It, like the Sport has a different lower with a built in, curved trigger guard. Also has "Magpul" stamped into it instead of "M&P15". The flash hider is a bit of an upgrade as well.

Another way to go would be to buy a simpler version (not necessarily less expensive) like the OR, T, or X. Shoot it, a lot. Add things a little at a time to see how you like it and how it affects your shooting (for better or worse). In the end, you may very well like Magpul MOE the best and shoot with those items the best. But you might find yourself liking something else entirely, and a better shooter with different "furniture".

But I think you are headed in the right direction to go with S&W over DPMS. Not that they make a bad rifle, I just think S&W makes a better one. Anyone that ranks AR makers in tiers (silly, IMO) generally puts S&W a tier above DPMS. Not that it necessarily matters, but generally DPMS are built with commercial-spec parts and S&W to Mil-Spec (military specification).

 

[BillyJack2012]

Synthetic aluminum lower???? Sounds like a load of BS to me. It's just hard to tell anyone there is an entry level and "higher" level DPMS...

Your gut steers you right. Many of us started with a 15-22 and then went with the M&P due to great experiences with the S&W product. DPMS gets mixed reviews while nearly EVERY S&W review is positive. They make an outstanding AR. Even the Colt fanboys are realizing this a respecting the M&P.

Beyond that, the MAGPUL version is a step above. Great barrel but it's also the only M&P with a Mid-Length gas system. Smoother recoil and it has that slick MAGPUL rolled lower. This would be my next AR hands down if I were looking for one.

Do yourself a favor, get the MAGPUL M&P and as you learn more about the AR, you'll realize what a gem you have.

 

[SmokeStack Lightning]

The current model 'T' has a melonite barrel, (instead of chrome liner) w/5R rifling and the attached quad rail comes free-floated from the factory. No delta ring.

Got mine for 995$ delivered from GunBroker back in July.

Like you I bought a 15/22 MOE (in June, 13) and wanted to match that platform w/ an AR platform.

Ima changing out the TG's on both with the same aftermarket TG (haven't decided on which brand I want yet, other than a 3lb pull) probably after the first of the year.

Out of the box there is a 1lb difference with the trigger pull between the two. Measured w/a 'Lyman' digital TP gauge.

I already blew my 'gun allowance' this month on a solo quick access lock box for my T from "Center of Mass" and next month is Christmas, so I gotta wait until 2014 before dropping any more ching on guns and accessories.

 

[uncledoggle]

"Synthetic aluminum" lowers can only be mated to imitation plastic buttstocks.

 

[W.E.G.]

Upgrade the trigger on any AR you plan to use for competition or hunting.

The basic trigger basically DOES work, but in my opinion is little more than a placeholder for something better if you intend that the rifle will be yours personally.

Crappy triggers belong on arsenal guns to be issued to recruits.

 

[cyphertext]

I know this sounds nit-picky, but the M&P 15-22 is not an AR rifle. It is an AR styled rifle. There is a difference in materials used, measurements in the lower and upper, etc. It is the best, out of the box AR styled rifle though when it comes to the same manual of arms as the AR-15 IMO.

The Sport will come the closest to being like your M&P 15-22. The Sport does not have the forward assist or the ejection port cover and neither does the M&P 15-22. The Sport has an integral trigger guard, again like the M&P 15-22. The operation of these two firearms is identical. My son can run his 15-22 and then swap over to my Sport without hesitation.

As others have pointed out though, to Magpul out a Sport, it will run you close to $200. I use mine for hog hunting and I find that money is better spent on an optic than new furniture.

 

[pgamboa]

I know this sounds nit-picky, but the M&P 15-22 is not an AR rifle. It is an AR styled rifle. There is a difference in materials used, measurements in the lower and upper, etc. It is the best, out of the box AR styled rifle though when it comes to the same manual of arms as the AR-15 IMO.

My mistake: I meant "AR Style Rifle". LOL. Still learning here. Thanks for that. I want to be able to speak knowledgeabley.

Synthetic aluminum lower???? Sounds like a load of BS to me. It's just hard to tell anyone there is an entry level and "higher" level DPMS...

Your gut steers you right. Many of us started with a 15-22 and then went with the M&P due to great experiences with the S&W product. DPMS gets mixed reviews while nearly EVERY S&W review is positive. They make an outstanding AR. Even the Colt fanboys are realizing this a respecting the M&P.

Beyond that, the MAGPUL version is a step above. Great barrel but it's also the only M&P with a Mid-Length gas system. Smoother recoil and it has that slick MAGPUL rolled lower. This would be my next AR hands down if I were looking for one.

Do yourself a favor, get the MAGPUL M&P and as you learn more about the AR, you'll realize what a gem you have.

Definitely going to go with MP15. Still learning about the different "lengths" as well; Carbine, Mid-Length, Rifle.

I think I am leaning more towards the MOE/FDE now. Just because I like how the lower has the Magul Stamp and the FDE furniture. I REALLY like the color combo.

I don't think I was initially trying to get something identical to the 15-22 more so than the FDE. I think I like having the forward assist and dust cover option. Also having the 1:8 5R (still learning about this as well, don't know if I personally would benefit from this but I know it is "better").

Looks like I will be saving the extra $400 for the difference between the $599 Sport and the $999 MOE/FDE. If I went with the Sport, I would be FDE'ing it anyway. Might as well get the extra options (forward assist, dust cover, trigger guard option, 1:8 5R, etc.)

Thanks all for all the info: This is EXACTLY what I was looking for. Really hard to tell from online specs and pictures. Now I know what to look for if I get the chance to compare them side by side.

Thanks everyone!

 

[Nappers]

The Sport is a great rifle!

I love mine, shoots better than the shooter and can modify or leave stock (no pun intended).

The only Mod I've done to mine was put a Magpul MOE+ Pistol grip as suggested by the fine folks here.

I thought of "assembling" my own gun with various parts, but the Sport cost me $723.xx new after taxes and fees out the door (literaly) here in Californ-I-A!

Great gun.

 

[gdnagle]

The MOE comes with several standard features that don't come with the other S&W M&P 15 MSR's including mid length gas system.

Stock grip and sights will be the same as the MOE 15-22. Fore grip will be different but there is a conversion to install the MOE for grip if you so desire from Tacticool22.

Go to the S&W site and do the comparison for differences.

If you plan on making it look like you 15-22 MOE it has all the parts already on it plus it comes in FDE.

I have the older MOE with carbine length gas system and bought it because it was already decked out with the MOE gingerbread which is what I wanted.

 

[Dino1]

You will like the mid length gas system, it shoots a little softer than a carbine gas system. Go with your gut and get the MOE version, or just build your own. I was on the fence just like you, I chose to build my own and do not regret it one bit. I got the Rifle I wanted and only spent under a grand on it with optics. I went the PSA route with a hammer forged chrome lined 1:7 twist barrel with a good BCG and a Stag stripped lower. Trigger is the standard PSA Classic with some work done to it, no creep and a nice clean break. A JP trigger spring will round it out now that I know it is a tack driver, just wanted to make sure it worked right before sinking any more money into it. My original pick was the M&P15T. I actually only have less than 900.00 into it at this point.

 

[pgamboa]

You will like the mid length gas system, it shoots a little softer than a carbine gas system. Go with your gut and get the MOE version, or just build your own. I was on the fence just like you, I chose to build my own and do not regret it one bit. I got the Rifle I wanted and only spent under a grand on it with optics. I went the PSA route with a hammer forged chrome lined 1:7 twist barrel with a good BCG and a Stag stripped lower. Trigger is the standard PSA Classic with some work done to it, no creep and a nice clean break. A JP trigger spring will round it out now that I know it is a tack driver, just wanted to make sure it worked right before sinking any more money into it. My original pick was the M&P15T. I actually only have less than 900.00 into it at this point.

I would love to build one.... one day. I recently moved. Old house had a nice work bench and vise. New house = I don't have either one . I spent 45 minutes watching NicTaylor00 videos on how to build one. The only tools I have are punches and stuff for cleaning, that's about it. LOL. I went by and looked at all the different tools and gadgets to help removing things that castle nut, delta ring, vise clamps, etc. I could see myself building one a year from now.

I am still torn between the Sport and the MOE/FDE. I went to Cabelas today felt the MOE/FDE and compared the mid-length to the carbine length. They don't have the Sport model but had the OR model.

Why would the OR model (which has no front sight or rear sight) be more than the Sport? Oh wait...Dust Cover and Forward Assist. Besides that, aren't they virtually the same but without the gear?

Anyhow...I liked the feel of both. I think I can save about $200 if I went with the Sport and MOE'd in FDE and with the stock I want. I wasn't big on the MOE Stock as it felt a little loose on the tube. I think it's the CTR stock that I would put on.

Man...I am really torn. I can fund the $600 pretty quickly and get the Sport this week. If I go with the MOE/FDE, I would need to fund another $400 and would probably have to with about a month or so.

What to do...what to do...

 

[cyphertext]

Why would the OR model (which has no front sight or rear sight) be more than the Sport? Oh wait...Dust Cover and Forward Assist. Besides that, aren't they virtually the same but without the gear?

The OR has a chrome lined barrel, where the Sport is a Melonite treated barrel. Both offer corrosion protection, but the Melonite treated barrel should be more accurate, in theory.

When the Sport had the 1:8 twist, 5R barrel, it was a no brainer. I gladly gave up the forward assist and ejection port cover for that barrel. If the MOE isn't exactly what you want furniture wise, I highly suggest getting a more basic model and changing things as your budget allows. There is no reason to pay for upgraded furniture that you do not want.

 

[Sod]

Upgrade the trigger on any AR you plan to use for competition or hunting.

The basic trigger basically DOES work, but in my opinion is little more than a placeholder for something better if you intend that the rifle will be yours personally.

Crappy triggers belong on arsenal guns to be issued to recruits.

Yes good triggers are much more important for putting holes in paper than for our service members who put themselves in
harms way!!!
Happy Veterans Day!

 

[spad124]

I agree with you Sod! I've never had the opportunity to shoot an "as issued" AR rifle, but I would hope the triggers are much better than the commercially marketed "mil spec " ARs I've shot.

That said, the trigger on my Sport is one of the better commercial AR triggers I've shot. Very little creep and a clean break. The overall fit of the Sport is much better than most of the other commercial ARs for less than $1200 that I've seen.

I've never hunted hogs, yet, but I think I would want a harder hitting round than the 5.56. IMHO, I'd save up cash to buy a Sport and a second upper in something like 6.8. That would be about $100 more than the MOE.

 

[JaPes]

OP,

People are going to hate me for saying this. I've examined a few mil-spec pattern AR-15's in the $550 - $900 price range. Excluding the differences in furniture, they're pretty much the same. Again, just my opinion for your 1st AR-15: buy a complete rifle from a well known national brand. For someone new to the platform, the factory warranty and/or service warranty is good to have.

Now if I were being picky...

If I were buying an AR for hog hunting, I'd be selective about barrel twist rate. I'd prefer a 1:7 twist rate to stabilize heavier .223/5/56 projectiles. The issue is that the heavier projectiles are more expensive, making practice more expensive.

If I were to only have one AR-15, then I'd choose a S&W M&P 15 that is equipped with a Thompson Center 1:8 5R, progressive gain twist, Melonite treated barrel. As long as I do not go to either extreme of projectile weight, the 1:8 5r barrel lets me use a wide range of .223/5.56 projectiles. The 5r rifling + progressive gain twist reportedly causes less deformation of the projectile in the barrel, giving better potential for accuracy. The Melonite treatment (salt bath nitriding) imparts corrosion resistance and wear resistance without adding a layer of material in the barrel similar to chrome lining. This lends itself to the increased potential for accuracy.

After identifying the S&W M&P 15's equipped with the 1:8 5r barrel, I'd then pick the rifles equipped from the factory with the furniture I want. For me that would be the M&P 15T. The next things I would buy, in order:

1. Ammo.
2. Mags.
3. Sling.
4. Aftermarket Trigger.
5. Optic.

 

[TheMaineEvent]

I have a Sport and an M&P 15T and love both, but the Sport no longer has the 1:8 twist or the 5R rifling which is what made it a great rifle. Not to say it's not a good rifle now, it is, but it's fallen somewhat compared to where it was.

Still, I think for what the average shooter will use it for it's perfectly fine. I bought mine and changed out the furniture for about another 200 bucks, which was worth it since I could add the parts that I wanted.

 

[shawnfergie]

I have a Sport and an M&P 15T and love both, but the Sport no longer has the 1:8 twist or melonite barrel anymore which is what made it a great rifle. Not to say it's not a good rifle now, it is, but it's fallen somewhat compared to where it was.

Still, I think for what the average shooter will use it for it's perfectly fine. I bought mine and changed out the furniture for about another 200 bucks, which was worth it since I could add the parts that I wanted.

The Sport doesn't have a melonite barrel anymore???