victory jammed

[olddog211]

I recently picked up a Victory, however it is completely jammed. Cylinder won't rotate, hammer and trigger won't move, and the cylinder won't swing out. Any tips from you experienced S&W guys before I take the side plate off? This is my first revolver.
Thanks in advance!!

 

[Alk8944]

Really not enough to even really guess at, but if it isn't thoroughly rusted my first guess is that at some time someone "lubricated" it with Linseed Oil and it is, literally, glued together internally. Take off the stocks and submerge the revolver in Mineral Spirits for a few days and see what happens.

 

[DWalt]

I'd pop the sideplate off and have a look (don't pry). Hopefully, someone didn't deactivate it by welding up the guts. If not, you can soak it in mineral spirits or blast it with spray carb cleaner. It's not a difficult job to completely disassemble everything, but one home-made tool helps. There are YouTube videos that explain how it's done.

 

[CatboatWilly]

Take the stocks of and soak it for a few days. There are lots of suggestions as to what to soak it in but mineral spirits will work fine for starters. If you are not sure about dis-assembly, check with you local gunsmith or LGS. Do pry anything unless your are sure.

 

[austintexas]

The first thing I would check is the ejector rod. If it has unscrewed to the point the cylinder wont rotate I think the hammer and the rest of the innerds wont work either.

SWCA 892

 

[DWalt]

Generally the effect of an unscrewed extractor rod is just to prevent opening the cylinder. Everything else usually works OK. But it's good to tighten it to see if it helps. One other thing I have seen is a bullet wedged between the chamber and the barrel from a no-powder dud round. That does jam up everything, but you can see the case in the chamber.

 

[roaddog28]

The first thing I would check is the ejector rod. If it has unscrewed to the point the cylinder wont rotate I think the hammer and the rest of the innerds wont work either.

SWCA 892

I would agree. I bought a M&P that the cylinder would not rotate out. The ejector rod had back out so the cylinder would not swing out. Easy fix. But DWalt makes good suggestions too.
Good luck

 

[hardscrabble]

I just had to work on a Victory with a frozen cylinder latch. I popped the side plate (I had to put some Kroil on the screws and let them soak for an hour), sprayed the insides with a large dose of carb cleaner, let that drain/dry, then liberally applied Kroil to the works. I left it about an hour and the latch popped free. All good.

I am almost always pleasantly surprised by the condition of these old guns under the side plate. This one had some very old grease, was very dry, but there wasn't a trace of rust, corrosion, fouling, etc.

Like everybody says...don't pry on that side plate, and for goodness sake use a properly sized screw driver.

 

[italiansport]

I'm going to let everyone in on a little secret.
S&W used to do a one-day seminar at my local gun club. This included factory gunsmiths and for an NRA donation they'd tune up your Smith for you. I had them work on my Model 28 which was occasionally misfiring.
Guess What? They pry the side plate off with a screwdriver.
Jim

 

[Retired W4]

I'm going to let everyone in on a little secret.
S&W used to do a one-day seminar at my local gun club. This included factory gunsmiths and for an NRA donation they'd tune up your Smith for you. I had them work on my Model 28 which was occasionally misfiring.
Guess What? They pry the side plate off with a screwdriver.
Jim

ARRRRGG! Take their credentials away.

 

[red9]

I don't know who trained that factory gunsmith, but this illustrates the number one rule we were taught when I attended the S&W armorer's school - DO NOT WORK ON THE GUN IN THE OWNER'S PRESENCE. One of the most used tools in the factory armorer's kit was the babbit - a lead rod about 6 x 1". This was used to repair anything from a bent ejector rod to a fixed sight gun not shooting to point of aim. The only restriction on it's use was that at least one foot must remain on the ground when applying it to the offending part.

In my experience, if the gun appears to be in good condition but is totally frozen, the cylinder cannot rotate due to dried grease. Lubricate as described, swing out the cylinder, and continue lubricating while rotating until the cylinder turns freely. If you can now pull the trigger, make sure that the cylinder stop drops down into the frame as the trigger starts back. Good Luck.

Bob

 

[opoefc]

How to correctly pop off the side plate with a screw driver is a well kept secret known only by the Anointed Ones, who also have a large hunk of a lead bar handy to apply to stubborn S&Ws. Having dwelled in their presence for many years, I now have no trepidation in adopting their ways and watching the utter horror on the faces of the gun's owner, when I am asked if I could please adjust some problem with their prize S&W! Ed.

 

[hardscrabble]

I don't know who trained that factory gunsmith, but this illustrates the number one rule we were taught when I attended the S&W armorer's school - DO NOT WORK ON THE GUN IN THE OWNER'S PRESENCE. One of the most used tools in the factory armorer's kit was the babbit - a lead rod about 6 x 1". This was used to repair anything from a bent ejector rod to a fixed sight gun not shooting to point of aim. The only restriction on it's use was that at least one foot must remain on the ground when applying it to the offending part.

There was a time in my later youth when I took up part-time hobby farming. I frequently used the "babbit" too when working on farm equipment, including a 1950-odd Massey Ferguson tractor. My "babbit" was of the larger variety, approximately 4' in length and weighing in at about 40lbs. In my ignorance, I called it a "breaker bar", which must be a Tennessee colloquialism. It was pretty effective in resolving problems that didn't have an obvious solution. When employed in exploratory repair work, you either broke what you hit with it or it loosened up and started working/rotating/uncoiling/unscrewing/etc. like it's supposed to, which produced an immediate solution without further mystery...it either started working again or you went for a new part. I'm sure that a smith utilizing a babbit operates under the same repair philosophy.

I have never found anything more effective than Kroil when it comes to old stuff with frozen parts, and I'm pretty quick to put it to use. Particularly, I'll use it liberally under the side plate to get an action going again. It isn't ideal, because it's so thin and will "leak" for weeks as it works it's way back out of all those behind/between/etc. spaces. I often wonder if this is a good idea, or just an expedient that makes me feel better, but could cause trouble down the line. Maybe someone here someone here has an idea about that.

In addition, it stinks. Gosh almighty does it stink. When I had to use it on that frozen cylinder latch I briefly left the garage door open and I got a severe reprimand from the War Dept. over it when she got home.

 

[H Richard]

I have fixed this problem on several S&W including a couple Victory's. It was always the ejector rod coming unscrewed. Now, a couple of them also had old dried oil the consistency of tar inside, but that was not the primary problem.

 

[S&WIowegan]

I'm going to let everyone in on a little secret.
S&W used to do a one-day seminar at my local gun club. This included factory gunsmiths and for an NRA donation they'd tune up your Smith for you. I had them work on my Model 28 which was occasionally misfiring.
Guess What? They pry the side plate off with a screwdriver.
Jim

My gunsmith did that ONCE to one of my S&Ws while I was saying DON'T DO THAT!! That was the last time he ever worked on one of mine. Those factory reps are not gunsmiths but if you don't believe us here go ahead and pry on your guns.

 

[rct269]

DWalt came close, but unless I missed something, nobody else said what to do-----only what not to do.(??) Is that what a "non-response response" is??

One kind soul said there was a YouTube video to guide you. That's probably a good lead (if you know how to find particular YouTube videos). (I don't, but it's probably not rocket science.)

How's this? Step 1. Remove grips. Step 2. Remove sideplate fasteners (with a screwdriver that fits the screws---and several paragraphs can be written about what "fits the screws" means). Step 3. Grasp the gun with one hand----in a fashion which does not obstruct the sideplate----nor the grip frame. Step 4. Grasp a hammer with the other hand in a manner which enables you to strike something with the handle of the hammer (assuming the handle is made of wood---and if it isn't, get another hammer). Step 5. Whack the sideplate side of the grip frame with the hammer handle. Note that the term "whack" has several meanings. The first is a mighty blow which will likely send the sideplate flying across the room to come to rest under a large, unmovable object----never to be seen again. Given that this is not your objective, try a gentle tap. (Your objective is to cause the sideplate to rise from its installed position-----just a little. The engineering types refer to this as overcoming inertia----or something like that.) Step 6. Given that your "tap" has overcome the inertia of the sideplate-----just a little, tap the grip frame again. Repeat as required. Step 7. At the point in time when it appears you can lift the sideplate from the frame with your fingers, proceed to do just that. Assembly is the reverse of the foregoing----sort of.

Ralph Tremaine

Apologies to those who feel the need for them, but once I got started it was tough to stop.

 

[DWalt]

My favorite "Whack" tool is an inertia bullet puller (which has a plastic head). And I usually strike the frame side opposite the sideplate. The sideplate usually pops completely off with the first whack, so do it over a folded towel or something like it, so the sideplate doesn't hit the floor and get damaged (in case you have a concrete floor).

 

[olddog211]

Well, Gentlemen,
It is now 6 months since you all poured out all that excellent advice. I took the Victory to a gunsmith friend who promptly sent for a new ejector rod (the old one was bent). He installed it for me, and the pistol, now properly lubricated, operates like it did in 1942.
Thnks to all for your input!

 

[jmace57]

olddog - thanks for following up. It's always good to hear what actually happened.

 

[Absalom]

That's what I like about the Forum.
Even though nobody actually came up with the right answer (I don't recall anyone guessing a BENT rod), I learned a ton of helpful information.
I'm a historian, not a technical guy, and don't usually venture where small movable parts dwell. I've never removed a side plate, and have no particular interest in doing so, but if I ever need to, now I know how, and how not to.