New ATF regulations regarding propellants

[fredj338]

Note that there is plenty of wiggle room in the 2nd Amendment to allow all sorts of onerous regulation of both guns and ammunition. Treating ammunition and reloading components like cigarettes by levying exorbitant Federal taxes on their sale is what I feel will be more likely to be promoted under a hostile administration, as it will be more easily done than a lot of other control measures which could be imposed. How about a $5.00 per round tax across the board for all calibers and $50/lb for powder? Those taxes don't affect your "Right" to buy it, but you better have lots of cash to exercise that right. The power to Tax is the power to destroy.

1000% correct & it is already happening in Seattle & soon here in Kalif state wide. Once you place restrictions on how ammo can be purchased, then you can tax the poop out of it. Gavin Newsome openly stated the libs were going after ammo hard because there is NO 2A restrictions. They just haven't figured out that people actually make their own. When that happens, then you could see things like limitations on the quantities &/or taxation that makes shooting prohibitive.
Look at how the cig tax went. It started out like 50c per pack now up to $5 per in many states. Ammo will go the same way. Once the tax is in place, they can raise it to pretty much any level. Like boiling a frog, slow is better so people don't get all freaked out. Best way to prevent it is vote friggin Rep guys & gals.

 

[fredj338]

I disagree. IMO, in order to bear arms, the arm needs to be rightfully loaded.

A little while back, MD tried to ban some type of magazine or something. An appeals court overturned the ban, citing the fact that the magazine is a part of the firearm in question, which cannot be banned.

In my simplistic way of thinking, the same should apply to ammunition, or at least components thereof.

You can disagree but it matters little. What matters is what stands in court. Mag restriction are in place in many states. Nothing to prevent politicians from limiting ammo or components or requiring onerous licensing to sell or purchase either.

 

[DWalt]

The ATF's recent reclassification of wetted nitrocellulose has been put on hold, at least temporarily.

https://www.atf.gov/file/109341/download

The above document is unusually short and understandable. Basically, it says that ATF has become aware of industry concerns, and all previously authorized practices can continue while those concerns are evaluated.

I have no knowledge beyond what is in the above notice, so I cannot speculate about any longer term expectations.

From some of my contacts in the smokeless powder industry (I worked at Hercules back in the day and still have contacts), if the BATFE does eventually regulate wetted NC as a high explosive, it will, at least temporarily, shut down powder manufacture in the USA. It probably wouldn't affect foreign SP sources.

 

[rwsmith]

WETTED nitrocellulose....

Gunpowder isn't wetted nitrocellulose and I don't know if any formulation contains 12% nitroglycerin.

Gunpowder is not an explosive, but burning when contained can produce an explosion. Other than that it's just an extreme fire hazard.

 

[mikld]

An aside/question; I tried to find a definition on "wetted nitrocellulose" but at best found only nitrocellulose. What is "wetted nitrocellulose" and how does it differ from plain nitrocellulose? I am assuming "wetted" is used in smokeless powder, but exactly what is it and why is it more dangerous than plain nitrocellulose? (BTW, nitrocellulose is sold by Amazon as lacquer).

 

[DWalt]

Wetted nitrocellulose is exactly what it is - water wet NC as it comes from the nitrator house. In that state it is far less flammable and can be stored, processed, and transported safely. It is possible for dry NC to detonate, and in fact some early high explosives were essentially compressed blocks of NC. NC is the principal ingredient of ALL smokeless powder, but it is actually a blend of two grades of NC which is used, called in the industry as "Low Grade" (pyrocellulose) and "High Grade" (NC). LG has a nominal nitrogen content of 12.7%, while HG has a nominal nitrogen content of 13.4%. The blend used has a nominal nitrogen content of 13.15% (for single base propellants). I won't go into the technical reasons for blending LG and HG, but they are very important. Before the NC is converted into smokeless powder, it is ALWAYS handled and stored as a water-wet product which is non-explosive and essentially non-flammable in that state. Therefore, if BATFE dictates that wetted NC must be handled as a High Explosive prior to conversion into smokeless powder, that would require a complete re-design of the powder manufacturing operation to be in compliance. I am not at all sure of what manufacturing changes would be necessary or if such changes are even technologically or economically feasible. In my opinion, the proposed BATFE regulatory change will potentially destroy the smokeless powder manufacturing industry in the USA, and that is clearly its intent. BATFE knows EXACTLY what it is doing and has without any doubt been ordered to do this. Guess by whom?

 

[mikld]

Thanks DWalt. NC is mixed, or "wetted" to make it safe to handle prior to being made into smokeless gun powder? Yep something fishy here...

it is ALWAYS handled and stored as a water-wet product which is non-explosive and essentially non-flammable in that state.

So, the BATFE actually wants to reclassify a non-explosive non-flammable product as a high explosive?

 

[Magload]

Will the next step be no imported powders?

 

[Warren Sear]

Gunpowder isn't wetted nitrocellulose and I don't know if any formulation contains 12% nitroglycerin.

Gunpowder is not an explosive, but burning when contained can produce an explosion. Other than that it's just an extreme fire hazard.

See post #6.

 

[Warren Sear]

THE SKY IS FALLING!!!!!!! OUR SECOND AMENDMENT RIGHTS ARE GONE!!! GENERAL WAILING AND GNASHING OF TEETH EVERYWHERE!!!!!!

Oh, wait a second, there is an update...


June 2016 - Addendum August 31, 2016
Nitrocellulose - Update
ATF’s June 2016 Explosives Industry Newsletter included a brief discussion of Nitrocellulose, and attempted to clarify the circumstances under which wetted Nitrocellulose is considered a high explosive under 27 CFR, Part 555. As with all explosives, ATF’s focus is on the potential public safety risks associated with materials that can be misused or diverted to unlawful purposes. Subsequent contact from industry members who import, transport, store or employ wetted Nitrocellulose in the production of ammunition, however, has brought to our attention issues that were not fully addressed in the Newsletter and require further consultation and consideration with the industry. Accordingly, ATF has and will conduct further industry outreach concerning wetted Nitrocellulose. In the interim, previously authorized industry practices concerning wetted Nitrocellulose will not be affected.

 

[DWalt]

"...require further consultation and consideration with the industry. Accordingly, ATF has and will conduct further industry outreach concerning wetted Nitrocellulose."

NOWHERE does the statement say that BATFE will reverse their original position. Conducting "outreach" means absolutely nothing.