M41 Performance Centre, QC issues ?

[leinster lad]

So I sent quite a big email yesterday to the Aussie Distributor with all the pictures etc., and cc'd in the S&W international manager and her assistant.
I got my daughter to proof read it to make sure that I was not abusive or disrespectful in any way.
Was all good.

No response as yet from S&W, but they are on weekend break so I am not that worried.
I know they will get back to me soon as we have been in fairly close contact all the way thru this.

I did receive a reply from the Aus dist. this morn.
Apparently while he was busy attending to family matters, a subordinate at the company took it upon himself to send it back without test firing etc.
Somehow managing to fill out all the documents and comply with all the regulations regarding sending a firearm across state lines etc........

yeh right.

Sent it to the correct gun shop, but failed to include MY contact details.
The gun shop had no idea who it was for or why it was even delivered to their shop...

Lucky that it just so happened that a friend of mine was at the EXACT SHOP when it was delivered and heard the shop owners confusion etc when they opened the consignment.
He knew that I had sent mine away and that I was expecting it soon...... put 2 and 2 together and rang me.
We verified the serial numbers and yep, you guessed it, it was mine !



So anyway, they have decided to get a local smithy to sort it out at their expense.

Cool.

The real issue though is how the heck did an unfinished PC VERSION barrel manage to escape into the wild for a WARRANTY REPAIR for FAULTY BARREL ???

There should be a few heads rolling at S&W.!!!

Thanks for all your support guys, it is really appreciated.

I'll keep you informed as this saga unfolds

 

[Tom S.]

There is a US army term to describe this whole ordeal, but we're not at liberty to use those terms here. It should take the local smith about 15 minutes (not counting tea time) to fix this for you and another 15 minutes to test and be awed by the accuracy. Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[andyo5]

I have attached two photos of my 1980s era M41 for you to use as comparison. Notice that there is a generous edge break into the chamber, the feed ramp is smooth and blued, and the surface of the fire control housing is machined smooth with an edge break at the rear, where it cocks the hammer. Some oil on the surface may obscure this, but it is quite smooth. It looks to me like your gun was assembled with some machining steps skipped. I can't imagine why they would do this.

 

[andyo5]

G'day, mite. (heh heh. Just my pathetic attempt at an Australian accent).
Here is a link to a good Model 41 maintenance page. It has lots of photos that you can use for comparison as well:
Model 41 maintenance

 

[leinster lad]

It looks to me like your gun was assembled with some machining steps skipped. I can't imagine why they would do this.

Thanks for your photos.

It certainly does look like mine skipped a couple of machining steps.

The Aus distributor seems to think that the finish (?) on this new barrel is quite normal, and that polishing / finishing the barrel is "gun fit specific" and that means that each one gets "hand finished" to suit the gun that it being fitted to.

What a load of **** !!! They supply and sell drop in replacement barrels FFS !!

The more they try an justify their incompetence, the angrier I am getting.

Still no response from S&W international Dept. in the USA.
I wonder if they have people that read these forums ?

 

[Barrie]

They only need one person from this Company to read this Forum. Guess what level he is in at their shop. Tom S I have dealt with many world class corporations during my work career and when nessesary I go right to the top. I have always had a reply directly from them a well. In any GOOD Company the little guy does have a voice. These Presidents of Companies have Big Toes to step on if need be. Its one of the reasons they are in that position. A lot of people on here are waiting with you for a proper reply and outcome as well.

 

[leinster lad]

The worry for me Barrie is that this level of "quality" is now considered acceptable by S&W, and as such, nothing will change.
Many companies have gone down this road. It is just a numbers game and on an individual basis, they are not concerned.
To them, it does not matter if they lose 1000 sales, because they simply cannot keep up with demand anyway.

I have sent S&W another email, outlining my disappointment and asking if my concerns can be elevated to a person with a higher pay grade.

I also have James Debney's email, and are considering contacting him personally.

For the time being though, i'll let the normal chain of command deal with it.

I am really not sure what they could even do ?? short of sending my gun shop a replacement 100% perfect ready to go replacement barrel directly ? and maybe half a dozen factory magazines ??

Maybe a complimentary S&W gift pack, containing lots of S&W goodies ??

I won't be holding my breath........

So that shiny new 686 I was thinking about might now have to be a Python ..

 

[andyo5]

So that shiny new 686 I was thinking about might now have to be a Python ..

Pythons really look cool, but have you ever tried the trigger on one?
Plus, they are out of production, extremely expensive on the used market, and hard to find a gunsmith who can deal with them properly.

You might try to pick up a 686 on the used market, or inspect a new one personally before buying.

The risk of ordering a gun sight unseen is, in the words of Forrest Gump, "you never know what you're going to get".

 

[leinster lad]

Pythons really look cool, but have you ever tried the trigger on one?
Plus, they are out of production, extremely expensive on the used market, and hard to find a gunsmith who can deal with them properly.".

Nah, never tried one, was just shooting the breeze so to speak.

And yes, they do look cool and if it is good enough for Rick on "The Walking Dead" then hey, worth a look, right ?

Seriously though, I will probably end up with a pre-loved 686.
At least any bugs with it should have been dealt with.

Still no reply from S&W.........

 

[andyo5]

Nah, never tried one, was just shooting the breeze so to speak.

And yes, they do look cool and if it is good enough for Rick on "The Walking Dead" then hey, worth a look, right ?

Well, if Rick on "The Walking Dead" has one, that's the best testimonial I could ask for.

 

[leinster lad]

ever seen the show ???

 

[andyo5]

ever seen the show ???

Actually, no. I already have enough trouble sleeping. : ^)

 

[andyo5]

New photos

Hopefully these photos will be more descriptive. Notice at the entrance to the chamber, there is a rounded edge and then a chamfer, which is enlarged at the bottom. The feed ramp is not polished across the entire surface. I see what look like horizontal machining marks. The center of the feed ramp seems smoother, possibly due to repeated feeding (?).
The bullet does have to jump a gap between the top of the feed ramp and the entrance to the chamber.

 

[leinster lad]

Thanks andyo5, nice pics

Your bolt hammer slide surface looks really nice as well.

looking at mine it looks like the end of the feed ramp is too close to the chamber entry, which is why the bullet gets stuck on that edge.

Either the feed ramp has been machined too deep, or the breech face needs more machining. I am not sure yet as to which....... although with the slide forward and in battery, the rear of the slide lines up with the rear of the frame nicely, which indicates that the breech face is correct.

Therefore, it has to be the feed ramp that is not big enough.

Hopefully a bit of a chamfer on the bottom of the chamber and a polish to the feed ramp is all it will take to get her feeding nicely.

I have been instructed by the Aussie Dist. to take my gun to a local gun smith, who should be able to rectify it.

Absolutely piss poor effort by S&W that they cannot even supply a fit-for-purpose ready-to-go replacement barrel for their flag ship .22 semi-auto pistol.

I am still having a hard time believing it.......


I wish I could just buy a Clarke or Ray-Vin barrel here and be done with it.....

 

[Barrie]

Don't blame you one bit for feeling this way at all. This has been very poor service from the beginning of the ordeal for you let alone extremely POOR Parts as well. Should not have happened the 1st time let alone twice to you.

 

[andyo5]

I have been instructed by the Aussie Dist. to take my gun to a local gun smith, who should be able to rectify it.
.....

In my view, you deserve a brand new gun. Are there none left in Australia? I think they abandoning their responsibilities to the customer and are jerking you around. Take a brand new gun to a gunsmith? Suppose the gunsmith messes it up. Then what?
And I can't believe that this is a Performance Center gun! PC guns are supposed to get special attention and be the cream of the crop. I'd sure hate to see what regular production looks like.
I am sorry that this has happened to you. And I doubt that you are the only one.

 

[leinster lad]

Guys, dropped my M41 off to the local smithy.
Should be ready to pick up on Monday. Won't be able to get to the range till Wednesday to try it out.

Will let you all know how THAT goes !

Stay tuned ........

 

[leinster lad]

Picked up my M41 PC this morning.

The gun smith said that it all went well. Polished the ramp and removed burr from chamber entry. Chamfered the bottom of the chamber to align with the feed ramp.

He said that he ran a few rounds thru it and it performed without issue.

So I got it home, stripped and inspected. All looks good so far.

Photos for your inspection





I may be able to get to the club on Wednesday, but probably not till Saturday.

I'll let you all know how she shoots !!

 

[Barrie]

WE all have our fingers crossed for you as hopefully they finally have got it right for once.

 

[andyo5]

The barrel and ramp look promising. Did the gunsmith do anything to the slide or frame?