Reloading .223 for Beginner
- Thread starter kbm6893
- Start date
(1) You're going to need a chamfer/deburr tool after you trim. I like the LE Wilson. The case mouth starts slightly undersize, and chamfering the mouth allows the bullet to do the expanding without damaging the jacket.
(2) For use in multiple guns, use the full-length sizing die. For a single gun, you can neck-size only, but most guys prefer to FL size. You don't FL and neck-size.
(3) You can dispense powder from the press for speed, and to use your existing powder dispenser. For that, you need a rifle charging die for your brand of powder dispenser. Currently, I'm dispensing with an on-the-bench Perfect Powder Measure and trickling up, but I plan on upgrading to an RCBS Chargemaster 1500.
(4) You may crimp for semiauto use. You certainly do not have to if using a bolt gun, and many guys don't do so for gas guns either. Some folks claim the Factory Crimp Die reduces runout and improves accuracy, but I didn't see any difference on the range.
(2) For use in multiple guns, use the full-length sizing die. For a single gun, you can neck-size only, but most guys prefer to FL size. You don't FL and neck-size.
(3) You can dispense powder from the press for speed, and to use your existing powder dispenser. For that, you need a rifle charging die for your brand of powder dispenser. Currently, I'm dispensing with an on-the-bench Perfect Powder Measure and trickling up, but I plan on upgrading to an RCBS Chargemaster 1500.
(4) You may crimp for semiauto use. You certainly do not have to if using a bolt gun, and many guys don't do so for gas guns either. Some folks claim the Factory Crimp Die reduces runout and improves accuracy, but I didn't see any difference on the range.
Thanks for all the help. here's how I currently reload:
Resize and de-prime.
Expand cases. Do NOT dispense powder at this time.
Drop powder onto scale and use funnel to put powder into case. I weigh every charge.
Seat bullets ( I seat 50 at a time)
Crimp the 50 seated rounds with a Lee crimp die.
So for .223, it looks like I need to use the FL sizing die, and there is no expanding die. So I do not need the 4 die set. But I do intend to crimp, so does Lee make a three die set with a depriming/resize die, a bullet seating die, and a crimp die?
Resize and de-prime.
Expand cases. Do NOT dispense powder at this time.
Drop powder onto scale and use funnel to put powder into case. I weigh every charge.
Seat bullets ( I seat 50 at a time)
Crimp the 50 seated rounds with a Lee crimp die.
So for .223, it looks like I need to use the FL sizing die, and there is no expanding die. So I do not need the 4 die set. But I do intend to crimp, so does Lee make a three die set with a depriming/resize die, a bullet seating die, and a crimp die?
Since you wish to crimp your rounds, most quality rifle seating dies also crimp if you adjust the die down. I know my RCBS dies do, but I honestly have not found a good reason to crimp any of my rifle rounds. Personally, I am not fond of most Lee equipment. It gets the job done but there is better equipment to be had at not more price. For me, it's kind of hunt and peck with Lee. But that's my opinion, maybe not fact to some.
I know I can seat and crimp in one die but I like crimping separately. Just always have. The only Lee product I have are the dies. Everything else is Hornady and rcbs.
I’m just a basic reloader. I Just thought that not crimping would form feeding issues and increase bullet setback.
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Dis ting:
https://leeprecision.com/pacesetter-dies-223-rem.html
Lee Pacesetter 3-Die Set 7-30 Waters
If you're looking to break 1"/100y (i.e.--precision is important to you), I would heartily suggest grabbing a universal decapping die.
When you deprime and resize in the same step, the case is aligned to however the depriming pin feels like pushing it. When you do them individually, the case is free to do whatever the die tells it to, making your ammo more consistent. And it's not like it takes a ton of time, effort, or concentration.
But if you're already reloading the same ammo for multiple guns, then you're fine doing them at the same time. You'd gain more from tuning loads to match individual guns.
I reload .223 for plinking with my AR. I get 1" groups at 100 yds. These are some thoughts after reading this thread:
* I use the RCBS standard base FL 2-die set.
* Mouth expansion does occur during the resizing operation, due to an expander button that is on decapping rod. When the case is pulled out of the sizing die you feel resistance. This is the expanding button being pulled through the neck as the case exits the die.
* I use mixed brass - understanding I'd likely get better grouping/consistency if I didn't. But 1" at 100 yds is good enough for what I want to do, so I don't go through that hassle.
* I seat/crimp in one step, but I understand we each do what we want to do and feel most comfortable with. I crimp separetly for my 9mm reloading......so I get where you're coming from on that front.
* I use H335 powder, which meters like a dream. I charge cases using a RCBS Uniflow powder measure. Again, if one is more comfortable weighing each charge - to each their own. My point is that achieving a "good enough" (however one defines that for themselves) accuracy result without weighing each charge is very very doable.
* The tasks of what I'd call ".223 final case prep" (checking for case head separation, checking length and trimming if necessary, reaming crimped primer pockets) I consider, by far, the most tedious and least enjoyable of any of my reloading activities across all calibers. ARs enable you to chew through ammo really quickly. The effort to get sufficient ammo for an AR session, given these required steps, can be a PITA in my opinion. But even doing those things is better than just buying my .223 ammo.
BTW - I'm using Hornady 55gr FMJs - being shot out of an M&P Sport 1.
OR
* I use the RCBS standard base FL 2-die set.
* Mouth expansion does occur during the resizing operation, due to an expander button that is on decapping rod. When the case is pulled out of the sizing die you feel resistance. This is the expanding button being pulled through the neck as the case exits the die.
* I use mixed brass - understanding I'd likely get better grouping/consistency if I didn't. But 1" at 100 yds is good enough for what I want to do, so I don't go through that hassle.
* I seat/crimp in one step, but I understand we each do what we want to do and feel most comfortable with. I crimp separetly for my 9mm reloading......so I get where you're coming from on that front.
* I use H335 powder, which meters like a dream. I charge cases using a RCBS Uniflow powder measure. Again, if one is more comfortable weighing each charge - to each their own. My point is that achieving a "good enough" (however one defines that for themselves) accuracy result without weighing each charge is very very doable.
* The tasks of what I'd call ".223 final case prep" (checking for case head separation, checking length and trimming if necessary, reaming crimped primer pockets) I consider, by far, the most tedious and least enjoyable of any of my reloading activities across all calibers. ARs enable you to chew through ammo really quickly. The effort to get sufficient ammo for an AR session, given these required steps, can be a PITA in my opinion. But even doing those things is better than just buying my .223 ammo.
BTW - I'm using Hornady 55gr FMJs - being shot out of an M&P Sport 1.
OR
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If you have to crimp your loads..............
make sure the bullets have a cannelure on them and.........
you only need a light crimp, for the little .223 case
since they don't have the huge recoil that a full blown .30 Cal. bullet does.
You might also encounter a lot shorter OAL with these style of bullets vs the "Smooth walls".
Some rifles do better with accuracy with the target boat tail bullets that allow for a lot longer OAL get closer to the lands in the barrel.
Good shooting.
make sure the bullets have a cannelure on them and.........
you only need a light crimp, for the little .223 case
since they don't have the huge recoil that a full blown .30 Cal. bullet does.
You might also encounter a lot shorter OAL with these style of bullets vs the "Smooth walls".
Some rifles do better with accuracy with the target boat tail bullets that allow for a lot longer OAL get closer to the lands in the barrel.
Good shooting.
I thought that 4 die set included the factory crimp die?
Neck size die, FL sizing die, Seater die and crimp die, that is 4. It does not include a powder charge die like the pistol die sets.
Rosewood
Cannelure is only necessary if you use the bullet seater die with the built in taper crimp. The Lee FCD does not require a cannelure to crimp.
Rosewood
He's talking about how he reloads handgun, if I'm not mistaken.
otisrush said:
I wouldn't call an expander button or mandrel analogous to what a handgun reloader would call "expansion". In handgun cartridges, you're flaring the case mouth to allow the bullet to seat easily and without damage. In rifles, the expander or mandrel is opening the neck and controlling neck tension after the resizing die undersizes the neck. Hence why I tend to think of it as the second step in sizing.
Chamfering the case mouth provides that little flare so the bullet isn't encountering a straight edge.
If the bullet does not have a "Can" indentation........
your Crimp is just damaging the copper jacket and denting the lead underneath it............
which does not help accuracy.
A "Crimp", bends the end of the case inward at a sharp angle..........
now if you are meaning a "Taper Crimp" , this is a totally different thing.
I don't do taper crimps.............
Usually bullet friction in a sized case will hold a load, until fired.
I have never used small base sizing dies or crimp dies when loading for an AR. Years ago I did try exact same loads with crimped bullets and noncrimped bullet to see if there was any difference in accuracy. The gun was no super accurate AR...just a factory Bushmaster that would shoot right at 1" with the right load. 10 shots at 100 yards with each load proved to show same results; little if any difference in accuracy. The bullet was the Sierra 69 gr MKHP with no cannalure . I've never seen any bullet set back in loads that are not crimped.
This is exactly what the fcd does, makes its own cannelure. If that hurts accuracy, a factory stamped cannelure may very well harm accuracy also. I have seen factory loaded ammo set back. Have never seen one of mine do so.
Not having a FCD die, I was looking it up today and found this
picture along with reviews on this die.
Some like it, some say the auto does not need a crimp to be accurate............... what ever.
We all know it depends on the rifle and how you load your ammo.
Thought this picture was interesting.
picture along with reviews on this die.
Some like it, some say the auto does not need a crimp to be accurate............... what ever.
We all know it depends on the rifle and how you load your ammo.
Thought this picture was interesting.
randyp
Member
No one mentioned overall cartridge length if loading for an AR, the loaded rounds have to fit in the magazine. Pay close attention to theOAL. Also, service rifles (AR's) have a floating firing pin. If you load a round from the magazine and then extract it unfired you will see a dimple in the primer. For this reason you want to use a primer with a harder cup such as a CCI or Winchester and insure the primer is seated flush with the case head or below flush. Search for articles on loading for "highpower AR rifle matches" and you will find alot of usefull info.
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DWalt
Member
A few things unmentioned what will aid grouping.
1. Headstamps are not nearly as important as using cases of relatively uniform weight
2. Ditto bullets
3. Finding the correct OAL for a specific bullet to give the minimum group size is very importaint, yet very few do it.
4. At least for my rifle (a Savage 112-V), it groups best using 21-22 grains of IMR 4198 with 50 grain bullets.
5. Crimping is totally unnecessary.
6. If you REALLY want to judge grouping performance, fire AT LEAST five 10-shot groups and calculate the average extreme spread. You are wasting time and ammo firing 5-shot groups. Far too much group-to-group variability.
1. Headstamps are not nearly as important as using cases of relatively uniform weight
2. Ditto bullets
3. Finding the correct OAL for a specific bullet to give the minimum group size is very importaint, yet very few do it.
4. At least for my rifle (a Savage 112-V), it groups best using 21-22 grains of IMR 4198 with 50 grain bullets.
5. Crimping is totally unnecessary.
6. If you REALLY want to judge grouping performance, fire AT LEAST five 10-shot groups and calculate the average extreme spread. You are wasting time and ammo firing 5-shot groups. Far too much group-to-group variability.
