History repetes itself.

[DWalt]

Back in the early 70s I took a private tour of the new Ohio Pen in Lucasville prior to any prisoners being moved in, courtesy of the new assistant warden who was a personal friend. It included the death chamber, which was intended to get the electric chair from the old Columbus prison location. But the area where the executioner stood was completed. Everyone thinks of a big electric switch to turn on the juice to the chair, but at the new prison, it was just a red button. And in fact I even pushed it (of course it wasn't connected to anything yet). I am not sure the electric chair was used there, as I think Ohio went to lethal injection.


On another note, many county jails in Texas built in the 19th century included a steeple inside which was a gallows. Back then, executions were carried in the county in which the crime took place. The original Texas electric chair is still in the Texas Prison Museum in Huntsville, along with pictures of all the inmates executed in it.

It is not fiction that some of the large Texas ranches had "Hanging Trees" for the purpose of educating cattle rustlers that crime does not pay.

 

[tlawler]

Just a minor FYI. Old Sparky is the official name of Ohio's electric chair.

Ivan

Interesting…that's the name of Florida's electric chair as well. Most famous for returning Ted Bundy back downstairs to meet his maker. Just looked it up on the Wik…several states named their chairs Old Sparky. I like the name that Pennsylvania, New Jersey, and Tennessee gave their electric chairs…Old Smokey.

Old Sparky - Wikipedia

 

[Mule Packer]

I heard a rumor that a Utah Firing Squad consisted of 12 men with state furnished rifles and ammo with only 2 live rounds. At the execution of a child molester, the corps had 4 slugs in it! The people of Utah believe in being thorough.

I'm sure MulePacker has an accurate memory.

Ivan

Well, I don't know how accurate, but I sure as heck remember it. Judge Willis Ritter, a United States District Judge for the state of Utah, kept issuing stays of execution for convicted murderer Gary Gilmore. Three, if I remember correctly. Gilmore said he wanted to be executed, but a certain civil liberties group, which shall be unnamed, kept pressing to have the sentence overturned. Finally, Gilmore said something like, "Get out of my life!" I remember that the citizens of Utah, especially those in Provo where the victims had lived, were getting pretty peeved at Ritter and the civil liberties protestors.

Anyway, like Pharmer pointed out, there were five officers, each armed with .30-30's. But, if my somewhat feeble memory serves me, one rifle was loaded with a blank round. The reason being that no one person would know who fired the coup de grace.

 

[Mike SC Hunter]

I continue to wonder just how much longer it might be until Americans stop calling 9-1-1 for police response and simply start calling the Sanitation Department for removal of the rotting corpses on the streets and sidewalks.

About 40 or 50 years ago there was a minor motion picture titled "In Broad Daylight", based upon a true story of a small town continually victimized by a notorious bully (played by Patrick Denehy, as I recall). The climax of the story came when a bunch of folks gathered around the bully with shotguns and deer rifles, took care of business, then went home. Investigators could not find anyone willing to admit having seen or heard anything. Apparently the years of failure by the courts and public agencies in dealing with a chronic problem came to an end at the same time that the general public reached the end of their patience.

Just speculating here, no recommendations being offered.

Edit to correct: 1991 production, Patrick Dennehy and Cloris Leachman, occurred in Skidmore, Missouri.

Movie was called Skidmore Bully I remember watching it...I was amazed at the shootout scene when those good folks pulled up and started pulling guns out of everywhere.

 

[ameridaddy]

....one rifle was loaded with a blank round. The reason being that no one person would know who fired the coup de grace.

Recoil tells the tale.

 

[Mule Packer]

Recoil tells the tale.

That's what I thought, too, but then I read that in the state of Utah, "one rifleman may be given a 'dummy' cartridge containing a wax bullet instead of a lead bullet, which provides a more realistic recoil." Interesting.

 

[BigBoy99]

Several years ago I read an article about a murder which had be committed in some Middle Eastern country. It was a shooting at a party where two men got into an argument and one shot the other in front of all people at the party. The party was on a Friday night. The fellows trial was held on Sat. and he was executed on Sun. That is swift justice.

 

[Tex1001]

Recoil tells the tale.

All of Utah's rifles were (Are?) secured in fixtures. The executioners do pull the trigger, but the rifles are not shouldered or aimed by them. Recoil is a non factor.
My best friend's dad designed the system. He was in law enforcement all of his life. He assisted in the capture of Lee Harvey Oswald. When he died he was a U.S. Marshall Emeritus.

 

[Ivan the Butcher]

Thank you everyone for correcting what happened to Gary Gilmore.

My personal belief is that executions should be in daylight and televised, (nobody is forced to watch) then they stand a chance of being preventive. As they are now, they are only therapeutic to the very few witnesses.

Ivan

 

[GaryS]

It will not happen as long as prosecutors charge people who defend themselves with murder. I know it's not all, maybe not even most areas, however there are a significant number that do.

I continue to wonder just how much longer it might be until Americans stop calling 9-1-1 for police response and simply start calling the Sanitation Department for removal of the rotting corpses on the streets and sidewalks.

 

[sigp220.45]

Movie was called Skidmore Bully I remember watching it...I was amazed at the shootout scene when those good folks pulled up and started pulling guns out of everywhere.

The Brian Denehy movie was In Broad Daylight.

In Broad Daylight (1991 film - Wikipedia)

The was a documentary called No One Saw A Thing.

]Bad title - Wikipedia

They took another bite at the apple in 2005 with Without Mercy.

Without Mercy (2005) - IMDb

And since Skidmore is now in the national consciousness, a completely fictional movie about a child abduction, Below The Fold, 2021, is set there:

Below the Fold - Rotten Tomatoes

 

[LoboGunLeather]

It will not happen as long as prosecutors charge people who defend themselves with murder. I know it's not all, maybe not even most areas, however there are a significant number that do.

I agree, but this overlooks a central point of my post: Prosecutors can only bring charges when there is evidence amounting to probable cause, which is impossible to do without cooperative witnesses.

The current trends of defunding, no bail, no prosecution, no prisons, and so forth might just result in a return of the old "vigilance committees" delivering extra-judicial punishments.

As was seen in Skidmore, Missouri the best investigators and the finest prosecutors cannot accomplish anything when the general public refuses to cooperate, give statements, appear as witnesses.

 

[steelslaver]

I remember when in my early 30s (early 1980s)being in Idaho and seeing an ad in a paper's help wanted section for an experienced hangman. I figured those guys were fairly scarce.

 

[357larry]

I have long held the opinion that the death penalty needs to be used a lot more than it currently is (the Carr brothers, Wichita, Kansas are a prime example). With the drug companies refusing to sell the drugs used for lethal injection to States, bring back hanging, the electric chair and the gas chamber.

I also hold the opinion that executions should be public in broad daylight. To get the most positive effect from executions, make it a requirement to view one up close before a person can graduate from High School. It makes me wonder how many low-life gang bangers would have turned their lives around if forced to do so.

 

[len917]

Thank you everyone for correcting what happened to Gary Gilmore.

My personal belief is that executions should be in daylight and televised, (nobody is forced to watch) then they stand a chance of being preventive. As they are now, they are only therapeutic to the very few witnesses.

Ivan

Maybe I would be able to record it and watch it whenever I want to. Maybe ROKU will pick it up as a freebee. Can't wait

 

[len917]

I have long held the opinion that the death penalty needs to be used a lot more than it currently is (the Carr brothers, Wichita, Kansas are a prime example). With the drug companies refusing to sell the drugs used for lethal injection to States, bring back hanging, the electric chair and the gas chamber.

I also hold the opinion that executions should be public in broad daylight. To get the most positive effect from executions, make it a requirement to view one up close before a person can graduate from High School. It makes me wonder how many low-life gang bangers would have turned their lives around if forced to do so.

The low-life gang bangers don't go to high school.

 

[lawandorder]

The Wichita Massacre and the unspeakable torture murders of the young couple in Knoxville should not have any of the criminals convicted of these crimes still alive.

If ever the death penalty was justified these 2 cases are the perfect examples.

Horrific!

 

[Muley Gil]

Back in my college days, I took a political science class from a very liberal professor. One day we were discussing the execution of a Saudi who had killed his uncle, King Faisal. The prof was all upset about the death penalty being imposed on the nephew, crying out, "What good did this do?"

Me, with my usual tact, hollered out "He won't kill anybody else!" The class roared in support, much to the displeasure of the professor.

By the way, Alabama's electric chair was built by an inmate in the 1920s and painted yellow, using paint from the Highway Department. The chair was known as Yellow Mama or Big Yellow Mama.

 

[charlie sherrill]

One of the disadvantages of an editic memory is I remember strange unrelated stuff I have read or heard.

Back in the early '70's NZ had a couple of weekly tabloids who liked to run lurid stories every few months on the death penalty in the US. (they were liberal rags who were not in favour of a death penalty and we had a very popular liberal government at the time, which only lasted one 3 year term, almost unheard of here). I remember the headline of one story reading "Old Sparky Still Going Strong" about a test of the electric chair in one penitentiary. I can still remember the basis of some of the stories written.

About 1972 the SCOTUS ruled the death penalty unconstitutional, claiming the electric chair "cruel and inhumane". For the next four years there were no executions in the U.S.

By 1976 the murder rate across America had risen horribly, especially among police and crime victims. The reasoning went like this:

"If I get caught for this I'm going to jail for a long time. If this victim/police officer lives then the chances of my getting caught increase.

If I kill him I can possibly get away as there is no witness against me. Even if I do get caught I won't be executed, I will just go to jail for a long time, so I will kill him/her and hopefully get away".

In 1976 SCOTUS reversed their decision, While the chair was no longer in favour, lethal injection took its place, with the firing squad being used in Utah for one convicted person in late '76. Over the next few years the murder rates dropped back to per '72 levels.

Just a bit of trivia I bring up when someone says the death penalty does not deter crime.

Death penalty eliminates recidivism. The problem is that it usually takes over 20 years for the sentence to be carried out. At least they usually can't get out and continue their crimes.

 

[wood714]

The low-life gang bangers don't go to high school.

From what I heard on a radio station today, the ones in Cali will never have to worry about being put to death anymore.

Their really buckling down on crime out there. {sarcasm}

California moves to dismantle US's largest death row | Death Penalty News | Al Jazeera