I can definitely see how branching into different calibers has diluted Jerry Miculek's skills.
stepping in to help a customer in Gun Store
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I can definitely see how branching into different calibers has diluted Jerry Miculek's skills.
m&p2.0fdethumbsafety
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most people will never attain a fraction of miculek's skills, plus he started very early. for the typical person who started shooting in adulthood, sticking with one caliber is sensible.
BLACKHAWKNJ
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Again, I think counter/sales help, as opposed to a cashier, should know their merchandise. Doesn't take that much effort to read up on ammunition, know the older calibers like 38 S&W that are out of fashion but still have some demand, learn about the newer ones.
Caliber of round has very little to do with ability to shoot accurately at normal ranges. Recoil matters true, but once you master guns with real recoil going down in recoil is not problem. That changes some when you start to change to longer ranges to some degree because of ballistics. Not the mechanics of the weapon. Going from one style of gun to another is harder than a caliber change. I have Smiths from I frame to X frame from 22 lr to 500 mag, They all function the same, have close to same sighting system, triggers etc. Weight and size varies some. But, if I hold the gun steady, sight correctly and squeeze correctly the all hit what I aim at no mater which caliber.
A guy that learns to handle a 44mag will be able to handle a 22lr
Sticking to one caliber will limit the growth of your shooting abilities and your fun.
A guy that learns to handle a 44mag will be able to handle a 22lr
Sticking to one caliber will limit the growth of your shooting abilities and your fun.
Keeping my mouth shut has never been my way, particularly when intervention is clearly needed.
The amount of stupid I have overheard at gun shops would fill a book.
Case in point, I went to a well known shop and while looking at the ammo behind the counter(the Federal 327 Magnum I wanted) asked for a box of 327 magnum.. the clerk said " you mean 357 Magnum".. No I mean 327 Magnum (I was literally looking at the stack of ammo). He went on to argue that I was mistaken and there is no such thing as 327 Magnum, and I needed 357 magnum....
Case in point, I went to a well known shop and while looking at the ammo behind the counter(the Federal 327 Magnum I wanted) asked for a box of 327 magnum.. the clerk said " you mean 357 Magnum".. No I mean 327 Magnum (I was literally looking at the stack of ammo). He went on to argue that I was mistaken and there is no such thing as 327 Magnum, and I needed 357 magnum....
The Last Standing Knight
Member
I have done similiar on several different occassions. I will recount this one that happened a while back. I was working evening shift and was in uniform. I stopped by a local gunstore. A couple was handgun shopping due to "recent events in our city" . Neither the husband or wife were gun people. Clerk tried to sell the lady a full sized RIA M1911 in 45ACP. She was a tiny thing and could barely pick it up. The husband asked what I thought. I told them exactly what the clerk didn't want to hear. When I left, they were looking at Ruger LCP's.
Gunstore people are out to make a sale like any other business. Unfortunately most I have ran across couldn't tell you the difference between a C96 Mauser and a Smith and Wesson Model 10!
Gunstore people are out to make a sale like any other business. Unfortunately most I have ran across couldn't tell you the difference between a C96 Mauser and a Smith and Wesson Model 10!
The Last Standing Knight
Member
Ever been in a rural gunstore when an old farmer walks in with a single cartridge, hands it to the guy behind the counter and says "Gimme a box of these". I think we all have at one time or another. I had an uncle like that....did it with a .22 LR.
Countrycuz
Member
I once scored a deal on some.375 Win rifle ammo. It had been on the shelf awhile, someone had ordered it by mistake instead of.357 Mag.
I’m a big believer that we as a gun owning and carrying community are all better off if we create new happy, satisfied first time gun owners. That generally requires the prospective new gun owner end up with a gun that actually needs their needs.
In that regard I have intervened in the past when said new gun owner describes a well thought out need and a gun store staff person then tries to sell or up sell something that doesn’t meet that need at all, when there are much better options available right there in the store.
It can usually be done tactfully by striking up a conversation with the prospective new gun owner, who usually already has red flags waving in his or her brain as what they are being sold feels a bit off to them. Once my opinion is invited, who am I to refuse?
From that point it’s a process of not directly contradicting the store staff but rather getting the person state their requirements, and preferences, and asking some cla,rifling questions, the answers to which then lead to some different gun options.
In many cases, I’ve had the store staff themselves start asking me questions about the pros and cons of various of handgun options for different niches.
In both cases the development of understanding and insight (learning) is all about ensuring they maintain a good self image to keep them receptive to new perceptions and understanding. That means avoiding making them feel threatened or incompetent.
If I can see the opportunity to do that, I don’t have any qualms about stepping into “someone else’s business” as by the end of the process it’s a win win for both parties.
In the shop I frequent the most the sales staff will invite my comments as they know my approach works to cement a sale with an uncertain first time buyer because I identify their needs and motivations in a very positive way and match them with a handgun that meets their needs and ensures they leave the store as a happy customer who had a good experience.
I also have staff ask my opinion on guns and gun related topics, such as why I do the things I do when inspecting a revolver. How to inspect a revolver won’t something that is really taught any more and knowing what to do and why makes that staff person better at inspecting a used revolver coming in, or identifying an issue in a new revolver being purchased or placed on the sales floor. If you show some enthusiasm for their nterst in revolvers and don’t talk down to them they also come away having a positive experience.
In that regard I have intervened in the past when said new gun owner describes a well thought out need and a gun store staff person then tries to sell or up sell something that doesn’t meet that need at all, when there are much better options available right there in the store.
It can usually be done tactfully by striking up a conversation with the prospective new gun owner, who usually already has red flags waving in his or her brain as what they are being sold feels a bit off to them. Once my opinion is invited, who am I to refuse?
From that point it’s a process of not directly contradicting the store staff but rather getting the person state their requirements, and preferences, and asking some cla,rifling questions, the answers to which then lead to some different gun options.
In many cases, I’ve had the store staff themselves start asking me questions about the pros and cons of various of handgun options for different niches.
In both cases the development of understanding and insight (learning) is all about ensuring they maintain a good self image to keep them receptive to new perceptions and understanding. That means avoiding making them feel threatened or incompetent.
If I can see the opportunity to do that, I don’t have any qualms about stepping into “someone else’s business” as by the end of the process it’s a win win for both parties.
In the shop I frequent the most the sales staff will invite my comments as they know my approach works to cement a sale with an uncertain first time buyer because I identify their needs and motivations in a very positive way and match them with a handgun that meets their needs and ensures they leave the store as a happy customer who had a good experience.
I also have staff ask my opinion on guns and gun related topics, such as why I do the things I do when inspecting a revolver. How to inspect a revolver won’t something that is really taught any more and knowing what to do and why makes that staff person better at inspecting a used revolver coming in, or identifying an issue in a new revolver being purchased or placed on the sales floor. If you show some enthusiasm for their nterst in revolvers and don’t talk down to them they also come away having a positive experience.
good luck with that
Inusuit
Member
New clerk at my LGS handed me a box of .38 Special +P when I asked for .38 Super. The manager jumped right in and corrected him. And they did have .38 Super.
You can't expect every clerk in a gun store to know everything. You can expect them to learn about what they are selling. You would think management would explain the importance of selling the correct ammo to new employees. But, to me it is even more interesting that a gun owner has as little clue as the clerk and that happens all the time.
There is a lot to know and ammo can be confusing. Look at all the 38 Rounds. 38 S&W, 38 special, 38 super plus the long and short colt, the acp etc
Then there are several 9mms
357 mag, max and sig
rifles can be ever worse. Look at all the 7mms and 30 cals now days. mags short mags etc.
There is a lot to know and ammo can be confusing. Look at all the 38 Rounds. 38 S&W, 38 special, 38 super plus the long and short colt, the acp etc
Then there are several 9mms
357 mag, max and sig
rifles can be ever worse. Look at all the 7mms and 30 cals now days. mags short mags etc.
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Just a few months ago, a local Sportsman's Warehouse had SEVEN 20rd boxes of .22 Remington Jet.
So, you people that are talking about the store's liability for that customer buying the wrong ammunition and lawsuits and all that. do you not think that the store's legal department has already thought through that?
Do you not think that there are signs up all over the gun department letting you know that they're not accountable because you don't know what kind of bullets go in your gun?
Do you not think that there are signs up all over the gun department letting you know that they're not accountable because you don't know what kind of bullets go in your gun?
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I was at the gun counter at Academy one day . A woman was shopping for a handgun accompanied by a friend . The clown behind the counter told her that she MUST lock up her gun in her home . Told her that it was FEDERAL LAW . If it was stolen she would be liable for any crimes committed .
prairieviper
Member
Like others have already commented, I too, normally mind my own business but, in this case, I would have said something as well.
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