Why would I want a hybrid car?

[biku324]

Truth resists propaganda. Which is just about everything that comes out of a .gov. The information you use is put out by agencies that have the task of getting everyone to comply with an agenda. There are many, many caveats in the "facts" that they want us to believe.

I hate to bring facts into an otherwise good argument, but I watched the named 2.2 gig wind farm go in at Corona/Duran, NM, a few miles from my house. It was both under budget and ahead of schedule; several guys from my little town got good jobs during construction.

Well-run companies pay attention. This one studied wind patterns, availability of BLM land, access to a major highway, nearby major grid lines, and access to a major railway. The only roads they had to build for the huge farm were stabilized-base gravel; most towers and components came in by rail - the cars were parked on a siding built for the project, offloaded onto trucks, and the trucks had only to cross US 54, never travel on it.

But it's probably really a CIA hologram.

Incidentally, there's a 3 gigawatt farm in the same area coming soon. That's a 1 gig net gain after the shutdown of the Four Corners coal-fired 4 gig powerplant (Farmington, NM) that was so dirty you could see it from space. At long last, 'transformational' SunZia project breaks ground in Corona, New Mexico | Business | abqjournal.com

 

[Telecaster]

Here's why: No one cares what kind of car you buy. Really, no one cares. The problem is that they are trying to make me buy the same car that you have and I don't want it. They are also taking resources that I provide, in the form of taxes and higher costs, to pay for systems that address problems that are mostly contrived. In the mean time, they are creating a false industry that does nothing but create wealth for insiders and corporate donors. If you want to buy into that, knock yourself out. But you have to question why they need to mandate certain things or pay people to get consumers to go along with it. If it's so great, so important to our future, why to they have to throw money at it to get people to go along with it? "Buy what you want." you post. Absolutely! But in about ten years, no one will be able to because selling a fossil fuel car or installing a gas stove in my house will be illegal. THAT'S what is getting people upset about this whole EV scam. No one cares what you buy.

That’s how I see it, too. Many car makers only offer upper trim levels in hybrid powertrains, so if you want the good stereo and AWD you’re stuck with a hybrid. Why? CAFE standards.

In some cases, that’s not all bad, because most buyers won’t keep a car long enough for the expensive hybrid battery to need replacing. If I get a hybrid it’ll be a Toyota, since they seem to have the longest lasting systems. But I’d rather have a V6 4Runner, because I like the vehicle, it will do everything I’ll ever want, and is reputed to be the longest lasting and most reliable vehicle ever. It’s just painful to cough up $45-50 Gs for one. It will need to last from my retirement till I die, so it’s an investment.

 

[Onomea]

I am, continually, astounded by the BS that people believe.

(Surely, everyone agrees with that statement.)

 

[cmj8591]

I hate to bring facts into an otherwise good argument, but I watched the named 2.2 gig wind farm go in at Corona/Duran, NM, a few miles from my house. It was both under budget and ahead of schedule; several guys from my little town got good jobs during construction.

Well-run companies pay attention. This one studied wind patterns, availability of BLM land, access to a major highway, nearby major grid lines, and access to a major railway. The only roads they had to build for the huge farm were stabilized-base gravel; most towers and components came in by rail - the cars were parked on a siding built for the project, offloaded onto trucks, and the trucks had only to cross US 54, never travel on it.

But it's probably really a CIA hologram.

Incidentally, there's a 3 gigawatt farm in the same area coming soon. That's a 1 gig net gain after the shutdown of the Four Corners coal-fired 4 gig powerplant (Farmington, NM) that was so dirty you could see it from space. At long last, 'transformational' SunZia project breaks ground in Corona, New Mexico | Business | abqjournal.com

Can you tell me when those wind mills will become carbon neutral? And what is the difference between the cost of a kwh from those wind mills and a kwh from, say, gas fired generation? Where does the electricity come from when the wind isn't blowing?

 

[biku324]

I object - argumentative.

Belief resists information.

 

[deadin]

It’s not a religious belief

But it seems that alot of things are becoming one....

I'm beginning to wonder if, deep down, some of these folks secretly want an EV, but don't want to be associated with "that" crowd.....

 

[Secundius]

Truth resists propaganda. Which is just about everything that comes out of a .gov. The information you use is put out by agencies that have the task of getting everyone to comply with an agenda. There are many, many caveats in the "facts" that they want us to believe.

Propaganda right! So the fact before 1999 approximately 9.6-million Fords, mostly F-Series pickup trucks were recalled for catching fire and NOT being Hybrids is also “Propaganda”…


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[cmj8591]

I object - argumentative.

Belief resists information.

So, give me some information. Those should be easy questions to answer.

 

[biku324]

Probably not. Suddenly those wouldn't be important and there would be different questions that really aren't a quest for information.

Do some investigating - do a carbon footprint comparison between building 5 GW of new coal-fired or gas-fired generation plants versus the 5 Gigs in Corona. Add nuclear just for fun.

People are busy building the future. Good for them.

 

[BC38]

Belief resists information. U.S. Energy Information Administration - EIA - Independent Statistics and Analysis Attention Required! | Cloudflare This last project was completed and selling power more than a year ahead of schedule. And the cows using that land still use it.

Yes it does. I asked you for facts to support your BELIEF and so far you haven't provided them. Why? Because someone might be able to refute your facts (or something)? That is about the lamest non-answer ever. "I'll not cite facts, because you might not agree with them". Seriously? OK...

I read your article. Lots of info about where NM gets its energy and the relative amounts of energy derived from each sector. In the electricity segment, the article talked a lot about more power generated from green sources, less generated by coal, more generated by NG, etc. etc. Quite interesting, but I didn't see anywhere that it said anything about OVERALL increases in electrical generation, vs OVERALL growth in demand. Can you please point me to where I missed that in your article? Or are you still misunderstanding (or unable to answer) my REAL question?

BTW, focusing just on NM is a very myopic and limited view. We're talking about EV mandates across the COUNTRY. Not just in your little neighborhood (state). Especially since - as your article points out - NM has the sixth LOWEST population density of the 50 states. In case you weren't aware, population density is a BIG factor, BTW. NM isn't experiencing brownouts and rolling blackouts - those problems are in high density areas.

This is all especially pertinent in light of your previous point about power transmission being one of the biggest issues to be addressed. That is THE GRID we're talking about, and it isn't up to the job and isn't going to be up to the job in the next 10 years when these mandates are expected to be fully implemented.

It just ain't gonna happen.

It's taken us 100 years to get our power generation and distribution grid to where it is now - and it is already inadequate and unreliable in many areas. But somehow we're going to increase that generation and transmission to 3x or 4x it's current capacity in just 10 years? Talk about a pipe dream!

For some people, belief truly does resist information, and even common sense.

 

[biku324]

And a Happy New Year! With any luck it will be better for all.

 

[BC38]

We have figured out electric motors. They work well, they’re clean, they deliver immediate energy, and they don’t need a transmission. We still haven’t figured out batteries to the same degree. But it’ll happen.

I retired, and my retirement present to myself was a new car. I looked at the Toyota RAV4 Hybrid. But I ended up buying the Toyota EV, all wheel drive, made in conjunction with Subaru. It looks a lot like a RAV4. The biggest weakness is the battery. Each electric car manufacturer deals with battery issues a little differently. Toyota optimizes battery life. Other companies optimize charging speed and capacity. I can probably do a 200 mile trip without recharging, which is adequate for 95+% of my driving. But I haven’t tried a cross-country trip yet. Without going into detail, it’s a really nice car. Toyota builds good cars.

I understand why a lot of people do not want to buy an electric vehicle. Some of the reasons are very practical, such as range limitation. But I don’t understand why some people get so emotionally involved that they don’t want anyone else to buy an electric vehicle, either. It’s not a religious belief. It’s just a car. Buy the one you want.

I agree completely. Unfortunately the government doesn't.
They are passing mandates to FORCE everyone to buy an EV by eliminating other choices.
I'm not trying to argue nobody should buy an EV. If that's what you want, more power to you.
What I am arguing is the the government should not be FORCING us ALL to buy EVs by mandating the phase-out of ICE vehicles.

 

[BC38]

I hate to bring facts into an otherwise good argument, but I watched the named 2.2 gig wind farm go in at Corona/Duran, NM, a few miles from my house. It was both under budget and ahead of schedule; several guys from my little town got good jobs during construction.

Well-run companies pay attention. This one studied wind patterns, availability of BLM land, access to a major highway, nearby major grid lines, and access to a major railway. The only roads they had to build for the huge farm were stabilized-base gravel; most towers and components came in by rail - the cars were parked on a siding built for the project, offloaded onto trucks, and the trucks had only to cross US 54, never travel on it.

But it's probably really a CIA hologram.

Incidentally, there's a 3 gigawatt farm in the same area coming soon. That's a 1 gig net gain after the shutdown of the Four Corners coal-fired 4 gig powerplant (Farmington, NM) that was so dirty you could see it from space. At long last, 'transformational' SunZia project breaks ground in Corona, New Mexico | Business | abqjournal.com

That's all well and good - 5.2 GW more green power! YAY! But at the same time they eliminated 4GW of power generated by coal. So the net increase is 1.2GW (assuming no other generation increases or decreases) - about a 25% overall increase.
And how long did it take to complete those two projects? 3 years (8% increase per year)? 5 years (5% increase per year)?
How many more of those projects will they complete in the next 10 years? Enough to increase the overall power generation and distribution capacity to 3 or 4 times what it is today?
Those are the questions I've been asking and you've been dodging and deflecting rather than answering.

 

[cmj8591]

And a Happy New Year! With any luck it will be better for all.

Happy new year to you also. Hopefully in 2024 my National Grid electric bill will go down, considering it's gone up about 125% in the last year and a half (35% of which is to pay Cape Wind for all those useless windmills in Nantucket Sound.) but I won't hold my breath.

 

[BC38]

Happy new year to you also. Hopefully in 2024 my National Grid electric bill will go down, considering it's gone up about 125% in the last year and a half (35% of which is to pay Cape Wind for all those useless windmills in Nantucket Sound.) but I won't hold my breath.

Real world data/experience trumps what some people want to "believe" (but can't substantiate) every time.

"Belief resists information".

 

[noonster]

Wind farm: I’ve seen nobody address the following: wind blows, turns generators. Turning gens uses energy, slows down the wind, so what happens environmentally down wind of the farms? And you can’t convince me it does not have effect if you can’t give me a real number for how much slow down there is. That wind is part of the environmental matrix on this planet. One guy can’t smoke a cigarette without effect in a football stadium, so that wind decrease may just have a negative effect.

 

[Rustyt1953]

^^^^

 

[Rustyt1953]

A lot of that unused wind ends up inside the beltway.

 

[Oldengineer]

Here's why: No one cares what kind of car you buy. Really, no one cares. The problem is that they are trying to make me buy the same car that you have and I don't want it. They are also taking resources that I provide, in the form of taxes and higher costs, to pay for systems that address problems that are mostly contrived. In the mean time, they are creating a false industry that does nothing but create wealth for insiders and corporate donors. If you want to buy into that, knock yourself out. But you have to question why they need to mandate certain things or pay people to get consumers to go along with it. If it's so great, so important to our future, why to they have to throw money at it to get people to go along with it? "Buy what you want." you post. Absolutely! But in about ten years, no one will be able to because selling a fossil fuel car or installing a gas stove in my house will be illegal. THAT'S what is getting people upset about this whole EV scam. No one cares what you buy.

2023 was the hottest year in recorded history.Reminds me of the parable of the boiled frog.

 

[BC38]

2023 was the hottest year in recorded history.Reminds me of the parable of the boiled frog.

Just curious but what is the period of "recorded history" for worldwide temperatures? 100 years? 200 years? How long have we been keeping detailed precise records on temperatures around the globe?