Significant leading after very few rounds?

[Kyler Hamann]

Apparently I leaded the holy-snot out of my .500 last year. Since I almost exclusively shoot jacketed and all copper bullets in that gun - and I haven’t shot hardly any lead bullets out of it - therefore it took a long time to dawn on me that it was leaded up. I guess I didn’t notice when it happened, but the accuracy was horrific compared to the previous life of the gun. I kept thinking my red dot couldn’t handle the recoil - or maybe the nut behind stocks wasn’t handling the recoil as well as I used to.
Finally I bothered to thoroughly clean it (what a pain)… got out a ton of lead - and the groups went back to being really good at 50 yards with all my jacketed and all copper bullet loads.
Even stranger, the few non-coated lead bullets that I shot, only numbering a dozen or so total bullets, were LazerCast. I thought those were supposed to be really hard and not likely to lead?
I also shot a few, again a dozen or less, Hy Tek coated Missouri bullets, but tried to be careful not to damage the coating and have shot thousands of coated bullets in other calibers with no issues.
None of these loads were on the hotter/faster end of the data.
The only reloading “sin” I can think I might have committed is that on a few rounds I tinkered with minimal (published) Trail Boss loads. Could that have been too slow for the bullets to seal and cause significant leading with so few rounds?
Or could the LazerCast bullets have been the wrong size for my bore and that caused the leading (even with so few bullets fired)?
Getting all that lead out was not a good time... so I don't plan to experiment with the above combo's to try to isolate the cause.
Anybody lead something up with so few lead rounds?
Thanks,
Kyler

 

[pangris]

Montana X-Treme Bore Conditioner - 6 oz | MONTANA X-TREME

I'd try this once you have it clean -

 

[rwsmith]

Are you sure.....

...that it isn't 'coppered up'? If you've shot almost all jacketed or copper bullets I'd kinda doubt that it is lead. I'm pretty sure there is a cleaning compound for copper fouling, but I've never tried it.

Oh, the bullets you are using might be a poor fit which would account for the fouling. Maybe do a bore cast and change bullets to fit.

 

[mikld]

FWIW; Probably the one most important fact to clean shooting nekkid lead is bullet to gun fit. The first thing I do with a new to me gun is slug the barrel and revolvers, measure the cylinder throats. Making sure the throats are larger than groove diameter, I start with sizing bullets to the same diameter as the cylinder throats. 90+% of the time this alone reduces/eliminates barrel leading...

 

[stansdds]

With hard cast lead bullets, you can have leading if the pressure is insufficient to make the bullet fully seal the bore. Gasses escaping around the sides of the bullet will melt the lube and lead. Undersized bullets suffer from the same issue with gasses getting past the base of the bullet.

 

[mtgianni]

Your brand of bullets is also known to have some of the hardest lube ever. It keeps them looking nice in shipping and handling but isn't the best in keeping the barrel lubed as the bullet moves through it. In general, lead in the barrel throat is improperly sized bullets and lead at the muzzle, or latter 1/3 is lack of lube. Hardness in bullets and lubes is often not your friend. It does however, prevent casting companies from returns due to damage in shipping.

 

[IAM Rand]

I cast my own and in the process, I use powder coating. This is for my 460 mag. No leading problems. You may want to get hard cast bullets or alternate jacketed bullets in between your lead cast.

 

[rockquarry]

A bullet that fits and is of the right alloy for the load will shoot as accurately or better than jacketed bullets and won't lead the bore. "Hard cast" bullets are seldom necessary or advantageous and will often lead badly, but many today like to use the term even when they don't really understand it.

As with cast rifle bullets, the softest bullet for the pressure/velocity range desired that doesn't lead the bore will usually be the most accurate. If you cast your own this will take some experimentation. If you buy commercial cast bullets this will be more of a problem.

 

[gwpercle]

An undersized bullet will lead up a barrel in just a few shots .

Match the hardness to the load pressure developed .

And make sure of bore size and size bullets .001"-.002" over bore size .

Make sure barrel is smooth ... Barrels rifled by the EDM (Electrical Discharge Machining) process , S&W uses / used this method , is microscopicaly rough edged and will lead up even with the right alloy and the right size ... EDM rifled barrels must be lapped smoothed ... or they lead badly !
Some shooters Fire Lap these bores with bullets coated in abrasives ...search the term Fire Lapping Gun Barrel .
Gary

 

[mikld]

Harder is not better. I have been casting and shooting bullets for approx 30 years. Most of my bullet alloy runs 11-12 BHN, with occasional Lyman #2, 15 BHN. This has served me well for my handguns from 32 ACP up to 45 Colt including 357 and 44 Magnums. Most of my magnum loads 3/4 to near max., and leading was minimal or none. All bullets were sized to fit the gun...

 

[3rdgeargrndrr]

Try and see if gas checks solves your issue

 

[ggibson511960]

When I was young, inexperienced at reloading, and dumber than I am now, I bought a nice box of Speer lead bullets to launch from my .357 Ruger Blackhawk at what I thought were O.K. low velocities. Not. The end of the barrel grew the prettiest flower petal sculpture you've ever seen. The petals were chevron shaped lead knives curling from each groove. I daresay most reloaders have committed this type of boner. Harmless unless you persist with hot loads and high pressures. These guns we play with have reasonable safety margins to protect us.

 

[rockquarry]

When I was young, inexperienced at reloading, and dumber than I am now, I bought a nice box of Speer lead bullets to launch from my .357 Ruger Blackhawk at what I thought were O.K. low velocities. Not. The end of the barrel grew the prettiest flower petal sculpture you've ever seen. The petals were chevron shaped lead knives curling from each groove. I daresay most reloaders have committed this type of boner. Harmless unless you persist with hot loads and high pressures. These guns we play with have reasonable safety margins to protect us.

Those Speer lead bullets were likely swaged from lead wire that wasn't much harder than pure lead. They're fine if they fit and you keep velocities low. When we speak of "soft" bullets here, we are generally speaking of bullets a good bit harder than swaged, maybe around 10-12 BHN; a useful hardness for most purposes.

 

[Kyler Hamann]

Thanks for the info. These were gas checked, but I'll bet it was too low of pressure (tinkering with a few Trail Boss loads) and/or bullets being the wrong size for the bore.
I've been shooting cast bullets for over 40 years, so it just surprised me that it could lead to that degree with so few shots.
Either way, in that gun I'm going to stick to my stockpile of jacketed, pure copper and Hi Tek coated bullets instead of those that caused issues.

 

[WR Moore]

FWIW, way back when, I noticed that most 1911 barrels in .45 ACP needed at least 200 rounds of jacketed bullets to smooth them out. After fitting a Bar-Sto barrel, I needed 400 or so rounds.

Given your history with jacketed slugs, that isn't your issue. However, you might want to try some JB bore cleaning paste to your barrel and see if there's anything else in there.

 

[SGT ROCK 11B]

Anybody lead something up with so few lead rounds?
Thanks,
Kyler

Kyler, I never had a problem with leading but I was only doing 357 Magnum and 44 Magnum. If I was loading any bullet without a Gas Check I would keep the velocity down to 950 fps +/-.

The others had some excellent comments.

 

[venomballistics]

I've had a few loads do me this honor, but not many.
The lee 208 grain wad cutter. I had a love hate relationship with this bullet.
It ran with Bullseye, and nothing else. Even then, only to about 850 FPS.
I suppose this was a down payment on understanding the thought process of Elmer Keith.
It was an accurate and easy shooting load, but that was it, and all you could strangle out of that bullet. Any faster and it'd start leading up. Past 1100 it'd start to keyhole.
Any other powder and you have a date with a bore brush. Not for field nor street .... next contestant.
Lee 215 grain SWC ....
similar story ... Unique and nothing else. The advent of coatings would redeem this bullet later, but it started life as a slightly more useful one trick pony.
In either case, deviation from their holy writ would result in a long night with a bore brush.
Your lasercast bullet likely has some similar butterzone where it'll kinda work.
if you feel its worth a bit of effort, boil them in a pot of water to melt the lube off of them.
Next ... swing by a harbor freight for some powder coating.
Find a cheap toaster oven and some acetone.
mix a little powder coating with the acetone to make a slurry. shake the cleaned bullets in said concoction. let dry and bake as 400 for 15 minutes.